Glock 26 vs. Ruger Sp101 - an initial impression
- Thread starter guscoffey
- Start date
- Status
BikerRN
member
Close, but not quite.
.357 Magnum
125 Gr. Jacketed Hollow Point
Velocity 1500 FPS
Energy 625 Ft. Lbs.
.40 Smith & Wesson
155 Gr. Jacketed Hollow Point
Velocity 1150 FPS
Energy 450 Ft. Lbs.
180 Gr. Jacketed Hollow Point
Velocity 1000 FPS
Energy 400 Ft. Lbs.
9mm Luger
115 Gr. Jacketed Hollow Point +P
Velocity 1300 FPS
Energy 431 Ft. Lbs.
124 Gr. Jacketed Hollow Point +P
Velocity 1250 FPS
Energy 430 Ft. Lbs.
I couldn't find any specs for 357 SIG, as Black Hills doesn't make any ammo for that caliber, to my knowledge. This is a common Federal load:
Energy in Foot Pounds (To nearest 5 Foot Pounds)
Energy
Load No Caliber Muzzle 25 Y 50 Y 75 Y 100 Y
P357S1 357 Sig 506 445 395 354 323
It's easy to see that the 357 Sig comes closest to the Magnum, but that's only natural, as it was designed to mimic the .357 Magnum load of old. Even the Sig load doesn't match, let alone beat the Magnum, when using the better Magnum load, 125 grain JHP.
The problem is that lots of folks can't handle the true Magnum load. Those are the ones that use reduced recoil loads, or mid-range loads, in the Magnum and would be better served with a 9mm, 40 S&W, or even a 357 Sig. If it's a choice between 9mm and 40 S&W, there really isn't much difference in power, and I favor the 9mm for most folks.
BikerRN
hardluk1
member
Once you get that trigger reset for that second shoot down pat the glocks are easy to print good groups with. Still get'n use to mine and still carry mainly a KT pf-9 or more offten a kahr cw-9. Caliber is not the biggest thing out there either . Yes the 40 or 45 even the 19mm maybe be a bit better than a 9mm but that first 2 shoots if placed juuust right with a 22 or 25 will do the trick so practice, practice, practice. And carry what you like. Ain't no perfect pistol.
SharpsDressedMan
member
Regarding power of the .357 loads in the SP101 vs. the 9mm +P+ in the Glock 26, does anyone have true chronographed and calculated ballistics for both? That would be the definitive statement, rather than assuming the .357 is greatly outclassing the G26.
Deaf Smith
Member
http://www.stoppingpower.net/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=13312&SearchTerms=Glock+27
Here is what I got from my Glock 27:
Wolf 180 Grain FMJ..............180.....859
S&B 180 Grain FMJ...............180.....882
Win Ranger T 180 SXT..........180.....896
Winchester USA 165 Grain FMJ.165.....978
Remington UMC bulk 180 HP....180.....947
Fiocchi 170 Grain FMJ..........170.....1031
Speer Gold Dot 155 grain......155.....1106
Win Ranger T 165 SXT.........165.....1093
Win Ranger T 155 JHP..........155.....1151
http://www.stoppingpower.net/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=4049&SearchTerms=Glock+27
Test load: #1` ( .40 cal. Corbon 135 gr. JHP load.)
Results:
Glock Model 27 (FPS) 1249, 1253, 1260, = *Avg. 1254 (FPS)
Test load: #2 ( .40 cal. 135 gr. Corbon Pow'R Ball load.)
Results:
Glock Model 27 (FPS) 1402, 1397, 1413, = *Avg. 1404 (FPS) <-- note that
http://www.stoppingpower.net/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=9789&SearchTerms=Glock+27
finally got my G33 .357 barrel for my G27 and here are the results:
Glock 33 barrel .357 Sig in Glock 27
Speer Gold Dot 125 grain
high 1344
low 1258
avg 1305
sd 29
es 86
Corbon 125 JHP .357 Sig
high 1385
low 1351
avg 1366
sd 14
es 34
http://www.stoppingpower.net/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=10913&SearchTerms=SP101
Corbon .357 Magnum DPX Chronograph Results
Ruger SP101 w/3 1/16" bbl:
Average Velocity: 1176 ft/sec
Low Reading: 1152
High Reading: 1205
ES: 54
SD: 24
http://www.stoppingpower.net/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=9415&SearchTerms=SP101
gun-SP-101 with 2 1/4"
Rem .357 125gr Golden Sabre
low-1107 fps
high-1173 fps
average-1134 fps
extreme spread-66 fps
standard deviation-32 fps
this is a sort of 3/4 load and is noticeably more pleasant to shoot than the full power 125gr .357 loads.
Buffalo Bore .38 125gr bhp
l-1041 fps
h-1105 fps
a-1080 fps
es-66 fps
sd-25 fps
Federal .38 158gr +p Nyclad
l-741 fps
h-784 fps
a-763 fps
es-43 fps
sd-19 fps
Cor Bon .38 110gr DPX-standard pressure
l-1010 fps
h-1104 fps
a-1041 fps
es-94 fps
sd-38 fps
Cor Bon .38 110gr jhp +p
l-1078 fps
h-1227 fps
a-1181 fps
es-149 fps
sd-70 fps
Cor Bon .357 Mag 100gr PowRball
l-1425 fps
h-1512 fps
a-1473 fps
es-87 fps
sd-32 fps
pleasant to shoot
Cor Bon 100gr PowRball .38 Special
l-1125 fps
h-1294 fps
a-1252 fps
es-168 fps
sd-72 fps
CB .38 158gr +p+ lead hp
l-902 fps
h-968 fps
a-934 fps
es-66 fps
sd-28 fps
CCI .357 125gr Gold Dot
l-1181 fps
h-1242 fps
a-1206 fps
es-62 fps
sd-28 fps
Fed .38 110gr +p
l-912 fps
h-967 fps
a-937 fps
es-55 fps
sd-21 fps
MagTech .38 125gr +p Gold
l-928 fps
h-993 fps
a-947 fps
es-66 fps
sd-21 fps
http://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=103
1. 3 inch S&W J frame
a. Item 19A/20-180gr. Hard cast LFN = 1302 fps
b. Item 19B/20-170gr. JHC (jacketed hollow cavity) = 1299 fps
c. Item 19C/20-158gr. Jacketed Hollow Point = 1398 fps
d. Item 19D/20-125gr. Jacketed Hollow Point = 1476 fps <-- note that
Plus I might add paper 'energy' figures are NOT a direct correration as what happens on the street. It has been found energy, momentium, Bullet area, bullet construction, medium struck (bone, flesh, fluid, obstructions like coats, belts, walls, etc...) all have an effect on how well the cartridge works.
Deaf
BikerRN
member
Here's the stats, from Federal, on the 9BPLE
115 Grain JHP +P+
Energy in Foot Pounds
Muzzle 432
25Y 370
50Y 323
115 Grain JHP +P+
Energy in Foot Pounds
Muzzle 432
25Y 370
50Y 323
Deaf Smith
Member
And if you want more power out of the 26 I have chroned Winchester +P+ 127 T series out of MY Glock 26. They get 1240 FPS very consitanly.
And Stephen Camp did his own:
http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/index.php/t-20041.html
Fiocchi 115 gr FMJ:
Average Velocity: 1180 ft/sec
Extreme Spread: 57
Std. Deviation: 21
PMP 115 gr FMJ:
Average Velocity: 1046 ft/sec
Extreme Spread: 38
Std. Deviation: 15
(This is the most lightly loaded factory 115 gr ball that I've tried.)
Winchester "USA" 115 gr FMJ:
Average Velocity: 1097 ft/sec
Extreme Spread: 87
Std. Deviation: 40
Federal 115 gr JHP ("9BP," std. pressure):
Average Velocity: 1111 ft/sec
Extreme Spread: 34
Std. Deviation: 13
Hornady 124 gr "CQ" Tap (XTP):
Average Velocity: 1100 ft/sec
Extreme Spread: 38
Std. Deviation: 16
Winchester RA9TA 127 gr +P+ JHP:
Average Velocity: 1246 ft/sec
Extreme Spread: 33
Std. Deviation: 13
Corbon 125 gr +P JHP:
Average Velocity: 1188 ft/sec
Extreme Spread: 43
Std. Deviation: 17
Aguila 65 gr "IQ" Zinc HP:
Average Velocity: 1517 ft/sec
Extreme Spread: 64
Std. Deviation: 23
Deaf
And Stephen Camp did his own:
http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/index.php/t-20041.html
Fiocchi 115 gr FMJ:
Average Velocity: 1180 ft/sec
Extreme Spread: 57
Std. Deviation: 21
PMP 115 gr FMJ:
Average Velocity: 1046 ft/sec
Extreme Spread: 38
Std. Deviation: 15
(This is the most lightly loaded factory 115 gr ball that I've tried.)
Winchester "USA" 115 gr FMJ:
Average Velocity: 1097 ft/sec
Extreme Spread: 87
Std. Deviation: 40
Federal 115 gr JHP ("9BP," std. pressure):
Average Velocity: 1111 ft/sec
Extreme Spread: 34
Std. Deviation: 13
Hornady 124 gr "CQ" Tap (XTP):
Average Velocity: 1100 ft/sec
Extreme Spread: 38
Std. Deviation: 16
Winchester RA9TA 127 gr +P+ JHP:
Average Velocity: 1246 ft/sec
Extreme Spread: 33
Std. Deviation: 13
Corbon 125 gr +P JHP:
Average Velocity: 1188 ft/sec
Extreme Spread: 43
Std. Deviation: 17
Aguila 65 gr "IQ" Zinc HP:
Average Velocity: 1517 ft/sec
Extreme Spread: 64
Std. Deviation: 23
Deaf
SharpsDressedMan
member
Thanks. From the above, it would appear that the .357 gives up so much to the short barrels, that it does not perform any better than some +P+ 9mm from the Glock 26. Toss up. If you like revolvers, the snubbie .357 is yours. If you like the little 9mm's, then the Glock or similar size guns are the auto choice.
I'm not trying to sound morbid, but keep in mind that we're talking about defense from humans here. Humans are stopped just fine by a 158 grain 38 special. No need to go overboard or overthink this. Shot placement trumps any minute differences in ammo. And at the end of the day, a well placed 38 special or 9mm trumps a 45-70 in the arm.
wow6599
Member
My point was the SP101 is way more versatile than a G26, or any 9mm for that matter.
I don't care about the numbers above (haven't even looked) because I know a G26 can't send a 180 gr. HC LFN bullet at over 1300 FPS like a 3" SP101 can.
I don't care about the numbers above (haven't even looked) because I know a G26 can't send a 180 gr. HC LFN bullet at over 1300 FPS like a 3" SP101 can.
NMGonzo
Member
y'all overthinking this, but what would be do with a slow day at work?
SP101 unloaded is still a formidable weapon.
SP101 unloaded is still a formidable weapon.
Deaf Smith
Member
Ok here is my take on the whole subject.
First off I have been shooting since 14 years old. Grew up on Colt “O” and Smith “K’" frame handguns, Winchester 03 .22, and Marlin Texan .30/30 and started reloading at age 16.
I’ve pretty much shot and owned most guns from .458 Winchester down to .25 ACP. I have mucho revolvers in my stable as well as simi-autos.
Been to dozen or so shooting schools as well as competed in IMHS, IDPA, IPSC, NRA Bull’s-eye, CMP Leg matches, three gun matches, and even police benefit matches (though I’ve never been a cop in any form.) I can shoot and fight with either hand. Have expert rating in all categories of IDPA, and did the revolver with a Ruger Speed Six (and Safailand speedloaders in snap pouches near the backbone, not in front of the hip!) Made class 'A' IPSC with a P-35.
Yes I pack a Glock 27, and yes I pack a Smith J .38 (sometimes Centennial 640, sometimes M60.) And sometimes a TCP .380 as backup for one of the above (I do NOT like pack’en a revolver without some kind of second gun, due to the slow reloading nature of revolvers.)
In fact today was ‘snubby day’ and I went to the range with my 642 .38, 63 2 inch kit gun, and Ruger GP100 3 incher I am now playing with. I practice hard with both sub-compact Glock and J .38s cause I pack’em. I use a Glock 26 in IDPA in all but state matches.
The Glock is my main gun cause it A) Holds 10 rounds of .40s, B) fast to reload, and C) with NY-1/3.5 lb connector it gives me a 7-8 lb trigger pull that is consistent, yes like a revolver but somewhat lighter. I only pack a J .38 if what I am wearing won’t conceal my Glock 27 well. If it can conceal the 27, I sure as heck do pack it. And when I pack that J .38, the TCP rides with me as well as a spare revolver reload in a speed strip on my belt.
I don’t mind those who pack a 5 shooter revolver. But I do suggest they pack TWO cause all you have is 5 shots and it’s a lot easier to miss than you think in a confrontation. And as Tom Givens, of Rangemaster in Memphis Tennessee says, and his students have been in 52 gunfights THAT HE KNOWS OF, they are seeing more and more multi robbery teams where all the robbers are armed and they DO shoot it out sometimes.
Now as for the .357 (SP101) .vs. 40 (Glock 27), well this is silly. With full power loads they are both have plenty of power. I also have Glock 26s in 9mm. With +p+ they are fine and dandy. I have a AACK .22 for a Glock 26 as a practice gun (and my 642 is now my practice gun for the J .38s!)
The only question is firepower. And those 5 shots and slow reloads have better make you think some. For if you lock paws with 2 or more determined individuals you are in a difficult situation and I sure hope you are a Hickok if all you have is 5 shots.
So my suggestion is, if you do pack a wheelgun, pack two.
Deaf
First off I have been shooting since 14 years old. Grew up on Colt “O” and Smith “K’" frame handguns, Winchester 03 .22, and Marlin Texan .30/30 and started reloading at age 16.
I’ve pretty much shot and owned most guns from .458 Winchester down to .25 ACP. I have mucho revolvers in my stable as well as simi-autos.
Been to dozen or so shooting schools as well as competed in IMHS, IDPA, IPSC, NRA Bull’s-eye, CMP Leg matches, three gun matches, and even police benefit matches (though I’ve never been a cop in any form.) I can shoot and fight with either hand. Have expert rating in all categories of IDPA, and did the revolver with a Ruger Speed Six (and Safailand speedloaders in snap pouches near the backbone, not in front of the hip!) Made class 'A' IPSC with a P-35.
Yes I pack a Glock 27, and yes I pack a Smith J .38 (sometimes Centennial 640, sometimes M60.) And sometimes a TCP .380 as backup for one of the above (I do NOT like pack’en a revolver without some kind of second gun, due to the slow reloading nature of revolvers.)
In fact today was ‘snubby day’ and I went to the range with my 642 .38, 63 2 inch kit gun, and Ruger GP100 3 incher I am now playing with. I practice hard with both sub-compact Glock and J .38s cause I pack’em. I use a Glock 26 in IDPA in all but state matches.
The Glock is my main gun cause it A) Holds 10 rounds of .40s, B) fast to reload, and C) with NY-1/3.5 lb connector it gives me a 7-8 lb trigger pull that is consistent, yes like a revolver but somewhat lighter. I only pack a J .38 if what I am wearing won’t conceal my Glock 27 well. If it can conceal the 27, I sure as heck do pack it. And when I pack that J .38, the TCP rides with me as well as a spare revolver reload in a speed strip on my belt.
I don’t mind those who pack a 5 shooter revolver. But I do suggest they pack TWO cause all you have is 5 shots and it’s a lot easier to miss than you think in a confrontation. And as Tom Givens, of Rangemaster in Memphis Tennessee says, and his students have been in 52 gunfights THAT HE KNOWS OF, they are seeing more and more multi robbery teams where all the robbers are armed and they DO shoot it out sometimes.
Now as for the .357 (SP101) .vs. 40 (Glock 27), well this is silly. With full power loads they are both have plenty of power. I also have Glock 26s in 9mm. With +p+ they are fine and dandy. I have a AACK .22 for a Glock 26 as a practice gun (and my 642 is now my practice gun for the J .38s!)
The only question is firepower. And those 5 shots and slow reloads have better make you think some. For if you lock paws with 2 or more determined individuals you are in a difficult situation and I sure hope you are a Hickok if all you have is 5 shots.
So my suggestion is, if you do pack a wheelgun, pack two.
Deaf
Good discussion, thanks to all who take the time to do actual research with specific rounds to determine their performance out of specific guns. Thanks for being generous and sharing your results.
To clarify, I switched to a subcompact auto for precisely the reasons that Deaf posted just above. Specifically, I realized that I was choosing to carry a firearm (5 shot revolver) that could handicap me in some scenarios. This has nothing to do with ballistics, it has to do with my ability to get a hit on certain parts of an opponent's anatomy.
The NYPD SOP 9 study shows their officers having a hit rate around 20%, give or take some. Personally, I figure that I would be pretty foolish to count on performing better in a gunfight than a professional cop. So, with my 5 shot revolver I can count on getting 1, maybe 2, hits.
The more I thought about likely scenarios that I could encounter in the environments of my daily life, the more I realized that encountering multiple threats (and possibly needing to reload in a fight) is a possibility. Thus my switch.
Is the .357 better than 9mm? In my mind it definitely is. The .357 has better ballistics and, as mentioned above, is much more versatile. But until someone designs a pistol that can shoot .357 mag (not sig), carries 10 or more rounds, and has magazine reload, the subcompact auto is a better weapon system for my user requirements.
To clarify, I switched to a subcompact auto for precisely the reasons that Deaf posted just above. Specifically, I realized that I was choosing to carry a firearm (5 shot revolver) that could handicap me in some scenarios. This has nothing to do with ballistics, it has to do with my ability to get a hit on certain parts of an opponent's anatomy.
The NYPD SOP 9 study shows their officers having a hit rate around 20%, give or take some. Personally, I figure that I would be pretty foolish to count on performing better in a gunfight than a professional cop. So, with my 5 shot revolver I can count on getting 1, maybe 2, hits.
The more I thought about likely scenarios that I could encounter in the environments of my daily life, the more I realized that encountering multiple threats (and possibly needing to reload in a fight) is a possibility. Thus my switch.
Is the .357 better than 9mm? In my mind it definitely is. The .357 has better ballistics and, as mentioned above, is much more versatile. But until someone designs a pistol that can shoot .357 mag (not sig), carries 10 or more rounds, and has magazine reload, the subcompact auto is a better weapon system for my user requirements.
Big Mike
Member
Stopped shooting my SP-101, need to trade it for a Glock 27!...
- Status
