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Friend of mine just had to surrender his handguns (some lessons learned here)

Discussion in 'Legal' started by Torian, Apr 22, 2017.

  1. george burns

    george burns Member

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    I don't know if it's still the same, but when I left in 95, there was only 1 gun store in NYC, "proper", it was downtown near Police Plaza. There must be new systems in place now, because it severly limited what you could buy. The 2nd and 3d guns I had while living there I bought from a gun store in Roslyn LI. The big place back then was Edelmens, which I don't even know if it still exhists.
    It was out of NYC in Suffolk County LI. In NY you can't even send a firearm to someone as there are no FFL's to use, I had to have my Cousin pick up a "Rifle" from my moms house in Queens and bring it out to Naussau County in order to send it to me, And it cost $100.00. This was when my Mom moved down to FL, around 2008.
     
  2. justice06rr

    justice06rr Member

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    A locked vehicle is technically considered secured. Not the best way to store a weapon under some clothes inside the car, but it is equal to putting your weapon under the seat.

    Of course your ccw should be stored in a locked safe/glove box. What I meant was that he did not bring the firearm into the establishment; in some states like mine (FL) it is prohibited by law to bring your ccw to a bar.
     
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  3. Ramone

    Ramone Member

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    Surprisingly enough, it's completely legal in NYS to carry in a bar, and even to consume alcohol while carrying.

    There's a few odd things about NYS Sullivan Laws like that. I figure it's because they were some of the first gun control laws in the country, so a lot of restrictions hadn't been thought of yet.
     
  4. hdwhit

    hdwhit Member

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    Intent.

    And the police who investigated this apparently believe they have established the elements of intent under state law otherwise they would not have forwarded the case to the courts.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2017
  5. hdwhit

    hdwhit Member

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    Granted.

    But what in the OP post tells your for certain that the "friend" locked the vehicle?
     
  6. hdwhit

    hdwhit Member

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    New York City and New York State are not the same thing and the "mentality" of the city does not necessarily correspond to the rest of the state.
     
  7. hdwhit

    hdwhit Member

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    Assuming nothing at all.

    If the "friend" knew the gun was in the vehicle when he filed the report, then the report was unquestionably false.

    But even if he didn't know where his gun was, when he filed the report saying that the gun was stolen in the bar, that presumes he knew where the gun was when he walked into the bar (which means he is saying he "knew" it wasn't in the vehicle) which is also false.

    Given the facts presented in the OP, there is no way for the "friend" to have filed a police report in which affirmatively states that the gun was last known to be in his possession in the bar and that was where it went missing that is not a false statement.
    • If the gun was known to be in the car, then reporting it stolen in the bar constitutes knowingly filing a false report.
    • If the "friend" was so impaired that he didn't know when or where the gun was "stolen", then reporting that it was taken into the bar (when in fact it was still in his vehicle) was likewise a false report.
    There is no way to put lipstick on this pig. The "friend"- based on what is stated in the OP - is guilty of filing a false police report.
     
  8. george burns

    george burns Member

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    You can go into a place that servrs liquor, as long as their main business is not Booze. As in Restaurant which also derves cocktails with dinner. You can even have a drink, as long as you don't blow drunk on the meter, you should be ok. Just understand it will be used against you in court if they decide to go forward with charges or you get sued in civil court.
    Even legally prescribed medicine will be questioned, but if you're doctor said you were ok to function normally, it will more than likely be worthless.
    A lawyers job is just to raise a shadow of a doubt, that you were somehow impared and that was what caused the shooting, it doesn't matter what is true, only what you can prove, or raise suspicion. That's why many legal practicionars say just don't drink when carrying.
    In NYC, I always had my gun, even in a Bar, "when I was younger", because a vechicle had a 50/50 chance of being broken into if left on the street anywhere in NY. Even in parking lots and indoor Garages. I felt the gun was safer with me, and if I remember correctly you were not allowed to leave your carry gun unattended there.
     
  9. heyjoe

    heyjoe Member

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    you dont understand the process in the county in new york state involved. This isnt a criminal investigation. In that county as in most other counties in new york, a judge issues a concealed carry permit. The police notified the judge of the incident and the judge suspended his ccw license, pending a hearing before him. That is the way it works there. In New York City and several other counties the police department issued the permit. In those counties a judge would not be involved in the process unless the person whose permit was revoked appealed to court. in this case the judge is only involved because the permit was issued by him or his predecessor. Its not a criminal investigation.
     
  10. herrwalther

    herrwalther Member

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    Correct. A judge approval is needed to carry anywhere in NY state. The good thing about that was permits didn't need to be renewed as they never expired. Which changed with the SAFE ACT. The downside is permits could be revoked without any due process or barely an investigation into misconduct. New York is truly one of those states where you pay (out the ***) for the "privilege" of owning and carrying a firearm. One of the many reasons why I will never permanently live in NY ever again, unless they change a ton of laws from the top down. But I have a better chance of personally visiting the moon before that happens.
     
  11. heyjoe

    heyjoe Member

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    a judge approval is needed in most counties but not all. NYC, nassau and half of suffolk county the carry permit is issued by the police department, in the other half of suffolk county by the sherrifs office. there may be other counties where the police department issues carry permits, but i never looked into it.
     
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  12. Stevie-Ray

    Stevie-Ray Member

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    When I started carrying, I pretty much gave up drinking any alcohol anywhere, other than my own home when I'm not planning on leaving. I know quite a few people that say the same. Only every once in a while, when there is a party and I'm not driving, I'll leave the guns in the safe at home. Meh, I don't really miss it. Michigan is kinda stupid about their gun laws, .08 for driving, zero tolerance for guns, and huge grey areas about locking them up in cars, just to have a drink.
     
  13. ponchh

    ponchh Member

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    Saw story in Jan/Feb issue of American Handgunner about owning and shooting in N.Y.
    The law says even tho the guns have trigger locks, and in locked cases, and in locked trunk of car, if you have a mag in passenger area with one bullet in it that is considered a loaded weapon.
    Question- If you have loaded mag but no gun is it still a weapon.
     

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