Rem.222
Member
S/n 61839
Hammer
One patent on cylinder
Small button on left.
Address on left side of barrel
DA
Adjustable
Hammer
One patent on cylinder
Small button on left.
Address on left side of barrel
DA
Adjustable
H&R SPORTSMAN Research
- Thread starter 32 Magnum
- Start date
- Status
32 Magnum
Member
Rem.222,
Thanks for the info. Added to my data base.
Here's what I see about your gun: 1st Model 6th Variation, made in 1937. The cylinder is from an earlier batch made in 1933 or 34 - BUT is original to your gun. By '37 the newly made cylinders were being stamped with 2 Patent numbers.
Thanks for the info. Added to my data base.
Here's what I see about your gun: 1st Model 6th Variation, made in 1937. The cylinder is from an earlier batch made in 1933 or 34 - BUT is original to your gun. By '37 the newly made cylinders were being stamped with 2 Patent numbers.
Rem.222
Member
Thanks that makes mine 74 yrs old. Now to find a period holster, 4in &/or a 22 special. A collector may be born. lol
32 Magnum
Member
.45 Guy
Rem.222
Glad to help out. Thanks for thanking.
MERRYCHRISTMAS
Rem.222
Glad to help out. Thanks for thanking.
MERRYCHRISTMAS
Interesting thread. Here is the dope on my Dad's worn out 6" barrel specimin.
Neat gun. I wish it were possible to fix the sloppy cylinder (worn cylinder and base pin) for something close to what the gun was worth. Although I would prefer a 4" barrel. It would also be neat to get a second grip and rasp it down to sort of a bird's head shape.
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=155121&stc=1&d=1324431084[/img
[img]http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=155122&stc=1&d=1324431084
mike
678xx. The last three digits are also on the back face of the cylinder but I used the blur tool in GIMP to obliterate in the picture. Full number is stamped on the left side of the frame under the grip and on the front strap.
Hammer mounted rebounding hammer. Thus only 8 rounds in the cylinder.
There is a rim around the cylinder at the back so that the cartridge heads are not visible through the side. I presume that is the safety rim. I didn't see any patent numbers anywhere.
small square button.
Right Side
DA, even says so on the left side of the barrel.
Fixed, pinned.
Neat gun. I wish it were possible to fix the sloppy cylinder (worn cylinder and base pin) for something close to what the gun was worth. Although I would prefer a 4" barrel. It would also be neat to get a second grip and rasp it down to sort of a bird's head shape.
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=155121&stc=1&d=1324431084[/img
[img]http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=155122&stc=1&d=1324431084
mike
Attachments
32 Magnum
Member
MASHAFFER,
Thanks for the info on your SPORTSMAN - info logged in data file.
From your description - your gun is a 1st Model 6th Variation, made in (probably) late 1937. The lack of PATENT numbers stamped into the cylinder is a feature that shows up occasionally in that series - why? I don't know. Most others show 2 PATENT numbers stamped one above the other into a space between flutes. It may mean that the frame was made in the time specified, but not assembled into a complete firearms until later. This possibility is becoming more likely as I include more data into the research.
Good luck in getting yours back up to 'spec'.
Merry Christmas
Thanks for the info on your SPORTSMAN - info logged in data file.
From your description - your gun is a 1st Model 6th Variation, made in (probably) late 1937. The lack of PATENT numbers stamped into the cylinder is a feature that shows up occasionally in that series - why? I don't know. Most others show 2 PATENT numbers stamped one above the other into a space between flutes. It may mean that the frame was made in the time specified, but not assembled into a complete firearms until later. This possibility is becoming more likely as I include more data into the research.
Good luck in getting yours back up to 'spec'.
Merry Christmas
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Thanks 32, unfortunately it appears that Numrich no longer has cylinders. They do have 6" barrels (no 4" left though). I am afraid that the bearing surfaces on both are hopelessly worn. In desperation I tried building the surfaces on the barrel assembly up with JB weld and sanding it back to size once but once the outer most surface was reduced to the point that it passed the entrance of the cylinder it was so small that it still flopped around inside the cylinder when fully installed. Apparently the surface inside the cylinder at the rear is more worn than at the front. So major reworking of the existing parts would seem to be necessary in order to make it work.
mike
mike
golanglobus
Member
1. SN 49209, think it's all matching but can't read numbers on ejector, needs a good cleaning.
2. Firing pin on hammer.
3. Safety rim present, two patent numbers.
4. Small push button.
5. Worcester, MA, right side.
6. DA
7. Adjustable
Very good condition, paid ~$170 after sales tax.
Good luck with your research,
Eric
2. Firing pin on hammer.
3. Safety rim present, two patent numbers.
4. Small push button.
5. Worcester, MA, right side.
6. DA
7. Adjustable
Very good condition, paid ~$170 after sales tax.
Good luck with your research,
Eric
Attachments
32 Magnum
Member
golanglobus,
Thanks for the data. I've entered it into my data base.
Your SPORTSMAN has all the characteristics of the 1st Model 6th Variation and the frame was most likely made in 1937. The 6th Variation is quickly becoming the most commonly seen. It appears that several tens of thousands of numbered frames and/or completed guns were made in the periond 1934 - 38. Since this time period is during the height of the GREAT DEPRESSION and the SPORTSMAN was one of the highest cost revolvers in H&R's line - I'm finding it difficult to understand how so many would have been sold during that time. The answer seems to be that many were built and then stockpiled in warehouse and sold as needed from inventory. I have data on one piece with a 30K serial number probably made in 1933-34 - 35 that was inspected and cleared for sale (by factory tag) in March of 1944.
Nice gun, thanks for sharing.
Thanks for the data. I've entered it into my data base.
Your SPORTSMAN has all the characteristics of the 1st Model 6th Variation and the frame was most likely made in 1937. The 6th Variation is quickly becoming the most commonly seen. It appears that several tens of thousands of numbered frames and/or completed guns were made in the periond 1934 - 38. Since this time period is during the height of the GREAT DEPRESSION and the SPORTSMAN was one of the highest cost revolvers in H&R's line - I'm finding it difficult to understand how so many would have been sold during that time. The answer seems to be that many were built and then stockpiled in warehouse and sold as needed from inventory. I have data on one piece with a 30K serial number probably made in 1933-34 - 35 that was inspected and cleared for sale (by factory tag) in March of 1944.
Nice gun, thanks for sharing.
During the (first) Great Depression many gun manufacturers, including Colt & Smith & Wesson, over produced both parts and completed guns because they did not want to lose they're workers and the skills they represented. Without them they couldn't produce anything, as sometimes they didn't even have a complete set of blueprints of their most popular models. Had it not been for World War Two they would have probably gone bankrupt.
During the war all of these companies produced guns using previously made parts, and the ability to make these guns greatly added to the supply at a time of desperate need. There was no commercial market. Anything that was produced went to either the military services or the Defense Supply Corporation (DSC).
What was left after the war, which wasn’t much, was quickly sold off to meet post-war demand.
During the war all of these companies produced guns using previously made parts, and the ability to make these guns greatly added to the supply at a time of desperate need. There was no commercial market. Anything that was produced went to either the military services or the Defense Supply Corporation (DSC).
What was left after the war, which wasn’t much, was quickly sold off to meet post-war demand.
Just put a 1957 Sportsman on Layaway (it's been a big gun month). 
Serial starts with a T. Firing pin on hammer. Overall in excellent shape. Should have in the next few weeks...
Looks exactly like this gun (not my photo) down to the jeweled hammer.
Serial starts with a T. Firing pin on hammer. Overall in excellent shape. Should have in the next few weeks...
Looks exactly like this gun (not my photo) down to the jeweled hammer.
Ralph G. Briscoe
Member
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2006
- Messages
- 56
"It has become apparent, recently, that there are some holes in the H&R SPORTSMAN history and development both in the Double Action 999 and the Single Action 199. More research is warranted to fill in those holes. IF you own any H&R SPORTSMAN and would like to contribute to the research, I would appreciate the following information (pics would be a great asset):"
1. Serial Number (partials are welcome, but entire numbers will help more)?
B3089
2. Firing pin on hammer or mounted in frame?
Hammer
3. Safety rim on cylinder? PATENT APPLIED FOR; one patent number; two patent numbers? >>Safety rim
4. Cylinder release: 1" long lever on right side -or- small push button on left side of frame right in front of cylinder. >> Small push button.
5. Location of Manufacturer's address - on top of barrel -or- on right side?
6. DA or SA? >>Rt. side
7. Adjustable or fixed front sight? If fixed - soldered in slot or pinned in slot? >>adjustable
Hope this is helpful. Glad you're doing this research. My Sportsman belonged to a WWI veteran I was privileged to know in his later years. I've always wondered about the age of the gun. He obviously thought highly of it--it's in close to new condition.
1. Serial Number (partials are welcome, but entire numbers will help more)?
B3089
2. Firing pin on hammer or mounted in frame?
Hammer
3. Safety rim on cylinder? PATENT APPLIED FOR; one patent number; two patent numbers? >>Safety rim
4. Cylinder release: 1" long lever on right side -or- small push button on left side of frame right in front of cylinder. >> Small push button.
5. Location of Manufacturer's address - on top of barrel -or- on right side?
6. DA or SA? >>Rt. side
7. Adjustable or fixed front sight? If fixed - soldered in slot or pinned in slot? >>adjustable
Hope this is helpful. Glad you're doing this research. My Sportsman belonged to a WWI veteran I was privileged to know in his later years. I've always wondered about the age of the gun. He obviously thought highly of it--it's in close to new condition.
Andy4802
Member
Hi 32Mag,
I came upon your thread while doing some of my own research on the 'net regarding my new-to-me H&R revolver. Looks like a great forum so I decided to join and I'll start by contributing to your thread.
1. Serial Number S16797
2. Firing pin on hammer
3. Safety rim on cylinder? If my understanding of what constitutes a safety rim is correct, then yes (I assume it is the protruding lip or rim around the edge of the cylinder. There are no patent markings on the cyl.
4. Cylinder release: 1" long lever on right side
5. Location of Manufacturer's address - on top of barrel
6. Single Action
7. Fixed / pinned front sight.
I picked this little beauty up for 69$. It is functional, however the ejector doesnt work and the cylinder does not index properly. The ejector can be pushed out by hand when the cylinder is off the gun, and the spring seems good. The cylinder can also be indexed manually and does "click" into place properly in all 9 positions. I suspect a good cleaning may solve both issues but I am also open to suggestions.
pics:
I came upon your thread while doing some of my own research on the 'net regarding my new-to-me H&R revolver. Looks like a great forum so I decided to join and I'll start by contributing to your thread.
1. Serial Number S16797
2. Firing pin on hammer
3. Safety rim on cylinder? If my understanding of what constitutes a safety rim is correct, then yes (I assume it is the protruding lip or rim around the edge of the cylinder. There are no patent markings on the cyl.
4. Cylinder release: 1" long lever on right side
5. Location of Manufacturer's address - on top of barrel
6. Single Action
7. Fixed / pinned front sight.
I picked this little beauty up for 69$. It is functional, however the ejector doesnt work and the cylinder does not index properly. The ejector can be pushed out by hand when the cylinder is off the gun, and the spring seems good. The cylinder can also be indexed manually and does "click" into place properly in all 9 positions. I suspect a good cleaning may solve both issues but I am also open to suggestions.
pics:
32 Magnum
Member
Andy,
Welcome to the forum.
You have a SINGLE ACTION SPORTSMAN Model 199. From the attributes, it's a 4th Variation made between 1937 and 1941. The "Safety Rim" is, indeed, the raised rim around the back end of the cylinder - added to prevent metal and gas escape when a case head separated on the old Hi Velocity smokeless .22lr loads back in the early 1930s.
The problems you're experiencing are "sometimes" correctible simply by soaking the gun in good quality gun oil and then properly cleaning all the gunk out of the mechanisms. If that doesn't do it - then you need parts and a gunsmith, if you're not up to repairing these old fellers. Make sure you clean-out INSIDE the quill - use a cotton swab, but make sure you get all the cotton out of there after cleaning - I've been there and done that. The gun shows a lot of finish wear and staining. A good cleaning with FLITZ or METALGLO lightly abrasive past polish will brighten it up a bit. Make sure you follow the directions and use a very soft (flannel if you have it) rag and light pressure during use.
Thanks for the information, I've added it to my research data base.
Picture shows cylinder from one made close to yours with 2 Patent numbers.
Welcome to the forum.
You have a SINGLE ACTION SPORTSMAN Model 199. From the attributes, it's a 4th Variation made between 1937 and 1941. The "Safety Rim" is, indeed, the raised rim around the back end of the cylinder - added to prevent metal and gas escape when a case head separated on the old Hi Velocity smokeless .22lr loads back in the early 1930s.
The problems you're experiencing are "sometimes" correctible simply by soaking the gun in good quality gun oil and then properly cleaning all the gunk out of the mechanisms. If that doesn't do it - then you need parts and a gunsmith, if you're not up to repairing these old fellers. Make sure you clean-out INSIDE the quill - use a cotton swab, but make sure you get all the cotton out of there after cleaning - I've been there and done that. The gun shows a lot of finish wear and staining. A good cleaning with FLITZ or METALGLO lightly abrasive past polish will brighten it up a bit. Make sure you follow the directions and use a very soft (flannel if you have it) rag and light pressure during use.
Thanks for the information, I've added it to my research data base.
Picture shows cylinder from one made close to yours with 2 Patent numbers.
Andy4802
Member
Thanks for the great info!
Picked up my Sportsman today (couldn't hold out any longer).
Spent some time cleaning her up.
Previous owner had "slathered" white paint on the front sight and red all over the rear. Had to remove the sight blade to get all of the paint off.
Little bit of rust on the left underside of barrel, other than that she looks almost new.
I'm happy, she cleaned up real nice for being 55 years old...
1. Serial Number: T3160, '160' on cylinder and extractor.
2. Firing pin on hammer.
3. Safety rim on cylinder. No patent number(s).
4. Cylinder release: small push button on left side of frame right in front of cylinder.
5. Location of Manufacturer's address - No address at all.
6. DA
7. Adjustable front sight.
This same info is posted on Gun Collectors Forum
Spent some time cleaning her up.
Previous owner had "slathered" white paint on the front sight and red all over the rear. Had to remove the sight blade to get all of the paint off.
Little bit of rust on the left underside of barrel, other than that she looks almost new.
I'm happy, she cleaned up real nice for being 55 years old...
1. Serial Number: T3160, '160' on cylinder and extractor.
2. Firing pin on hammer.
3. Safety rim on cylinder. No patent number(s).
4. Cylinder release: small push button on left side of frame right in front of cylinder.
5. Location of Manufacturer's address - No address at all.
6. DA
7. Adjustable front sight.
This same info is posted on Gun Collectors Forum
32 Magnum
Member
Andy,
You're very welcome. Thanks for thanking.
You're very welcome. Thanks for thanking.
32 Magnum
Member
C-Fish,
Thanks for the data - I've recorded it - yours is the first 'T' prefix that I have logged...
Looks like H&R skipped putting their address on handguns for a couple years. I have yours and a 'U' prefix that have no address stamp.
Thanks for the data - I've recorded it - yours is the first 'T' prefix that I have logged...
Looks like H&R skipped putting their address on handguns for a couple years. I have yours and a 'U' prefix that have no address stamp.
32 Magnum
Member
Ralph G. Briscoe,
Thanks for the info - I have logged it into my data base.
Your gun is a 1st Model 7th Variation made in 1941 - the last year of regular production before WW2 - when production was greatly slowed with only a very few assembled from parts on hand. Honor the SPORTSMAN in memory of your friend. In near new condition - pieces from that era will top out near $400 RETAIL in today's market.
Thanks for sharing and thanks for thanking.
Thanks for the info - I have logged it into my data base.
Your gun is a 1st Model 7th Variation made in 1941 - the last year of regular production before WW2 - when production was greatly slowed with only a very few assembled from parts on hand. Honor the SPORTSMAN in memory of your friend. In near new condition - pieces from that era will top out near $400 RETAIL in today's market.
Thanks for sharing and thanks for thanking.
Gordon
Member
1. Serial Number (partials are welcome, but entire numbers will help more)?
AS38286
2. Firing pin on hammer or mounted in frame?
Frame mounted
3. Safety rim on cylinder? PATENT APPLIED FOR; one patent number; two patent numbers?
Safety rim No patent #
4. Cylinder release: 1" long lever on right side -or- small push button on left side of frame right in front of cylinder.
Small "button" on rt. front
5. Location of Manufacturer's address - on top of barrel -or- on right side?
Rt side ,Gardner Mass.
6. DA or SA?
BOTH!
7. Adjustable or fixed front sight? If fixed - soldered in slot or pinned in slot?
Adj front pinned pivot front end screw
This fine gun was purchased by me recently for less than $300 and appears as new with slight muzzle blue wear from holstering. It Has an 11 pound DA trigger pull and a 7 pound SA pull but I do good plinking work with it. I shoot mostly CB longs and have sighted it in at 50' with Remington Sub Sonic Low Noise HP ammo. When I rested it it got 1" groups at that range, nice to have those adj sights but they are pretty well centered indicating this gun is well put together, The polish job on it is superb and the walnut and checkering are better than what S&W currently produces.It has a nicely done pierced thru vent rib. The machining in the frame opening and around the latch and cylinder is excellent. I flushed this gun in an ultra sonic tank to pull out the old old gunk and relubed it with non gumming gun oil. I must admit I like this gun better than my S&W or Colt .22s for around the yard plinking fun and I intend to wear it down (with careful handling and maintence of course !
) during my remaining lifetime. Thanks for your info on it.
AS38286
2. Firing pin on hammer or mounted in frame?
Frame mounted
3. Safety rim on cylinder? PATENT APPLIED FOR; one patent number; two patent numbers?
Safety rim No patent #
4. Cylinder release: 1" long lever on right side -or- small push button on left side of frame right in front of cylinder.
Small "button" on rt. front
5. Location of Manufacturer's address - on top of barrel -or- on right side?
Rt side ,Gardner Mass.
6. DA or SA?
BOTH!
7. Adjustable or fixed front sight? If fixed - soldered in slot or pinned in slot?
Adj front pinned pivot front end screw
This fine gun was purchased by me recently for less than $300 and appears as new with slight muzzle blue wear from holstering. It Has an 11 pound DA trigger pull and a 7 pound SA pull but I do good plinking work with it. I shoot mostly CB longs and have sighted it in at 50' with Remington Sub Sonic Low Noise HP ammo. When I rested it it got 1" groups at that range, nice to have those adj sights but they are pretty well centered indicating this gun is well put together, The polish job on it is superb and the walnut and checkering are better than what S&W currently produces.It has a nicely done pierced thru vent rib. The machining in the frame opening and around the latch and cylinder is excellent. I flushed this gun in an ultra sonic tank to pull out the old old gunk and relubed it with non gumming gun oil. I must admit I like this gun better than my S&W or Colt .22s for around the yard plinking fun and I intend to wear it down (with careful handling and maintence of course !
) during my remaining lifetime. Thanks for your info on it.
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