Found out my neighbor is a "Fudd"

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ColoradoShooter77 said:
Found out my neighbor is a "Fudd"

This a guy who owns a .308 bolt rifle, a shotgun and a 9mm pistol. That's it. We've done a lot of chatting about guns in general over the last few month's.

His philosophy of the RKBA is far different from mine.
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This surprises you? Have you considered he might've been just as surprised at your "philosophy"?

I wouldn't even think to start "sharing" details with my neighbors about how many firearms I own, what they are or how much ammunition I own for them. Why? Lots of things I don't need (or want) to know about them, too.

I remember when our realtor told us (after eventually learning I was a retired cop) that "everyone has guns" in the general mountain community where we bought our home. Okay. That doesn't mean everyone has to know that I own guns, though. ;)

I rather suspect that one of my neighbors probably owns at least one gun, as he's also a retired cop, but that's not a guaranteed thing. He has a lot of things he likes to talk about when we meet, but guns isn't one of them (nor is it something I'm going to bring up).


Part of life is learning to live among people who might not share your views on all sorts of things. Your neighbor owes you nothing but civility.

He apparently has what he wants and thinks he has a use for. Yet you sneer at his choices even as you complain that he doesn't share your enthusiasm for your choices.

You of course have every right to be thus. It's just been my experience that such a view is neither productive or constructive.
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Absolutely.

BTW, ColoradoShooter77,


ColoradoShooter77 said:
...
I've got a feeling his whole attitude would change if he actually fired an AR-15, I don't care who you are, it puts a grin on your face.
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Maybe, maybe not. I'd not assume how other people may feel just based upon your apparent enjoyment when shooting that one particular type of firearm.

Having worked as a LE firearms instructor, meaning teaching classes for Patrol Rifle (and previously SBR's/SBS's, etc) and periodically qualifying people with them, I've seen many folks who don't "get a grin on their face" when shooting them.

Not a small number of those cops have been hunters, too, and while they enjoy shooting their own rifles for pleasure/hunting pursuits, having to shoot the AR's didn't necessarily put a "grin on their faces". It was just another required skill and task involving agency safety equipment.

Imagine how the number of cops who are both former military and active reserve may not exactly "get a grin" when having to shoot the AR's, either.

Comes to that ...

I own an AR15 (Match HBAR). The thing is that I don't really "enjoy" shooting mine, nor any of the assorted agency-owned rifles/carbines, anymore. I haven't felt that way for some years. Having worked as a LE firearms trainer and an armorer (I've attended 5 AR15/M16 armorer classes), it stopped being "fun", and became "work" some time ago.

Matter of fact, I rather regret not having taken advantage of the last round of panic buying and "run" on AR's. I wish I'd not been lazy and had sold mine (via legal channels, of course) to a storefront/FFL dealer in a neighboring state where the demand was seemingly unquenchable. I'd have taken the money and bought a couple more centerfire lever guns and a 10/22. Maybe another shotgun. :)

Doesn't mean I don't think other folks will necessarily feel the same way, though.

As an instructor and armorer, the things that come to mind when I see someone shooting an AR they (lawfully) own?

Was it built using good quality parts and properly assembled?

Are they familiar with safe usage & manipulation of it, and proper maintenance practices?

Do they use good ammunition and magazines?

Can they safely, properly and effectively shoot it?

I seldom encourage discussing their philosophy for owning it. Some folks just seem to think everyone else finds their reasons and philosophical justifications interesting, though. :neener:
 
CS77:

When are you going to invite him to go with you to the range etc, and try it out?

Our new neighbor just finished a tour flying F-18 Hornets at NAS Lemoore. He now helps run NMPC in Millington TN.
But he grew up in northern CA and because of that, he could turn out to be a Fudd.. Having two small children, he probably won't have time to even discuss hobbies.

About two years ago I worked with a former Marine. But he grew up just outside Chicago and believes that if guns disappeared among law-abiding people, there would be no supply for the criminals in about fifty years. His brother is an Asst. Police Chief, hence the Kool-Aid consumed in that family.
 
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Fastbolt.....to answer your questions:

1) This is a Smith&Wesson M&P sport.....a quality rifle

2) I only use Magpul magazines

3) I read the owners manual front to back before I fired it, since this is my first AR, I wanted to know how it operated without question.

4) After 400 rounds fired, I disassembled it, including taking the bolt apart to clean and lube, although it really wasn't that dirty. I wanted to know how to do it though, so it was a good exercise.

5) I run my reloads, which is quality ammo. I also run Federal XM-193, which I loaded up on during a Cabela's sale.

6) I can print a 4" group off-hand at 50 yards, so yeah, I can shoot it.

This is my first AR, so I'm like a hog in slop.....already put 570 rounds through it in 4 weeks, lol.

The ease of maintenance and modularity of these things is awesome. Buy an upper and a magazine and I can be shooting a multitude of calibers.....pretty sweet. To me, its an absolute freaking blast!
 
The problem with Fudds, is that they only see guns as hunting accessories and with all deference to pro-2A hunters, Hunting and the Second Amendment, though frequently spoken of in the same context are mutually exclusive. You can support the Second Amendment and never hunt (like me). You can hunt and not care about the right to self-defense. Though I have no qualms with it, hunting is a sport, not a right. It has no more constitutional basis than football does. Hunting's legality is borne out of tradition, not natural law (except where basic survivability is concerned... but then it's less about sport anyway).

There is tradition to the Second Amendment too, but that tradition is coupled with Natural Law. Hunting does not have that. When a Fudd looks at guns, they look at them through a different lens. There in lies the problem. They look at guns as either a "necessary evil" for their sport or something that "they" can own, but not everyone else, because "they" are a "professional" or "skilled" athlete.

When a Fudd thinks of gun control, they look at it the same way a Packer's fan looks at a major rule change in the NFL. It's something you complain about but accept because, "it's only a sport."

Natural Law. That's what's missing from the Fudd.
 
buck460XVR said:
IMHO, a Fudd will still support the 2nd Amendment, an anti will not. I don't consider that worse.
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Guess that depends how you define a "Fudd". Since the 2A is primarily about the citizenry being armed and trained like the military, a "Fudd" who sincerely asks "why do you need that AR15?" very likely does not actually support the 2A, even if they think they do.
 
most average gun owners are that way.
a gun here and there, 2 boxes of ammo in a drawer, visit to gun range maybe once every few years and that's it.
and that is fine as long they don't limit me.
off topic:
btw, average people, including gun owners, will not vote for any presidential candidate primarily based on his stand on 2A.
I personally find all that extensive research about candidates' attitude on gun rights a waste of time
 
Better a Fudd than an anti.
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eh....i dunno.....

because a fudd always throws out the " Im a gun owner....and even i dont think people should own assault weapons".....

or " Im a gun owner....and even i support universal background checks"

as if the fact that they own a gun justifies their anti-gun opinions.
 
I've met plenty of Fudds at gun shows, gun stores, ranges, etc. What I've observed is that they are not passionate 2A advocates and don't closely follow 2A issues. They freely regurgitate the same false sound bites and skewed "polls" that make many of us roll our eyes.

Why?

The gun is not the focus of their sport. The thrill of the hunt is. The gun is just like any other piece of their gear; the camo, tree stand or blind, duck calls, doe scent, the butchering afterwards. They rarely if ever have thought or researched the real reasons the founders insisted the people keep and bear arms of military usefulness. And they trust the politicians that "promise" that their hunting rifle or shotgun is not going to be taken away, it's those "evil black rifles" that are the problem.

It's all divide and conquer, plain and simple. And the Fudds have taken the bait.
 
I think many/most gun owners would not give a hoot about any type of firearm they don't own, or are uninterested in, being banned and confiscated by the Government tomorrow morning. Just human nature. I have a neighbor, a veteran, who says he has a few guns, though I've never personally seen one. He doesn't shoot, doesn't go to the range. I have little doubt he'd be perfectly content with any/all guns being banned as long as he could squirrel one away. Referring to AR type rifles as, " Those guns we don't need". I sometimes wonder if folks who really get into black powder, Cowboy shooting, trap and skeet, etc, may believe/hope that whatever evil guns the Government tries to ban next, their particular favorites will still be allowed because they are not Black/Hi-Capacity/easily concealable, "able to shoot down airliners", etc. Many of our fellow gun owners seem not to have any realization of the fact that we are all part of the "Gun Culture" that so many people, politicians, celebrities, etc, etc, want to see completely and totally eradicated in all it's forms.......
 
I have lots of friends and family that just love their AR's and AL's pistols. And even though I don't personally enjoy shooting them, I own an AK, and a few different AL pistols, but I'd much rather spend my day shooting my revolvers and bolt guns. But as far as the freedom to own what we like, I have no issue with those who stock pile 50k rounds of .223 ammo and 20 AR's, more power to them.

GS
 
The first words out of my neighbor's mouth when he saw the gun was "oh, that's an assault weapon":barf:. I just kept my mouth shut......but that term is complete garbage, no such thing.

Its a "Modern Sporting Rifle". :D

That is the point though, this guy's whole viewpoint is from hunting, not recreation or sport. The rifle is just a tool that enables him to hunt.

He only shoot's probably 60 rounds a year, but he brags about his 1" groups at 200 yards.

I shoot well over 500 rounds of .308 out of my bolt gun every year, pretty sure I could shoot right with him.
 
He kind of sneered his nose and said "what do you need that for"? Wow.....really?

I guess he's ok with banning AR-15's, as long as he get to keep his .308 bolt rifle.
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That's quite an assumption on the OP's part. I wonder how he would react if it were the other way around? (He gets to keep his AR-15 if he will throw the other guys .308 bolt rifle under the bus.)
 
Found out my neighbor is a "Fudd"
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Is there something in the water? This is the second time I have been called a FUDD. The first because I don’t support a National Conceal Carry law and now because I don’t have a need for a AR-15. (Even though I am building one doesn’t mean I have a need for it. Think another panic).

This a guy who owns a .308 bolt rifle, a shotgun and a 9mm pistol. That's it.
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IMHO your neighbor owns a very good three gun set in time proven effective commonly available cartridges that covers game hunting, bird hunting and self-defense. Yet you have a problem with him not sharing your opinion of needing to own a AR.

He apparently has what he wants and thinks he has a use for. Yet you sneer at his choices even as you complain that he doesn't share your enthusiasm for your choices.

You of course have every right to be thus. It's just been my experience that such a view is neither productive or constructive.
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I agree.
 
Whether your neighbor isn't interested in different types of guns or just doesn't see much need for them beyond their own particular application (such as only for hunting, target shooting, competition, trap, skeet, etc.), doesn't mean they can't be open to something new. Putting a negative label on someone isn't exactly going to help win them over to your point of view. If all else fails and you can't "convert" them to your way of thinking, write them off and move on to someone else who might be enlightened by your interests in different types of firearms.
 
bearcreek said:
What is an AL pistol?
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They're all aluminum. Barrels don't last long. Firing pin has to be replaced every 30 rounds. Firing pin spring made from old soda cans. :)

I've been called a Fudd before simply because I like wood and blued steel better than "black rifles". I've got an AR and it's one of my most accurate rifles. It's a lot of fun to shoot. But it's not my favorite rifle. Apparently that was enough for this particular group to consider me a Fudd.

Now, switching to the other side, what many true "Fudds" don't understand is that their "deer rifle" isn't safe. You own a bolt action 270 with a scope? Great. Turn it in, citizen. It's now been deemed a sniper rifle. What about your pump 12 gauge? It's now been deemed to have no "sporting purpose", along with 10, 16, 20, and 28 gauges. The only shotgun you're now allowed to own is .410 bore. Good luck with that on the goose hunt. Those scenarios aren't just paranoia. They've actually been proposed by quite a few anti lawmakers and activists. The whole "sporting purpose" nonsense needs to go the way of the dodo.

Matt
 
You can see in my signature, that I own a .308 bolt gun. Why would I throw those under the bus? I think people should be allowed to own and shoot whatever they like, I don't limit myself to those "politically correct" guns, lol.

Just because you don't own an AR doesn't make you a fudd. Its the attitude of "my hunting rifle is ok, but your AR isn't".

Based on the vibes I got from him, he could care less about shooting or owning one and probably wouldn't care if they got banned.

Since this is my first AR and I'm having more fun that I've ever had with a rifle, I'll fight like hell to maintain the right to own them.

"A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to hunt deer on Sunday's, shall not be infringed". :barf:
 
Frank Ettin said:
Part of life is learning to live among people who might not share your views on all sorts of things. Your neighbor owes you nothing but civility.
He apparently has what he wants and thinks he has a use for. Yet you sneer at his choices even as you complain that he doesn't share your enthusiasm for your choices.
You of course have every right to be thus. It's just been my experience that such a view is neither productive or constructive.
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A very good point.
Many times I have admired and talked to people about certain guns or calibers in an effort to gain knowledge about them. This is despite the fact that 90% of the time I have no desire to possess said gun/caliber.
But, like cars, they are all interesting. :D
 
Prince Yamato said:
The problem with Fudds, is that they only see guns as hunting accessories and with all deference to pro-2A hunters, Hunting and the Second Amendment, though frequently spoken of in the same context are mutually exclusive. You can support the Second Amendment and never hunt (like me). You can hunt and not care about the right to self-defense. Though I have no qualms with it, hunting is a sport, not a right.
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No where did the OP ever mention that his neighbor wants ARs or any other firearm banned. No where did he tell us that the neighbor supported more gun control or was not concerned about the risk of more gun control. All we have been told and apparently all the OP was told/asked, is why he thought he needed an AR. Again, just because someone does not have a use for a specific firearm does not mean they do not support the right of others to own one, even if they consider it a foolish investment. Look at all the negative comments many folks here make to owners of firearms like the "Judge" or the "Governor". The majority of folks claim they would never have one and see no purpose for one, but like their own firearms, they don't want them banned. Seems some folks here have a problem with hunters and the OP may be a bit put off because his neighbor didn't pee down his leg from excitement when he was shown the AR.

Oh and by the way, in my state, hunting is a right and guaranteed by the state constitution.:neener:
 
I don't have a problem with hunting, but when that is the primary view of the 2-A, that's extremely flawed in my humble opinion.

I live in Colorado, so hunting is part of the culture out here. I don't have any interest in hunting, but for the folks that enjoy it.....more power to them.
 
ColoradoShooter77 said:
This a guy who owns a .308 bolt rifle, a shotgun and a 9mm pistol. That's it. We've done a lot of chatting about guns in general over the last few month's.

His philosophy of the RKBA is far different from mine.

I found this out when I showed him my newly acquired AR-15. He kind of sneered his nose and said "what do you need that for"? Wow.....really?

I guess he's ok with banning AR-15's, as long as he get to keep his .308 bolt rifle. That kind of attitude really irritates me!

I've got a feeling his whole attitude would change if he actually fired an AR-15, I don't care who you are, it puts a grin on your face.

He considers 3 boxes of ammo "stockpiling"......I want 1000 rounds of each caliber, minimum.
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Your neighbor sounds like a good neighbor to have. He is probably unaware that any slide towards the other side is a threat to what you call his fuddism. You see him as a threat. His other acquaintances that don't shoot guns might see him as a dangerous gun owner. They see him as a rouge, a threat to their personal safety. There is no middle ground these days.
 
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