Gander Mountain delay?

[Steve32]

I got a NICS delay at a Gander Mountain store. It's not a big deal, sometimes I get delay, sometimes I don't. Maybe I got it this time because the holiday season. If they -the store employees- don't call me back, when should I go back to their store to pick up my new firearm?

The law says 3 days, but I know the Gander M. has a store policy, though there is nothing about this policy on their website. It's something like the waiting period is 8 days (or 11?) if they get no reply after the delay.

So if the NICS got the delay on Wednesday evening, then when should I go back to the store, if they don't call me? Thursday evening? Or Friday evening?

(There is nothing on the store's website, and I found mixed information on forums.)

 

[Robert]

I'd call them and ask the manager what the policy is.

 

[Steve32]

I sent a message to their customer service, on Friday morning. I got no reply (email) yet.

 

[oneounceload]

That's why you CALL - odds are, at this time of year, your email will go unanswered

 

[Remllez]

Pretty sure Gander Mountains policy is 11 days...calling will confirm.

 

[tyeo098]

I used to never get delayed.
Now with a misd. on my record I always get delayed.

None of my FFL's will transfer at the 3 day mark, even when I have my CCW.

 

[BP Hunter]

I honestly get annoyed when a store makes up their own rules over the Federal Law. Federal clearly states that a gun buyer can "walk away" with the firearm after 3-5 business days if the "delayed" decision is unresolved.

Since Gander Mt has its own rules, I guess you have to wait on them. I would call Friday. Good lcuck!!

 

[NavyLCDR]

Federal clearly states that a gun buyer can "walk away" with the firearm after 3-5 business days if the "delayed" decision is unresolved.

ROFL.... 3-5 business days is clear? Which is it? 3? 4? or 5? I think it is funny that you will complain about stores making up their own rules over Federal law, and then misstate the Federal law in the same post.....

27 CFR 478.102:

§ 478.102 Sales or deliveries of firearms on and after November 30, 1998.

(a) Background check. Except as provided in paragraph (d) of this section, a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, or licensed dealer (the licensee) shall not sell, deliver, or transfer a firearm to any other person who is not licensed under this part unless the licensee meets the following requirements:

(1) Before the completion of the transfer, the licensee has contacted NICS;

(2)(i) NICS informs the licensee that it has no information that receipt of the firearm by the transferee would be in violation of Federal or State law and provides the licensee with a unique identification number; or

(ii) Three business days (meaning days on which State offices are open) have elapsed from the date the licensee contacted NICS and NICS has not notified the licensee that receipt of the firearm by the transferee would be in violation of law;

 

[brboyer]

A lot of people get confused on that point.
The three days does not include the day of attempted purchase, so you end up being able to pick it up a minimum of five business days later, subject, of course, to the shop's business policies and any other applicable State law.

 

[22-rimfire]

I'd call or visit Gander on Tuesday.

 

[dogtown tom]

BP Hunter I honestly get annoyed when a store makes up their own rules over the Federal Law. Federal clearly states that a gun buyer can "walk away" with the firearm after 3-5 business days if the "delayed" decision is unresolved.

No sir. Gander Mtn nor any other gun store "makes up their own rules".

When the dealer calls in the background check to the FBI NICS, the FBI Legal Documents examiner will tell the dealer "NTN #1234567 will be delayed while the NICS continues its research. If you do not receive a final response from us, the Brady Law does not prohibit the transfer of the firearm on xx/xx/xxxx".

Note the verbage....the Brady Law does not prohibit the transfer.....it also does not require it. The dealer is under no requirement to hand you the gun until he receives a "proceed" from NICS.....which may never come. Even then, he may at any time refuse to complete the transfer if he feels the transfer may violate Federal law or for any other reason. (of course he would have to refund your $$$$)

 

[NavyLCDR]

No sir. Gander Mtn nor any other gun store "makes up their own rules".

When the dealer calls in the background check to the FBI NICS, the FBI Legal Documents examiner will tell the dealer "NTN #1234567 will be delayed while the NICS continues its research. If you do not receive a final response from us, the Brady Law does not prohibit the transfer of the firearm on xx/xx/xxxx".

Note the verbage....the Brady Law does not prohibit the transfer.....it also does not require it. The dealer is under no requirement to hand you the gun until he receives a "proceed" from NICS.....which may never come. Even then, he may at any time refuse to complete the transfer if he feels the transfer may violate Federal law or for any other reason. (of course he would have to refund your $$$$)

They most certainly are making up their own rules. Federal law says they CAN release the firearm after 3 business days. If store X releases the gun on the 4th day - that is store x's rule. If store y won't release the gun until two weeks have passed, that is store y's rule. Federal law simply allows the store to make up their own rules after 3 business days.

 

[dogtown tom]

NavyLCDR They most certainly are making up their own rules. Federal law says they CAN release the firearm after 3 business days.

No, Federal law doesn't say that. There is a difference between "the dealer CAN release the firearm..." vs "The Brady Law does not prohibit the transfer...".

FBI NICS does not give the dealer permission to complete the transfer until they update the status to "proceed". It is quite possible that NICS will return a "denied" response four, five or ten days after the initial check. A dealer who completes a transfer before he has a "proceed" from NICS is not violating the Brady law, because the Brady law only prohibits the transfer before the MDI date.

The dealer is compliant with the law and perfectly within his rights to wait until he receives a proceed before he completes the transfer.
ATF makes it clear that that the dealer is allowed to use his DISCRETION as to whether he will transfer the firearm before receiving a "proceed":
http://www.atf.gov/press/releases/2004/11/111204-fbi-nics-delay.pdf I don't think discretion is the same as "making up your own rules".


If "right on red" is legal in your state, yet you choose to wait until the light turns green before making your turn are you making up your own rules over state law? No, it was simply your choice and fully compliant with the law.

 

[BP Hunter]

I know Big 5 make up their own rules. Back before I was non a US citizen and was legal to purchase a firearm, I tred to purchase a Mauser in Big 5. I had and still have a Concelaed Pistol License, have purchased most probably 2 or more dozens of firearms with no hitch, went through more finger printings than any US citizens, ete, etc. When I tried to purchase the Mauser, they told me I could not until I showed them my Green Card??? Huh?? AFter all that, having a COncealed Pistol License and fulfilling all the legal federal requirements to purchase a firearm, they could not sell me the firearm until I showed them my Green Card. They told me that is was the Big 5 store policy. Whatever, I said. I still ended buying the Mauser. Now, that's what I meant about stores that try to make up their own rules.

 

[dogtown tom]

BP Hunter I know Big 5 make up their own rules. Back before I was non a US citizen and was legal to purchase a firearm, I tred to purchase a Mauser in Big 5. I had and still have a Concelaed Pistol License, have purchased most probably 2 or more dozens of firearms with no hitch, went through more finger printings than any US citizens, ete, etc. When I tried to purchase the Mauser, they told me I could not until I showed them my Green Card??? Huh?? AFter all that, having a COncealed Pistol License and fulfilling all the legal federal requirements to purchase a firearm, they could not sell me the firearm until I showed them my Green Card. They told me that is was the Big 5 store policy. Whatever, I said. I still ended buying the Mauser. Now, that's what I meant about stores that try to make up their own rules.

Again, Big 5 isn't making up their own rules. Question 15 on the Form 4473 REQUIRES non citizens to write in their U.S. issued alien number or admission number.

Thats an ATF requirement, not Big 5.

 

[BP Hunter]

TOm,

Yes, I clearly know that. But it doesn't require you to present your Green CArd to the FFL. ATF will decide with your provided Alien Number if you are legal or not. Big 5 says, you can't buy our guns till I SEE your Green Card...

I have purchased gun from at least 6 different stores and Big 5 had to be different. I complied only because I wanted that Mauser.

To the OP: Sorry if we hacked your thread. I hope you get your firearm soon. Good luck! Enjoy your Christmas gift!

 

[22-rimfire]

The green card makes Big 5 comfortable with the transfer. It is always dealer option to sell something.

 

[dogtown tom]

BP Hunter ....Big 5 says, you can't buy our guns till I SEE your Green Card...

You are 100% correct.
There is no requirement for you to present the card, just provide the number.

There are dealers who think:
-abbreviations are not allowed (ATF has repeatedly stated abbreviations are fine as long as they are commonly used/understood.....and ATF even uses an abbreviation as an example on Question 20a.)

-only numbers may be used for the birthdate. (not required)

-non residents or non citizens cannot purchase firearms period. (they can)

-that their ATF Industry Operations Investigator knows the regulations (most do, some don't)

-that a PGO shotgun is a shotgun (it isn't...its an "other firearm")

-that an AR lower receiver has to be designated as "pistol" or "rifle". (again, its neither one, but an "other firearm".
This list can go on and on because at some point it may have been a law or regulation, or ATF changed the reg or some states have state laws that are more restrictive. Or it could simply be the stores lawyers decided it would be good corporate policy to have the same procedures in all stores regardless of what state they are in.

***Remember, ATF considers ANY mistake on the dealers 4473, bound book or multiple sale forms to be a WILLFUL mistake....even a transposed digit or misspelling. One SINGLE error in the dealers records could lead to license revocation, a fine or jail time. This is why dealers become paranoid and err on the side of caution at every step.....even when not required.