Gun Control and Civil Disobedience

Status
Not open for further replies.
C

ColinthePilot

Member
Joined
Oct 11, 2007
Messages
1,029
Location
I don't even know anymore
Everyone is so worried about preventing new gun control laws from hitting the books. I completely agree. Nipping it in the bud is the best way to go. But what about when the crazy laws finally DO get passed? History shows that they will. Are we going to play sheep like the UK and line up to turn in our guns?
No one ever talks about simple civil disobedience. It worked for the civil rights movement in the 1960's. Martin Luther King preached it and after years of work simply breaking the law got the laws changed.
Same thing happened for the nationwide 55MPH speed limit. People just kept speeding, and eventually we saw speed limits upwards of 70-75mph in some areas.
So when the call comes in to turn in our guns, will we do it? I'm pretty sure I won't.
 
The Supreme Court is currently considering the Washington DC ban. Currently the 2nd Amendment has not been applied to the States. Depending on how this case comes down, even if the Court were to rule the 2nd means what all gun owners know that it means it depends on how the opinion is written as to whether it will apply to the states.

If the 2nd does not apply to the States. Then it will depend on the State Constitution to protect us. Fortunately, at least so far, the Georgia Court has protected the rights of gun owners fairly well.

I have never considered what I would do as to the original question, but I believe I would only respond to an order directly to me as to what I was supposed to give up. I definately would not line up and turn in everything I have as the result of a generic order.

But I am not sure if I would comply or not.
 
As it's been said before, I'm more afraid of ammo and places to shoot being restricted to the point of oblivion. If I literally read the 2nd amendment correctly, I only have the right to keep (own) and bear (carry) firearms. Even though the "intent" is there, there's nothing in the physical writing of the 2nd amendment protecting ammo and where/when firearms can be used. I foresee many prohibitions coming down the line where ranges will be forced out of business due to regulations, cost, unable to obtain insurance etc.. Gov't could restrict shooting on federal land, too. We're already seeing these further impositions with bills requiring microstamping and individual cartridge serialization. I really, really hope I'm wrong, but that's how I see it going down. After all, our right to keep and bear arms (just the arms themselves) aren't being infringed, right? Methinks we just might end up with a bunch of expensive paperweights that we cannot legally use. :rolleyes:
 
I won't turn mine in... My right to self defense supersedes the US Government's rights.

SupernovaNole
Click to expand...

And if you resist, right or wrong, with lethal force, you, and possibly your family, will be killed. What do you think your neighbors who feel the same was as you are going to do after seeing you (and yours) get wasted? Eff that...(begrudgingly), here you go, Mr. Fed.Gov.

It doesn't matter what you think...only what fed.gov thinks. It's not right, but it is what it is. Those people at Waco were pretty well armed, but what happened in the end? Even though they may have been in the wrong, they resisted and were ultimately destroyed. In the end, the fed.gov ultimately got their arms. Ruby Ridge, too. ANY armed standoff with fed.gov is NOT going to end well for any civilian(s). You think you can really fight off the local police supplemented by the National Guard and possibly other military support? I don't like it any more than you do, but that's how it is. 1) turn them over peacefully and live another day with your family, 2) resist and get arrested...fed.gov still gets your guns via confiscation, or 3) resist with lethal force and you're a gonner and fed.gov still gets your guns. This isn't like colonial times when we had equivalent weapons. We've been FAR outclassed for a long time. I don't know about you, but I don't think even a bunch of civilians banded together will last very long against armored vehicles, mechanized infantry, armed helicopters, hordes of troops with select fire weapons, body armor, grenades, etc...when/if they come for them. Katrina might just be a taste of what's to come, legal, constitutional...or not.
 
I get a little bit sad, angry, and upset each time I consider scenarios like these.
 
Wow, General Geoff just proved that a picture is, indeed, worth a thousand words. Or my wordy post above. :D

And, in his cartoon, for those of you that think our own police and military won't act against fellow country men... Again, reference Katrina. The only reason no civilians were killed was because no one resisted with lethal force causing fed.gov to retaliate like they did at Waco, TX. Not all of them will, but a great many of them would see true American "freedom fighters" as nothing more than insurgents and will be labeled as rogues and such. After all, we're trying to protect and help those people in the middle east right? But as soon as they fire against the ruling power/US, all bets are all and they're toast.

And then there's still the UN troops who won't care about us, either, when/if a global ban on small arms occurs. It's not that they just won't care...a lot of foreign UN troops hate us to the core, too. :fire:
 
So when the call comes in to turn in our guns, will we do it?
Click to expand...

Yes.
If the American gun owners had any guts we wouldn't have states that get away with violating gun owner's rights.
It's become so bad that we call some states "The People's Republic of ........".

If the government did ban guns, they would make a big show of arresting and pretty much wrecking the lives of some people that refused to turn in their guns.
The rest of the gun owners using the excuse, "I have to look after my family" will rush to turn in their guns.

There will still be some people that will try to hide guns and when caught the government will treat them worse than a murderer.
 
There was a term once used in this great Republic called nullification. For those who have never heard of it because of government education, too much Faux News, or sheepish behaviour, look it up. It's a wonderful concept.
 
Last edited:
Takhtakaal, that's all well and good, but the kiddos in Red Dawn didn't have their own government coming after them. Only the invaders were looking for them with no initial intel... The only thing that allowed those kids to survive for so long was their constant movement and the enemy never really knew where they were...until that traitor swallowed the tracking device. I understand the "Wolverines...never give up...Molon Labe!" attitude, but if they ever had a dedicated stand off with the Cubans/Russians? They wouldn't have lasted 10 minutes.

In contrast, our fed.gov already knows exactly where we live, work, what we report on our taxes, etc. They know a great deal about our firearms, too, via 4473/FFL/Class III/NFA, etc paper work.
 
It is more a matter of will and determination than weapons parity. A law enforcement or military force cannot impose it's will upon an unwilling populace if the populace is willing to carry the fight. As long as the populace supports the resistance, a central authority cannot win. I used to think as sonyhoppes does. Then I watched our troops get killed on a regular basis in Iraq. The commanders in Iraq know that they have to win over the support of the populace or they cannot win in Iraq. We can win there, but only if we are the good guys.

How many troops would drive up-armored Humvees into American suburban neighborhoods? How many National Guard units would carry out raids in their own local towns? Not many of either I think. Particularly since most military types I've known support gun rights.

Slow loss of our gun rights? Yes, I can see (do see) that happening. A quick "Hand-em all in boys and girls" program? Not unless a vast majority of gun owners roll over. Make an issue of it and hold your ground and the Government will have to back down. Even if the military high command supported it, they would know they couldn't win.

Hand them in if you want. I'll keep mine thanks.
 
So when the call comes in to turn in our guns, will we do it?
Click to expand...
You have to realize that talk like this is largely just fantasy. There won't be a big "gun confiscation day" in the US. Its a simple war of attrition. Check out machine guns, new machine guns, suppressors, etc. If you let gun owners keep what they have, they'll go along peacefully. Its the way its worked for years and exactly what all the "they'll get them ammunition first" guys are going along with as they type on an internet forum ;)
 
Civil disobedience worked for Rev. King and his followers because when people saw the local governments and police forces attacking the blacks and spraying them with fire hoses, they knew it was for no reason. There was no way to really paint attacking non-violent black sitting down in front of a school in a good light. Now, with gun owners, all the authorities have to do is say you were planning on committing murder or terrorism, and you will get absolutely ZERO sympathy from anyone.


Lets say they pass laws that make gun ownership illegal, and thousands of us decide to just ignore it. We go about our lives like normal, just we don't turn in our guns. Since the Libs control what goes on CNN,CBS,NBC,ABC, and MSNBC, they just have to inundate the American people with stories and falsehoods about how most gun owners believe in overthrowing the government, and that they want a violent revolution. Then all it would take is a few incidents of gun owners shooting it our with the ATF over gun confiscations, that the liberal media would most certainly, air on the news 24/7 for weeks, and the government would have all the public support they could ever want in sending agents out to confiscate arms from all of us.
 
I do not agree with you sonyhoppes, but I understand your points.

I look at it this way; given a future Katrina-like scenario on a massive scale, I fully expect a group of large, powerfully built armed men to be kicking down my doors in order to terrorize me and take what I own. Whether they are dressed in SWAT gear (police/military) or black, puffy jackets (gangs) is immaterial. I will most likely die quickly at the hands of roving thugs or slowly in a FEMA camp after being disarmed by the police/military. So as long as I'm going to die anyhow, I might as well go down with a fight.
 
phoglund, have you ever been in the military? There's this little thing called the UCMJ and the oath where we swear to OBEY the orders of the officers appointed over us. We're also sworn to uphold and defend the Constitution, but if something happens and gun confiscation/ownership ban becomes LEGAL, don't think that the military won't respond if directed. No military member wants to go to Leavenworth or the like for disobeyal of a direct order. After all, if it's supposed to be a "peaceful" collection, what's to worry? What happened in Katrina was NOT legal or Constitutional, yet it still happened with police and military (National Guard) support. Even if it's not total military/police cooperation, those remaining will always have superior firepower and we will, sadly, not last long. Remember, there's always the UCMJ treason charge, too. If it becomes "us against them", any military member siding with "us" could be charged with aiding and abetting the "enemy/us/civilians" and be summarily put to death...if it comes to that. Our military members are in Iraq helping the people there who are supposed to be on "our side", but think what would happen to that troop who sympathized with the fundamentalists and picked up arms against the US military. Nothing good would ever happen to him...or her, to be PC.
 
The 2nd Amendment has been pretty well regarded as a "Hands Off" issue due to the firing of so many anti-gun politicos in the house and senate...but there are ways of superceding 2A without so much as casting a shadow on it.
It's known as licensing and taxation...and not on guns. Ammunition will be the thing that comes under fire next...and it'll be a hard one to win.

Heavy restrictions and taxes on ammunition will make it a de facto ban. Without ammo, the guns might as well be welded up and hung on the wall.

In an early interview...before the Brady Bunch was operating with a full head of steam...Sarah Brady remarked:

"We may not be able to get your guns, but we'll damn well get your ammunition."

Clear enough?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

D
  • Locked
WA Gun Owners Stage The Largest Felony Civil Disobedience Rally In America’s History
2 3 4
Replies
75
Views
4K
Jackal
Jackal
LiveLife
  • Locked
Our Sheriffs have spoken - Is it time for civil disobedience by gun owners?
2
Replies
34
Views
2K
mcdonl
M
K
  • Locked
Of Civil Disobedience and the High Road
Replies
16
Views
1K
Frank Ettin
Frank Ettin
D
  • Locked
(Canada) Civil disobedience over unjust gun law no stunt
Replies
0
Views
440
Drizzt
D
JTHunter
  • Locked
Dear Left, No More Gun Control
Replies
17
Views
1K
Walkalong
Walkalong
Back
Top