Glock or DA revolver for winter car gun?

[Father Knows Best]

I live in Minnesota. It gets friggin COLD up here in the winter. We recently had a stretch where the temp was subzero for more than three straight days.

I have a CCW license. My employer allows guns, but not in the building. That means I have to leave my gun locked in my car, which I can see out my office window. I'm not willing to risk losing my job by carrying into the building, but I'm also not comfortable going unarmed all day, everyday. That means leaving my gun locked in my car during the day. I am having a vault installed that will bolt to the floor just in front of the driver's seat.

The question is -- what gun can I leave in there with confidence it will work when I need it? My carry gun right now is a 1911 (Colt CCO). I'm a little nervous that the extreme cold may affect the lube and I'd wind up with a single shot pistol. Would a Glock (excuse me, I meant "GLOCK" ) be better suited to this role? I used to carry a G26 and still have it. Alternatively, I would consider a DA revolver in 357, 44 spl or 45ACP, but I don't currently own any DA revolvers and don't really have the time to learn to shoot them well (I own a bunch of single action revolvers, but the DA trigger is a whole 'nother animal).

 

[Geno]

Hands-down Glock!

Hands-down Glock! That's what I use. Here in Michigan, we have similar winters as you. I have never had problems in 3 years of CCWing year round with my Glocks.

Edit to add, while I do have and really like my 1911s, I do not want to risk rust or scratches. Durability or reliability? The 1911 is no problem! They were developed for war, in all conditions! But, my Glock 17 or 19C are my "beaters". I don't care if they get scratches.

 

[M2 Carbine]

I don't think you would have any trouble with any lightly lubed handgun.

But I know a Makarov will work.
I lubed this Mak with about three times more grease than was necessary and left it in the freezer fully loaded for over 24 hours. I took it out of the freezer and immediately shot it. It fired the magazine dry with no problems, except it was cold to hold.

 

[Father Knows Best]

Your freezer isn't much of a torture test. Most home freezers don't tend to reach subzero temps (10-20 degrees is typical). In addition, a gun in the freezer for an extended period isn't subjected to the constant temperature cycling that a winter car gun will be. It will be indoors at 72-75 degrees with me at home, riding around in a 60-70 degree car when I'm driving, and then cooling to potentially subzero while it sits in my car in the parking lot, only to repeat the cycle all over again several times a day for months on end.

And it's not just a lube question. Parts expand and contract depending on the temp. Parts of different shapes or sizes may expand different amounts. Different materials (aluminum vs steel, different steel alloys, etc.) will expand and contract at different rates, changing the way parts fit together.

 

[BADUNAME13]

https://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/store/productdetail.aspx?p=20053

Or:

http://www.militec-1.com/

On the 1911

 

[Euclidean]

Wouldn't simply inserting the gun in some sort of case or wrapper inside the car create two layers of insulation which would save it from the worst of it? I highly doubt any quality handgun would be too adversely affected by these conditions personally. We don't hear about people in Alaska finding their guns shattered due to the cold, after all.

 

[Tezcatlipoca]

Glock 31 or 20.


Power to crush through heavy coats and good capacities.

 

[plexreticle]

I would guess the type of lubricant is a bigger factor than weapon type unless your taste in weapons leans towards the really cheap.

I know an HK-VP70z has very few moving parts and my be a good choice.

 

[sm]

I know from experience -

Bone Stock Gov't Model of 1911 , Colt Combat Commander with USGI/ Colt 7 rd mags do work.

OLDer Kimber Series I . Browning Highpower. Kel-Tec P-11. (only non metal gun *we* use[d] and recent addtion)

Model 10, Model 19, Model 29 , Model 64, Model 66, Model 65.

870 (12 and 20 ga), Model 12, (12 and 20) Ithaca 37 (12 and 20 ga) Win Super X Model 1,( only comes in 12 ga), Rem 1100,(12 or 20) Beretta 303 (12 or 20), H&R/ NEF Single shot shotguns, (adult though Youth most often are used) in 12 ga and 20 gauge 20 gauge Youth being the most used, and preferred).

-Inside a vehicle keep in mind a slide can get out of battery with the interior of vehicle.
Revolvers are less apt to be rendered "hindered" in such a closed enviroment.

-We did not have Glocks back in the day, and only 1 non metal gun as shared earlier has been added to "menu".

These are proven in below freezing temps, -and to the other extreme - in hot humid blistering heat.

 

[GunNut]

I'd choose a Glock simply because the temperature variations will cause condensation on your gun and the Glock is real corrosion resistant.

I'd prefer not to abuse my all blued steel or Stainless steel guns with the potential of rust.

 

[10-Ring]

Realistically, I think either would work okay. I think the biggest issue would be which one you shoot better when the elements work against you

 

[Kor]

OK, as an Arizona resident I don't have much experience with guns in cold weather; however, I still sport a faint burn scar from touching the steel frame of my old Ruger Security-Six car gun after it had gotten nice and hot sitting in my car for 8 hours during an AZ summer day 2-1/2 years ago.

If you think you're more likely to have to use the gun with bare hands, use the Glock so you don't leave bits of your palm and finger skin stuck to the frame and trigger(all plastic, no exposed metal). Of course, if you have to rack the slide bare-handed in sub-zero conditions, good luck...

If you're sure you'll be wearing gloves when you have to shoot the gun in self-defense, most any gun should be OK, but test-fire it first while wearing the gloves you'll most likely be wearing to make sure they don't interfere with the trigger or other controls. Massad Ayoob has made a case for a "European-style" SIG P220E as a "winter/heavy glove" gun, in that the glove is less likely to get caught in or block the trigger once the gun transitions to single-action after the first shot, and the heel-mag-catch is less likely to be activated by accident while wearing heavy gloves than the side-button mag catch.

 

[MillCreek]

When I contemplated a similar choice, I went with a stainless .357 snub: Taurus model 650. Corrosion resistant, snag proof, slips into a pocket, can be fired from a pocket and is very forgiving of lubrication issues.

 

[stevemis]

Our CZ-75 P01's were designed for some serious conditions. Here's a small snippet involving extreme temperatures.

Steve

Read the whole thing on CZ's site: http://www.cz-usa.com/media_releases.php?m=4&msgid=37

The pistol must also complete an environmental conditions test:
This means cold, heat, dust/sand and mud.
The pistol must fire after being frozen for 24 hours at –35C (-36F).
The pistol must fire after being heated for 24 hours at 70C (126F)
The pistol must fire after being submerged in mud, sand and combinations including being stripped of oil then completing the sand and mud tests again.

 

[whited]

.

I'd probably go with the revolver (assuming I felt comfortable with it).

Simple, goes bang, etc...

 

[CWL]

While I don't think that your 1911 will really ever fail (yes, I've been to MN in wintertime), especially if you use grease to lube...

I do know that one of the reasons why the Austrian Military adopted the Glock pistol is because polymer is not affected as much in sub-zero temperatures. This was one of their criteria because there are still many Austrians with memories of the brutal winters spent in WWII Russia and what sub-zero temps did to steel weapons (btw they used sunflower seed oil as a weapons lube for extreme cold.)

 

[cslinger]

I know an HK-VP70z has very few moving parts and my be a good choice.

Yeah like the trigger. Sorry I couldn't resist.

 

[Ken Rainey]

If you use your Colt I'd use a very light oil and check/clean it every two or three days but since you've already got a Glock, I'd use that, again with a light oil and very little of it, and check/clean it every week as it'll take the temperature changes without worry of corrosion better than your all steel guns and you won't have to back the hammer for every shot as with your single action revolvers.

As was said earlier, make sure your gloved hand fits in the trigger guard well without preloading your trigger else you may have a discharge that you didn't intend to and also make sure the glove don't impede the slides reward movement during recoil. On the other hand, if you're proficient with your single action revolvers with a gloved hand, then pick a low pressure cartridge and use them with the same two or three day check/clean regime.

It's all about the proper maintenance for the conditions...any of them will work but the Glock should require less than the rest.

 

[357wheelgunner]

"Glock 31 or 20. Power to crush through heavy coats and good capacities."

Ha ha yeah all of those coats that repel .38 special and 9mm and .40, gotta watch for them. I read in a book that before the .45 was invented no one was ever killed in the winter thanks to all of the badass coats around!

 

[Lou22]

Here's a suggestion for a car gun: a EAA Windicator .357 snubbie. They're inexpensive - I paid about $200 new for mine. They are not much to look at so you don't mind it getting a little banged up. I bought mine a couple months back as just something to play around with. I was really surprised with how smooth the action was and how accurate it was. It's heavy enough at 28oz so full-house magnum loads were easy to shoot. Plus it holds 6 rounds. And if you have to shoot somebody you don't mind too much the police confiscating it.

Lou

 

[Dienekes]

What I would be concerned about for a defensive gun in extreme cold conditions (beyond absolute reliability) would be a nice long DA trigger. Not only are they much more suitable to high stress situations (simple--will fire when you want them to, and won't when you don't want them to), but gunhandling and fine motor movements go all to hell in extreme cold.

I was raised in that kind of cold, and believe me I know. When it gets really, really cold, most things don't work very well. Some years back I went out in 30 below and shot my old reliable Security Six: 6 rounds, reloaded, and 6 more. Even though your hand goes numb awfully fast, safety was not an issue with a good 10 pound DA trigger. With something like a 1911 or Glock you would absolutely not be able to feel anything within a minute or so. Couple that with the fact that people are held at gunpoint far more often than they are shot, and things could get way too interesting very quickly.

As to function, the real danger is moving the piece from cold to warm back to cold again and getting condensation and then freeze-locking. Think about the temperature cycle in your car, because that's what you're putting the weapon through when you leave it in there--10/15/20 below; get nice and toasty warm, then shut it down again, and repeat. Also promotes rust.

That said, I would consider a stainless DA revolver to be the best tool under those conditions.

 

[Autolycus]

I know HK will work fine. I imagine the GLock would do fine.

Honestly most guns will be fine.

 

[razorburn]

Wouldn't simply inserting the gun in some sort of case or wrapper inside the car create two layers of insulation which would save it from the worst of it?

From the cold? No. The gun isn't alive and doesn't generate body heat, so there was never any heat in there anyways to try to hold onto with insulation. The gun will be cold, case will be cold, put them together and you just have a cold gun in cold case. Possibly if you put it in a heatpack with it. Or I guess if you vacumn seal the wrapper you'd at least keep water-laden air out of it.

 

[Zach S]

If I were you, I'd use the G26. And I wouldn't bother with a vault. The G26 (or my G19 with an M3 for that matter) is small enough to hide out of sight in a door pocket, center console, the holster mounted where my ashtray used to be, etc, but still be readily acessable. The G26, being smaller, and not having an M3, will likely give you more options. But it may not depending on what you drive (I drive a caprice an an F150).

Be sure to refresh your carry ammo when you can. Constant temperture changes may loosen up the crimp (I've been told this, but havent experianced it myself, but carry ammo is refreshed every two weeks or so).

 

[MCgunner]

For any gun that will be stored a long time in inclimate weather of any kind, six for sure. Forget autoloaders. I prefer to regularly maintain autoloaders. Revolvers shrug off inattention better, especially stainless ones. The M971 Rossi .357 I traded away would have been great for this, stainless, rugged, accurate, and .357 power.

Personally, I don't have a "car gun". I don't drive a car enough to justify such, just a carry gun with me 24/7 on my motorcycles, in my van, on foot, whatever, I always have it.