Green Tipped 5.56 NATO Vs. 5.56 55gr

[CapnMac]

This is my first rifle that's fired both. So I'm a bit green behind the ears if you know what I mean.

The distinction between .223 and 5.56, is, functionally, similar to that between .308 and 7.62x51 (e.g. 7.62nato).

Which does not prevent massive flame wars online and all manner of dire warnings in every possible direction.

In the present case, generally, a 5.56 labeled barrel will handle .223 ammo.
Where the distinction lies, as noted well above is in the twist rate of the barrel used.
Which unlike most other arms in a given caliber has seen significant changes over the fifty year history of the 5.56nato/.223--and not in a uniform way, either.

Note the Venn Diagram above. There are reasons that people will still want to use 1:12 twist barrels. So, it's not like the slower twist barrels have completely replaced fast twist. Well, other than the serious long range shooters--where ling heavy bullets are king.

The twist rate on your barrel is what will matter most. It should be stamped in to the metal some place visible--either at the breech end or muzzle.

And, as noted above, the best this is to get a hold of several brands, and bullet weights, and see what you shoot in your rifle best.

 

[FL-NC]

Asking a rather dumb question, but if one has a rather large stash (like 3 full spam cases of it), of M855, 62 gr, green tipped ammo, what is the best use for it with the exception of just plinking?

Nothing dumb about that question. If it were me, I would try to work out a trade with someone whom likes M855. A trade that involved me ending up with more rounds than the amount of M855 I gave up in the trade. I would be happy to trade 1000 rounds of M855 for 1500 rounds of something "inferior", like 55 grain PMC or M193. You see, some people are convinced that US mil issued items of all sorts are superior to everything else. I personally don't agree with this idea, but everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Obviously, the military would NEVER settle for issuing our troops an inferior product (or something that just doesn't work) when better stuff is available, right?

 

[tark]

Actually it isn't the 62Gr M855 (SS109) that needs the 1-7 twist to stabilize. The 1-7 twist is required for the M856 tracer to properly stabilize since it is a bit longer than the M855.

I have always been confused on this. I have fired M-856 tracers through my AR which has a 1-9 twist. They stabilized just fine. Nothing but round holes at 200 yards.

 

[halfmoonclip]

The 1:9 is supposed to be the golden mean for 62 grain bullets, while the tracers were the reason for the 1:7. If my (lousy) memory serves, it may be the tracer issue only occurred at low temperatures.
Rule of thumb, the faster twist (1:7, 1:9) will shoot about anything satisfactorily (if not gilt edged accuracy) while the slower (1:12) wants the lighter bullets.
Buddy got that backwards, and discovered lousy accuracy.
Moon

 

[herrwalther]

There is some variation to this chart about bullet grain in relation to barrel twist. I just happened to like this one.

 

[12Bravo20]

I have always been confused on this. I have fired M-856 tracers through my AR which has a 1-9 twist. They stabilized just fine. Nothing but round holes at 200 yards.

Every barrel is different, as we have seen. There was enough of an issue with the longer M856 tracer bullets stabilizing in 1-9 barrels that FN went with the 1-7 twist barrels on the M249. And the reason the M16A2 has the 1-7 twist is so that the US Military and NATO only have to worry about 1 type of 5.56 ball ammo and 1 type of 5.56 tracer ammo.

 

[Charlie98]

I would be happy to trade 1000 rounds of M855 for 1500 rounds of something "inferior", like 55 grain PMC or M193. You see, some people are convinced that US mil issued items of all sorts are superior to everything else.

Straight up. Actually, while I have a smaller stash of M855, I've gone back to 55grn M193 for blasting ammos... for a number of reasons, to include people freaking out when they see the evil Green Tip and think the ammo can penetrate an armored car and explode, or other Hollywood nonsense. I've also found generic 55grn FMJ to be more accurate than M855 generally.

FWIW, my 1:7 Colt H-Bar pretty much hates anything 55grn... but that may be just the rifle itself, or the particular ammos/bullet, or combination thereof. Every rifle is different.

 

[DustyGmt]

I never liked M885 or SS109 green tips. I've never owned an AR that liked them. I like 69gr IMI and 75gr IMI for my 1-7"'s and 55gr and 69gr for my 1-9". I also never really noticed any recoil difference between the M885 and M195, the difference was in accuracy. Patterns like buckshot @100yd

 

[alsaqr]

Last year i went through about 3,500 rounds of 5.56mm M193 ammo. Most was fired in bolt action rifles having slow twist rates. M855 ammo makes patterns when fired from those rifles.

About ten years ago i took 5,000 rounds of M855 in a trade. Last year that ammo went away at the community yard sale.

 

[Ethan Verity]

Though 62gr is my preferred weight, I will usually stock the M193 simply because my local indoor range does not allow M855 due to the steel core damaging the backstop. I still buy it if the price is right, and just shoot it at the outdoor range.

I don't care about the terminal ballistics of either one, for home defense I load a 62gr Federal soft point. XM556FBIT3.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

All this bashing of the M855. Who remembers when the Obama-era ATF tried to rule M855 as "AP" and, because there were AR pistols out there, it was "AP for handguns" and would be subsequently banned. People lost their minds.

I don't think M855 will penetrate Level IV plate any more than M193.

 

[redcon1]

I have a Bushmaster Carbon 15 pistol. It has a 7.25" barrel and a 1:9 twist. It keyholes SS109s. The barrel is too short to stabilize the bullet. Twist rate is important for bullet stability of course but barrel length plays a role too as it contributes to muzzle velocity and muzzle velocity is a component of the calculation we use to determine the bullet's RPMs and RPM's are what stabilize bullets.

Bullet RPM = MV X 720/Twist Rate (in inches)

 

[amd6547]

All this bashing of the M855. Who remembers when the Obama-era ATF tried to rule M855 as "AP" and, because there were AR pistols out there, it was "AP for handguns" and would be subsequently banned. People lost their minds.

I don't think M855 will penetrate Level IV plate any more than M193.

Well, they used the same reasoning to ban import of cheap surplus 7n6 5.45 ammo...even though there weren't any 5.45 pistols.

 

[DustyGmt]

Well, they used the same reasoning to ban import of cheap surplus 7n6 5.45 ammo...even though there weren't any 5.45 pistols.

Wasn't the 7N6 ban due to it actually being classified as "AP" whereas the SS109 was made for barrier penetration and not armor defeating, even though it will defeat most any soft armor and some plates. Is 7N6 a tungsten carbide penetrator or just steel like the SS109?

 

[amd6547]

7n6 is just steel core...not AP.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

7n6 is just steel core...not AP.

I thought steel core was AP.

 

[amd6547]

In pistol rounds. Thus, the attempt to ban the 62gn 5.56 due to “pistols”. The uproar then prevented it. No such luck for 5.45, which was very cheap by the case at the time. Those cheap spam cans of 7n6 5.45 are worth some dough, now.

I thought steel core was AP.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

In pistol rounds.

Then what constitutes an AP round in a rifle?

 

[amd6547]

Then what constitutes an AP round in a rifle?

The difference is pistol or rifle…
Pistol AP is verboten. Rifle AP or even API armor piercing incendiary is perfectly fine to own and shoot, limited only by your wallet.

 

[DustyGmt]

The difference is pistol or rifle…
Pistol AP is verboten. Rifle AP or even API armor piercing incendiary is perfectly fine to own and shoot, limited only by your wallet.

Then how come 7N6 ended up getting axed? Wasn't the push to ban SS109/M885 during the same admin., same term? On what basis did they fail to ban one over the other. Just curious. It seems pretty stupid since the only 5.45's available were AK rifle variants, unless they zeroed in on the Draco style pistols of which I'm not even sure we're available in anything other than 762x39/.223

 

[RevolvingGarbage]

There was quite a bit of vocal uproar to keep the ban on M855 from going through. There was far far less of the population interested in 5.45 in any platform so there wasn’t enough push back against it. It’s as simple as that and it’s a great example of exactly how important it is for people to make noise loudly and often whenever these proposals are announced.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

The difference is pistol or rifle…
Pistol AP is verboten. Rifle AP or even API armor piercing incendiary is perfectly fine to own and shoot, limited only by your wallet.

Interesting. I thought the manufacture of AP ammo (all types) had been banned decades ago.

 

[Charlie98]

Interesting. I thought the manufacture of AP ammo (all types) had been banned decades ago.

M855 is considered LAP... or light armor piercing. The PMC commercial says it right on the box.

 

[lonniemike]

You may make your own AP for yourself. You just can't sell, manufacture, or trade AP without the required paperwork. BestAll

 

[Uffdaphil]

My experience with 1:7, 1:8 twist barrels of 18” to 10.3” is that M855 green tip has maybe a 1-2 moa wider spread than M193 at 100 yards. Which is why I no longer use green tip for an initial rough zero before fine tuning with more expensive ammo.