First mauling of the year

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From my experience, 70' is too close for 90% of wild animals not to mention one as powerful as a bear. But to say that someone deserved it or that it was justice is not something I would ever pass judgement on (except Grizzly Man).

Everyone makes mistakes and undoubtedly not all bears or humans die of old age. I would put it more like... the consequences of participating in dangerous activities are not always desirable. Hopefully Wes Perkins (the photo guy participating in hunting large dangerous wild game) has another chance to continue his life and perhaps hunt or take photo ops more wisely.

As far as a "bear attack" I would have to weigh in on the side that, the phrasing implies that somehow the bear harmed or was aggressive towards someone seemingly without cause.... which we know is not the case. And yes wording does matter and yes public perception does effect policy on hunting, guns and conservation of animals (game, bears, endangered species, etc...). So give the bear a bad rap and you are contributing to negative policy towards wild animals and hunting. Despite what many may think, this is not beneficial for hunters and especially not for conservationists.

I would have changed the news article to call it something different maybe "a Bear hunting incident" but I'm also not trying to sell news articles and "Bear Attack" is ten times more likely to be read and talked about (this thread, case and point).

Anthropomorphism set aside, you wouldn't say someone sticking up for themselves attacked a bully. You'd say the bully had it coming. Why would you say a bear attacked someone participating in a hunt when we know it was trying to save it's own life? Just because it's (the bear) not a human and being hunted doesn't mean it should be demonized.

I hunt. I respect my game. If it attacked me, I'd say.... I had it comin'!
 
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"Deservin' got nothin' to do with it, 'Lil Bill"..........(Clint to gutshot Gene Hackman on the bar room floor)

Hey, if your gonna Hunt, and I do, its part of the package with Hunting dangerous Game, and in the same hunt,while using a snowgo in the Arctic, you can get dead many other ways too, along with freezing to death, getting lost and falling off cliffs, drownding, crashing, if dying while doing so , it just the way it is.

That man didnt deserve being mauled, nor the Bear to be hunted, its just the way it is......Nature at its best and worst, depending on whos eating who.....and only people get to die in bed.....most of the time,......... everything else out there is eaten while still quite alive.


Difference is, the Man should known better.
 
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Bears do not have a right to self defense.
--Cosmoline

Really?, You think nature intended threatened animal to lie down at your feet and die? The bear has the instict to live, humans invaded its territory, and it felt threatened. I hope the guy recovers and does well, but blame the bear I do not.

It is most ccw holders view that if someone is trying to kill you, you try to kill them first.
 
I would think a bear hunter would know the dangers. I've hunted hogs with knives, chase 'em with dogs. I know one guy with a scar across his belly from his belly button to his left nipple from that activity. You do it BECAUSE there's danger, man! Sometimes stuff just happens is all. I'm too old for chasing hogs at night through rice fields anymore, though. I'll shoot from a stand, elevated stand. :D Bear? Well, Alaska is a few hours drive north of me. Not on my radar. And, well, black bears ain't the same thing.
 
wound or startle a Black Bear? you can end up just as dead as if was a Grizzly,

actually Black bear fatal attacks on humans far outnumber fatal grizzly attacks in Canada,

being more habituated to humans, makes Black Bears very dangerous !, add to that there are lots of them,

most fatal attacks are from smaller younger black bears, in most cases,,,
 
Blacks are big coons. :D Oh, yeah, I'm cautious around 'em, but I don't get silly about 'em. Hiked in black bear country all my life and have seen 'em while hiking. Most of the time, I was unarmed. They aren't as populous nor as big in New Mexico, though, as up north. Just not an animal I worry a whole lot about.
 
a black bear,in a popular campsite and recreational area, unprovoked, attacked and killed 3 adults near the BC/Yukon border a few years back, the average size black bear(about350 pounds) also attacked other persons nearby, trying to lend assistance, eventually a passer by, came forward with a rifle and killed the marauding bear,
this was a (predatory attack) the bear consumed parts of the persons immediately, even-though several brave persons armed only with sticks clubbed the bear, it continued to kill and Mame,
do not underestimate a black bear, it may be your last and most fatal error,,,
 
Really?, You think nature intended threatened animal to lie down at your feet and die? The bear has the instict to live, humans invaded its territory, and it felt threatened. I hope the guy recovers and does well, but blame the bear I do not.

Blame is also a non-sequitur. You may or may not fault the hunter's methods. I don't think we know enough to come to any conclusions about that. But the *bear* has no rights whatsoever including a right to due process or self defense. Conversely, you cannot sue the bear or take it to court for mauling you. Blame, fault, and so on are concepts for the human world not the bear world. This isn't demonizing the animal, it's simply recognizing that it is a wild animal and therefore beyond the reach of these concepts.

Saying the bear attacked the man is not assigning fault to the bear, because you cannot assign fault to the bear. Trying to come up with some neutral term like "a bear incident" is just silly. The bear ATTACKED him. That's a description of the physical events, not of any legal or moral blame. You cannot place legal or moral responsibility on the wild animal.
 
IIRC, the most recent American Hunter had an article on bear attacks. The author pointed out that black bear attacks are much more likely to be predatory than brown/grizzly attacks (which are almost always responses to a perceived threat). Laying down and playing dead when attacked by a black bear is a very dangerous plan.
 
He couldnt just get away and outrun the bear on his snowmachine ?

A brown bear runs 40 mph which is 58 feet per second. The rider was 70 feet away. Obviously, the bear couldn't have attained full speed right away, but even if you double the time, the rider had less than 3 seconds to react.
 
You may or may not fault the hunter's methods.

LOL, I think it is pretty clear that the hunter's methods sucked. He went in too close, too loud, wasn't prepared to shoot, and instead of using the opportunity to make a good short range shot, he hotdogged the event playing counting coup and tried to get a picture of the bear first, up close.

Counting coup is really cool, if you survive unharmed.
 
If that's what happened. But all we have are genuine "bush league" newspaper accounts. The man himself has been unable to speak, literally.

Anyone who's hiked much in this state has probably been at least as close to brown bear at one time or another and never even realized it.
 
a black bear,in a popular campsite and recreational area, unprovoked, attacked and killed 3 adults near the BC/Yukon border a few years back, the average size black bear(about350 pounds) also attacked other persons nearby, trying to lend assistance, eventually a passer by, came forward with a rifle and killed the marauding bear,
this was a (predatory attack) the bear consumed parts of the persons immediately, even-though several brave persons armed only with sticks clubbed the bear, it continued to kill and Mame,

Mmm, well, maybe Canadian black bears like human meat, but I don't recall ever hearing of such a predatory black bear attack in the south or SW USA. Odd. Most of the black bear attacks I've heard about really weren't much of an attack, bears smelling and scrounging for food left in a tent at night or something. Don't sleep with your food. Keep some pepper spray handy, that's always a good thing in bear country. Now that we can carry concealed legally there, I normally carry in national parks. I'd never wanna have to shoot a bear in a national park, though. I'd probably spend the rest of my retirement in a federal prison regardless of the details of the attack. :rolleyes: I carry for the human attackers, could get away with killing a human attacker quicker than killing a bear. Pepper gas seems a far better alternative to that. If I were in a national forest or something, not a park, have spent a lot of time hunting in SE New Mexico in the past, probably be easier to SSS....shoot, shovel, and shut up. I still prefer to allude or use pepper spray to shooting. Avoids conflict with the law.

I have heard of predatory attacks by griz. That idiot, Timothy what's his face, the bear guy that got ate in Alaska, well, they found his body parts in that bear along with his girl friend as I recall. That was a predatory attack without doubt.
 
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Statistically, black bears kill about as many people as brown/grizzly bears in North America. However, you must factor in that there are close to a million black bears and at most only about 30,000 - 40,000 grizzlies (almost all of which are in Alaska and Canada). Roughly, that gives you about 30 blacks to every 1 grizzly, so... that makes black bears 30 times safer than browns, or browns 30 times more dangerous than blacks if you care to look at it that way.
 
Tim treadwells remains were 1/2 eaten. The bear that ate hin was very old and actually described by treadwell as "Old, cantankeous and grumpy" and after being used to having a human around.....conditioned so to say. The pictures I saw showed busted teeth and a scarred up face on the bear, so his hunting option was close by making kiddie shows about Bears....

As well, the Black Bear that ate folks at Laired Hotsprings was used to Humans, and (from what I remeber) they had just Bear proofed the garbage cans in the parking lot, and he too was old, large and hungrey.

Most bear attacks are from Bears with cubs or ones taht know Humans well enough not to fear them.

Suprize is a big factor.

Then again, some folks walk, drive and jog right into their comfort zone and the "Fight or Flight " choice is up to the bear then.

You gotta have good habits in Bear country. Be clean, leave a dog loose (Bears hate Dogs, and Dogs bark) and use a piss fence around your camp. Its a territory marker tha animals know and respect.It works, Ive used it and seen it in action.


A Rifle is the best pistol you can carry.

I use Bear spray on Drunks, Ive often wonderd how it would work on Bears myself, but that Mosin makes me feel alot safer.
 
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Thanks for the perspective, KB. :D I'm not sayin' blacks don't attack people, but I am skeptical of 'em being more predatory than griz. :rolleyes: Never say never, but I just don't recall ever hearing of a predatory attack by a black bear until the instance quoted above. I don't doubt that it happened, though, not saying it didn't. Black bear are omnivores, after all, and do have a taste for meat. AND, they're more familiar with humans where they are common near towns. There really isn't a town anywhere near the areas I've hiked or hunted in New Mexico or west Texas bear country. It's pretty remote out there. There are some areas I've not spent a lot of time in that are more populated like in the Sacramentos, up around Cloudcroft/Ruidoso, but most of my hunting has been done in the Guadalupes, Lincoln NF, and hiking in the same area and down in the Bend, very remote and except for the park camp grounds, not many people.

And, heck, I remember when I was in college, the Wildlife Biology Asso always took a trip down to Saltio, Mexico over christmas break, a problems course credit for it, but it cost money and the year I wanted to do it, I just didn't have the money. They got down there and got attacked by a rabbid racoon, so heck, even a coon can attack a group of people, LOL! They had to fly a medivac out of San Antonio down there to get the bitten students for treatment. It made it all over the national news broadcasts, Walter Chronkite and such. :D Hell, I coulda been a star!

And, then, there was Jimmy Carter that got attacked by the swimming rabbit, but I'll quit while I'm ahead....:D
 
I use Bear spray on Drunks

Haha, that had me actually laughing out loud. Seconds on the piss fence around the campsite too. Seems to work for other nocturnal predators too- of the four toed and soft treaded kind.
 
and I know a guy, deathly scared of bears, brown ones ,black ones, invisible ones,,lol

so he buys himself a solar rechargeable "electric 30,000 volt bear proof fence" sets it up all around his camp when moose hunting,,,,

about midnight he gets restless and goes outside to take a leak, walks a couple steps and lets go,,, pi$$e$$ directly onto his "bear proof electric fence",,,

starts yelling like he was actually being mauled by a bear,,,, we all jumped out of our sleeping bags with guns loaded, when we got the full story from him , most of us near died laughing,,,

he scrapped his fence and moved it back 20 yards the next morning,,,
later that trip a bear ate the seats out of his ARGO 8 wheel ATV, lmao :what:
 
Here is a very interesting dissertation on Black bears written by a man in Ontario, Canada. He lives in and has lived for many years among the Black bears of Ontario. He not only believes in hunting them, but he dispells the "Disney image" of the "cute, cuddly, fuzzy wuzzy Black bears."

http://www.ontarioblackbears.com/#Black Bears are not Monsters

KODIAK BEER - "Keep in mind that these are just the confirmed fatalities. They don't include all the people who just disappear in the woods, and they don't include people injured."

Very true, and the same goes for wolves, regarding that old nonsense by the bunny huggers, "There has never been a wolf attack against a human in North America." Therefore, no need to ever worry about wolves in the outdoors. :what:

L.W.
 
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