Girlfriend: Self Defense issues

[DontBurnMyFlag]

Ok, I got in a argument with my girlfriend about self defense. Heres the thing. She always carries the mace I bought her on her keychain. The other day she is in the city and her friend says she was almost assaulted the other day. So my girlfriend gives her the mace to keep.

So I say ok, go buy a new on at the gun store down the street from you. Shes asks why I cant buy it for her? I said because I wont see you for 2 days, you need to buy it and have it now. She said, "Im not going to the city, Im not going anywhere etc"

I tried telling her its not, where you are thats important. I told her that a situation can happen anywhere and you should be prepared at all times. She just wrote it off and refused to buy it.

Now this was stubborn on her part. I even offered rape statistics about how people are abducted from parking lots more than dark alleyways. What else should I have done? Anything else I can tell her?

And please, dont flame my girlfriend by saying, "well its her fault if she gets assaulted now" or "dump her shes stupid". Dont say anything condescending or cruel, this isnt how we help each other out on THR.

Its not that big a deal since I will get her the mace in 2 days. But alot can happen in 2 days and I want her to understand that. She has enough common sense to carry mace everywhere and notice a friend that needs SD protection. Why cant she realize this herself.

 

[NineHotel]

How about this - it's her life, so let her make some decisions about it. If that is the way she wants to handle it, then so be it. Honor her right to make these kinds of decisions, instead of insisting on having it your way or no way. At least she agrees to carry it, eh?

 

[XavierBreath]

You cannot convince your girlfriend to do what she refuses to do. If she wants to buy herself some OC (or mace), she will do it. If not, she is not unprotected. OC (or mace) is only a tool. The will to survive and ability to fight are what protects us, not a can of seasoning. Just tell her to put a butcher knife in her purse and carry a claw hammer around in her belt. She will be fine.

 

[goon]

Maybe she doesn't feel comfortable going into a gun shop to buy it herself. If she isn't totally educated on what she is buying she would have to ask the guy who owns the shop. She may feel embarassed doing this, thinking along the lines that she will get treated like a "dumb woman" for not knowing what she really needs. Add in that no one wants to feel stupid or to allow other people to make them feel stupid and maybe it just makes more sense to her to just wait until you buy it for her.
When you buy her a replacement get a spare so you don't have to worry about this again.

 

[WT]

Free choice. If she doesn't want to buy it, she doesn't have to.

 

[svtruth]

Motivation

Perhaps she feels buying it is a tacit admission of her danger, it is, and so is reluctant. I like the idea of buying two. She has a spare and she can continue to be good example to her friends.
The other thing I always suggest for situations like this is, have her open a dialogue with pax on this forum.
Good luck.

 

[pax]

Goon is probably right about why she didn't want to buy her own. But as everyone else said, she's an adult!

Anyway. The solution isn't to buy two for her so next time she'll have a spare. Just take her with you when you go to pick up the spray, so she knows that it's not any big deal to go into the shop and get it. (And yes, a gun shop can be a frightening place the first time around, and there really isn't any way for you to know how the guy behind the counter treats women who come in by themselves anyway, so what the heck. It doesn't do any harm to make it a shared chore.)

Also, if you can get her into a class about how to use the spray she has, that's probably a good idea. Better still, instead of insulting her by suggesting that she needs the class, let her know that you're concerned about her friend who hasn't carried spray before, and think that she should take her friend to a class so the friend can learn about how to use the stuff.

Same basic thing: if she can stop over at Marc MacYoung's website (www.nononsenseselfdefense.com), she will probably find some very useful stuff to think about there. Please don't be pushy about this, though, and certainly don't use it as a "well I'm right and here's PROOF that I'm right!" because if you do that you've already lost. Again, if you can suggest that her friend might find something useful there -- and ask your GF to review the stuff to figure out if it would help the friend -- you'll probably get better results.

Hope that helps.

Oh, one more thought. Buddy of mine sitting here reading this over my shoulder said to tell you most women are more concerned about other people than they are about their own safety. So you probably would have done better off to tell her that she needed to get the spray because you couldn't sleep at night, worrying about her. (My comment: that's romantic too!) Anyway, buddy's point is that she might get it for your sake, to make you more comfortable, when she wouldn't bother for her own sake.

pax

 

[nfl1990]

She has enough common sense to carry mace everywhere

While this is a decent start, (not meaning to be insulting, or condesending) it might be a good idea to talk to her about a CCW.

 

[DontBurnMyFlag]

wow thanks for all the good info. Shes almost 21 and lives in PA, getting her to get a CCW would be like getting hillary clinton to...well...um, look like a woman.

 

[Spiggy]

I'm not ashamed to say it, I carry a whistle and keychain kubaton myself. I store the whistle with my knife in my safety packet in my car... SD is important, especially in those places with the high statistics.

I think she's telling you to buy her a tazer...

 

[nfl1990]

would be like getting hillary clinton to...well...um, look like a woman.

I don't think even Micheal Jackson's plastic surgeon could acomplish that.
Though Hilliry already looks like a freak so I guess there is no harm in trying.

Now to get back on Topic, that's too bad that your GF won't consider a CCW, but if it is leagal to get a tazer in PA, I strongly recomend one.

 

[goon]

You said that she is set against CCW?
Is there any chance that she is a little bit afraid of firearms?
To try and illustrate my point...
I went to buy cleaning supplies one time not too long ago. Suffice it to say that although I am 25, I am a guy. I am not exactly what one would call a neat and tidy person so I was somewhat inexperienced at this. Luckily, there are labels that tell me what these things will clean. Even with that, several young women walked past me and gave each other this "he has no idea what the hell he is doing" look. They were right.
Now translate that to buying a gun for self defense. Way more complicated, way more potentially dangerous, way more expensive and no label to help you out. Nothing but a gun store employee who may or may not be knowledgeable and may or may not be itching for the chance to show off his "knowledge" by belittling a less experienced person.
I have never been at the mercy of anyone else when buying guns or gun related stuff because I have been shooting since I was 4, but it would really suck to be in that position.
Or maybe she just isn't comfortable with the idea of killing another human being. I'm not either so I can understand that. Some people are just not fighters. Just the way it is and I respect that.

 

[MGK]

I'd suggest that you just pick up the OC spray and give it to her. no one likes a nag, ultimately she has to see and accept the need for SD tools. It can't be forced on her.

Take her shooting and let her get comfortable with firearms, and then let her express a desire to take SD to the next step.

My .02

 

[DontBurnMyFlag]

shes not anti-gun, she is just afraid of them and wont admit it. I took her to the gun range once, but she just watched. I noticed her fiddling around with my airsoft 1911 and she asked "what does this do" while pointing at the safety. In my mind, thats progress for me. Shes too headstrong and proud to let me teach her and she just doesnt like guns all that much. one of her girlfriends is a redneck in all meaning of the word and has many guns and a BF with a CCW. we hang out iwth them alot, im just waiting for it to rub off.

 

[goon]

Buy her a Red Ryder for Christmas.

 

[f4t9r]

Just explain to her why you are so concerned and take her with you to get it, I agree that will make it easier on her
Just take one step at a time maybe she will end up getting a CCW

 

[grimjaw]

+1 pax.

pax - loves firearms and sensitive, too!

BE MINE, PAX! NO OTHER WOMAN COMPARES!



jmm

 

[Blue Jays]

Hi DBMF-

"...One of her girlfriends is a redneck in all meaning of the word and has many guns and a BF with a CCW. We hang out with them alot, I'm just waiting for it to rub off..."

Her friends sound like decent Americans from my perspective. Why are you inclined to call them rednecks and describe their ownership of firearms in the same sentence? Good luck with your girlfriend...do her a favor and purchase a couple cannisters of OC the next time you're in the gun store.

~ Blue Jays ~

 

[HI express]

Relax

DBMF,
Don't work so hard at it?
Remember, she is entitled to her opinion and her point of view too.
I tried to influence my wife for years. We have been married for 28 years now and after several years when we first married she let me do my thing but she didn't care to carry any weapon on her.
She now has one primary and one bug and a Kershaw folder. She has had several incidents where she knows that if she didn't have a gun, things could have gone south quickly, but her having a gun prevented some potentially deadly situation from escalating.
Your girlfriend is an adult right? Let her make up her own decisions. She'll make the right decision when she is ready.

Keep in mind, I have taught martial arts for forty years and I was very fast. I realized soon in life that I could be four feet away from a person that I needed to physically protect and if a BG caught you off guard you couldn't have prevented the BG from cutting, striking, or shooting the victim.

Sorry, that is the reality of violence.

I still point out bad situations from time to time to my wife and my 19 year old daughter. I am sure that they tune me out but they also carry all the time.

Good luck.

 

[goon]

Blue Jays - Not to hi-jack the thread, but redneck is a term that some wear with pride. I know I do. Calling a redneck a redneck isn't an insult.

And I still vote for the Red Ryder. My dad gave me one when I was about 7 and I shot the heck out of that thing. Every weekend I would make him take me out in the back yard and I would shoot until I was out of BB's. It was definitely fun and there is no intimidation value at all with them. It would at least be a gentle start.

 

[antarti]

WAY good advice above.

You might try range trips with some mutual friends. Nothing like GF realizing "hey, most of SO's friends and their wives/sisters/friends do this, it must be OK for me too." Having other females around to shoot with REALLY made a diff with my wife when she was first introduced to firearms. Sending the ladies off to buy a CCW purse beats hell out of you filling that role also.

Paxton Quigley's "Armed and Female" is good reading for the ladies (and men too). I learned a lot about ladies' unique needs when shopping-for and manipulating a piece, and some SD info that was valuable as well. Any weapons you can "share" are a big plus. Shooting a desert eagle while she shoots some pea-shooter you bought her in a different lane isn't going to thrill her. Things done together make a better impression.

If you can, make sure any gunstore trips are taken together, at least at first. The biggest setback I had with wifey was when she went, alone, to gunstore to check out safes. Toothless and reckless counter-guy opens a safe, whips 3-4 concealed pieces out from waistband, ankle, etc. to show her how they fit in safe. Surprised and scared hell out of her. It didn't help that he tried picking her up too. If that's somebody's first "gun culture" impression, it takes time to "clean up" by those more responsible.

I've found it completely non-intuitive (being a thick-headed male) which pieces are easy for women to manipulate and use, especially the more fragile/dainty of the fairer sex, with limited wrist/hand strength and above-average recoil shyness. PM me if you need suggestions, or want them posted.

Trying to make a change in 2 days is a bit optimistic. Take your time and "make it stick". GF will be better off in the long run, and if things last, so will you.

 

[pax]

grimjaw ~



pax

No matter how happily a woman may be married, it always pleases her to discover that there is a nice man who wishes that she were not. -- HL Mencken

 

[fastbolt]

Girlfriend? Almost 21?

Well, if you want to keep the first circumstance stable and long-lasting, you need to remember that she's her own person, and has her own life to live as she sees fit. She may ask your advice, but don't force it on her. Not your place. Wait until you try that with a wife, or with a daughter ... :banghead:

She's an adult in some legal aspects, but not quite yet in another ... which is one of the funny things about our society. Some young folks that age have all the answers, or are well on their way to acquiring them ... or so I've been told by a lot of them.

Self defense is an issue that many folks will only consider through the personal filters of their own world views ... if they'll consider it at all. Information can help educate some folks, but then other folks will never allow 'facts' to influence their preferred opinions and viewpoints.

Some folks will never accept the necessity, or subject themselves to the experience, of potentially 'harming' another person, even in defense of self.

Some folks won't do a little prudent research into the laws governing the use of reasonable force in the defense of self, or others, too.

That's their prerogative, although if they're a loved one we may certainly have the opportunities to try and influence their thinking, presuming it's desired and necessary. Some well-meaning folks never even pause to consider that their well-intentioned 'advice' may not be exactly correct or applicable to someone else, though.

Too many folks are in too much of a hurry to run other folk's lives as it is ... everywhere.

 

[Hobie]

Buy her a Red Ryder for Christmas.

My ex-wife still has hers. It was the first thing she wanted to pack in her car when she left!

 

[CatsDieNow]

My ex-boyfriend attempted to teach me how to drive his truck with a manual transmission. He had been doing it for so long he forgot to tell me a few important details. (He told me to push in the clutch and let it out slowly - neglecting to tell me to give it some gas at that point, too.) Obviously, I never started moving, much less left the parking lot. When he started laughing and giving instructions in the mafia boss accent, I got so frustrated and mad at him that I walked the fifteen miles home rather than ride in the truck.

My point being: Sometimes it is best to have a disinterested third party teach you things.

Also, some women, for whatever reason, value the opinion of their female friends more than you men. Even if you tell her exactly the same thing that they do, it won't take until she hears it from another woman. I get requests from men occasionally to talk to their wives/girlfriends for this reason.

See if you can find a female NRA instructor in your area.