Quantcast
  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

HK 91 / PTR 91 / G3 thread

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by taprackbang, Jun 15, 2008.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. taprackbang

    taprackbang member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2008
    Messages:
    411
    Hello,

    Just wanted to chat with others who own a PTR 91, HK 91, or CETME.
    I bought a PTR 91 and love it. It is my first MBR and I am already looking to
    make additions to it.

    Just seeing if anyone else is out there.
     
  2. leadcounsel

    leadcounsel member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2006
    Messages:
    5,365
    Location:
    Tacoma, WA
    I have the PTR91 and really like it.

    There are some things that are almost necessary fixes though. First, the stock front handguards are worthlessly thin. Spend $100 or so on an aluminum tri-picatinny rail system. Easy fix. Then put handguards or other necessities on it. Second, the hollow plastic stock is worthless. I swapped mine out for a $60 tapco collapsable stock. Much better.

    I then bought 100 magazines for $1 each! A good investment for sure! I don't have pictures now but it's a beautiful setup.
     
  3. Eric F

    Eric F Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2007
    Messages:
    2,934
    I had a g3 clone I think it was a century arms rifle, any way it was built on an aluminum receiver. Bottom line the receiver occasionaly spit out a chunk of metal. I could not tell where it was coming from but I sold it before it broke for good.

    my rifle was about minute of basketball accurate mag changes are fast. but if you have to operate the bolt its slower than other 308 battle rifles. The bonus is mags are plentiful and cheap. Easy to take down. I built a "breif case" to put it in. Was really cool and fun too for the problems I had with it. I have handeled the ptr91 and it is built way better and it was far more accurate.
     
  4. taprackbang

    taprackbang member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2008
    Messages:
    411
    Awesome

    Man you got a better deal than I did on G3 mags. ($3.00 for me) BUT I did find 120 rounds of .308 for .33 cents a round! (Czech surp.) I bought my PTR 91 brand new from CDNN Sports for $899.99!

    Which rear sight setting do you use? I switched from the '100 yard' V-Notch sight to the 300 Yard Peep sight. Seems to work better.
    Hey what ammo does your PTR like best?

    I agree about the buttstock. I cannot get a good 'cheek weld' on that chessy plastic one. Bostons Gun Bible says to drop in a CETME buttstock, that its better.
     
  5. taprackbang

    taprackbang member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2008
    Messages:
    411
    Eric F

    CDNN Sports are selling BRAND NEW PTR 91s for $899.99! Best deal anywhere for new MBR.

    Bostons Gun Bible says, "Many of the modern parts kits (Hesse and CETMEs) won't even hit paper at 100m due to chronic sight misalignment. Unadjusted, it is about 24 MOA off to the left. With the rear sight fully drifted over, POI is still 12" off!"

    He thinks that the barrel is 5-6 degrees off due to insufficient barrel tightening.
     
  6. Eric F

    Eric F Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2007
    Messages:
    2,934
    taprackbang that is likely, centery arms has never produced a MBR in the autoloading fassion that I have found to be accurate by most standard. I have had 3 2fal's and the g3 none were very accurate. then the g3 and the chunks of aluminum comming out of the receiver were kinda scary for me. I got them all in the mid 90's or so for around $499 IIRC I dont have any MBR's any more they are just not my flavor in my older age. And ammo prices the way they are I cant afford to shoot an auto loader right now. lol(like a bolt gun is cheaper to shoot!)
     
  7. taprackbang

    taprackbang member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2008
    Messages:
    411
    What is up with Century Arms? Why cant they put out a workable gun?
    The FAL is another rifle where you have to be selective; or so, I hear. Excellent in the FN, DSA series, but I hear that you have to be careful when selecting a kit built gun.

    I love my PTR, but you are right about the expensive ammo. I have been shooting my Mosin instead.
     
  8. SaxonPig

    SaxonPig Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2006
    Messages:
    4,787
    Around 1980 or so I bought a genuine H&K Model 91. I think I paid $380 for it brand new. I bought all the accessories to go with it. I had that God-awful expensive detachable scope mount, about 10 magazines, the bipod, I even bought the bayonet (don't ask me why).

    Then in June of 1986 my home was burglarized and all of my guns were stolen including this rifle. After a year and it wasn't recovered (only 3 of 23 had been found by that time) I sold all the accessories (separate from the gun and not stolen) to my favorite gun store.

    A friend had just returned from duty with the Army in Germany and he brought back a Belgian made FN FAL he had purchased while stationed there. He offered it to me for $700 as he decided he preferred 5.56 rifles. I still have that rifle.

    In 2003 I got a postcard from the Los Angeles PD saying they had recovered one of my stolen guns from a drug dealer and did I want it back? Hell, yes, I wanted it back. It was the 91. I had to travel to LA to collect it but when I got it back it didn't have a mark on it. Took 17 years but it finally came home. I still have hope for the others.

    I like both guns but maybe prefer the FAL just a tad. The H&K is loud beyond belief. And empties get thrown about 50 yards with the case mouths usually crushed. I shoot military ammo that won't be reloaded in it and forget the cases. I don't know how close the CETMEs and various clones are to the H&K product. I like mine. I never replaced the scope mount etc., but I stocked up when I saw West German surplus mags on sale at $4 each. Bought about 30, I think.

    Here's the 91 on the right with the FN on the left and little brother AR in the middle.


    [​IMG]
     
  9. MJ

    MJ Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2005
    Messages:
    855
    You ar lucky they returned it. I went to pick up my stolen MINT all matching dot 45 and the property room guy had it on the counter grinding off the receiver ring and the eagles on the matching stock destroying my valuable vet gun. Why? He looked me in the eye and said, 'Cuz he can.' What a dick.


    ...MJ...
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2008
  10. Z-Michigan

    Z-Michigan Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2008
    Messages:
    4,047
    Location:
    Michigan
    I have a PTR-91 that I got via CDNN last year. I am reasonably happy with it, but not thrilled. It throws brass so far and hard that you have trouble finding it. So far my accuracy hasn't been very good. I realize that is likely 99% operator issues, but I am accurate with AR's and many other types of rifles. It may be that the PTR doesn't fit me as well. I'm not flinching, and in fact I find the recoil pretty mild for a .308 rifle. I was also surprised at the lack of a last-shot bolt hold-open, though I realize that is how it's been since it was designed as the G3.

    Bottom line - I'll be keeping it, but I don't shoot it much. My next .308 will likely be either a FN-FAL or a bolt action.
     
  11. SaxonPig

    SaxonPig Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2006
    Messages:
    4,787
    No, he can't damage your property.

    Time to lawyer up. They count on it being too expensive to sue them but I don't give a damn what it costs.

    Some cops don't need to be cops.

    Like those asshats.
     
  12. Father Knows Best

    Father Knows Best Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2005
    Messages:
    2,503
    Location:
    Minneapolis, MN, USA
    I have had a PTR-91 for about four years now. What can I say about it? Well...

    It's HEAVY. And terribly balanced (weight is very forward). The OEM stocks were cheaply made. The ergonomics suck. The trigger was the heaviest, creepiest thing ever. The BATFE-mandated push button mag release is the worst bit of jerry-rigged engineering ever. It's loud. It recoils harder than any .308 semiauto should. It throws brass forward and right so far you won't ever find it, which doesn't matter that much because the brass isn't reloadable anyway (case mouths crushed and the fluted chamber leaves striations).

    I love it, anyway. Mine has been modified quite a bit. Bill Springfield did the trigger, and it breaks cleanly now at about 5 pounds. I have a Magpul PRS buttstock, and a G3 wide forearm on it. I put a Tac-Latch paddle mag release on it. I also mounted an original HK claw mount and Hensoldt scope on it. Like others, I bought about 50 mags when they were $1 each.

    So why do I love it? Because it does the important things very, very well. It is extremely accurate for an MBR -- easily shooting 1 MOA at 100 yards with match ammo. It is supremely reliable - always feeding, firing and ejecting without fail. Reliability and accuracy -- those are the most important things in my book.

    I paid $700 for my PTR-91, which is one of the very early ones with a polygonal hammer-forged barrel and plain muzzle (no flash hider). I was the second owner, but the first owner hardly ever touched it. My $700 bought me the PTR-91, a dozen mags and 800 rounds of Argentine milsurp, so the gun itself was pretty cheap. I probably have another $1000 in parts and work into it, but it is money well spent, 'cause I get a grin every time I shoot it.
     
  13. MJ

    MJ Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2005
    Messages:
    855
    $465 new
    [​IMG]

    ...MJ...
     
  14. Dave R

    Dave R Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2002
    Messages:
    3,628
    Location:
    Idaho
    Eventually happy CETME owner here. Search my old posts for more details on my experience with this gun. Here's the short version.

    Bought the CETME at a gun store. It had the common problem of "not enough windage" (because Century did not take enough care assembling it.)

    Took it back to the dealer. Dealer offered to make a new front sight with enough windage, and I agreed. First shootings indicated the gun was accurate, though off target.

    The fix worked, and actually improved accuracy, because I wound up with a finer front sight post.

    The rifle shoots an honest 2MOA, and that includes regular 4" groups at 200 yards. It has not misfed once in the years I have owned it. It is easy to clean. Yes, the trigger is tough, but I'll get Bill Springfield to fix that. Thanks for the reminder, Father Knows Best.

    Mine is very soft recoiling, unlike Father's. Lighter than a 20 ga. Yes, its LOUD. That's the muzzle brake turning recoil into noise. The report doesn't bother the shooter much, but it does bother those to the side. I go off by myself at the range, or I soon wind up by myself, as people move.

    Now, I love the rifle.

    I like the ergonomics. Maybe that's just me, but I like it better then a FAL. As for muzzle-heavy, that has some advantages. I find it easy to hold on target, particularly from a seated position. And the muzzle returns to point of aim after firing. Muzzle-lite guns, like my AK, have a lot more "wander" when I'm not at a bench rest. All the better for a battle rifle.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2008
  15. RLsnow

    RLsnow Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2007
    Messages:
    606
    Location:
    Norway
    Don`t own any weapons (this is Norway after all, and i am only 16 anyway.) but i got to play around with an AG3 about 2 weeks back. (Don`t worry, by play i don`t mean fooling around, rather assemble/dissasemble and getting to know it)

    also got to shoot it some :D that was great fun.

    (BTW, the AG3 is a G3 made in norway for the Norwegian military, the one i get to play with is modified for semi automatic only.)


    I like it alot, got to lug it around with me in the woods, didn`t feel heavy to me. Though i did not have all that much equipment on me.

    Did a lot of Assembly/Disassembly and it was hard on my fingers, got a few cuts and scrapes. At first i was a bit afraid of breaking the thing, but i was told i would break long before i managed to even hurt the rifle.


    Shooting it was a bit overwhelming at first, keeping in mind i had only ever shot 22LR before in my life (several years back) this did not surprise me much. It was not that the recoil bothered me, was more the boom and all that.

    also, using the military sights on those round targets was a bit difficult :p



    All in all, im really looking forward to next time :) hopefully we will get to shoot some more, though that`s not certain.
     
  16. Dave R

    Dave R Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2002
    Messages:
    3,628
    Location:
    Idaho
    Yes, it takes some practice.

    Congratulations on shooting such a fine rifle! I'm sure you enjoyed that.
     
  17. RLsnow

    RLsnow Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2007
    Messages:
    606
    Location:
    Norway
    hehe, it is a fine rifle, though i was told i had to handle it like a MAN! xD

    It didnt make it easier that we didn`t have the tools to adjust the sights to the side xD


    oh well, it was fun, very fun.
     
  18. gcrookston

    gcrookston member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2007
    Messages:
    391
    I've owned several 91's over the years.

    I wanted to make a marksman rifle out of one, but could never achieve the accuracy I wanted (1 MOA), so moved onto other projects, namely finishing up my 93 and M1

    [​IMG]
     
  19. sernv99

    sernv99 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2008
    Messages:
    749
    bought a PTR from CDNN a month ago. The only problem I had was a bad round getting crushed. Cartridge malfunction. The bullet was crushed into the casing. How? I have no idea. This locked up the bolt. I couldn't use the charging handle to rack the bolt back and forth. I had to take the gun and slam the buttstock on a hard surface. That finally loosened up the bolt and I was able to rack the bolt back and expell the deformed cartridge. I then put another 100 rounds through it with out problem.

    The thing I don't like about this gun is the assembly. To get the bolt back together is a pain in the ass. I had trouble putting it together. But it shoots great, a real powerhouse. I shot this pretty good, no complaints on accuracy.
     
  20. Fixxxer

    Fixxxer Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Messages:
    46
    I have a Greek SAR8.

    Closest you can get to a 91, half the price tag.
     
  21. Z-Michigan

    Z-Michigan Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2008
    Messages:
    4,047
    Location:
    Michigan
    sernv99, I agree - the bolt reassembly is really difficult. First time it took me over an hour, and my fingers were sore for a day or two. Supposedly it gets easier with practice.

    Fixxxer - not sure what you mean, but a PTR-91 is a clone of the HK91 made in the US on original HK tooling bought from Portugal. Most people who've looked at both consider the PTR91 to be better made than an authentic HK91. AFAIK, all parts are interchangeable.

    If an "SAR8" is somehow more HK91 than this, or costs less, I'd be curious to hear more.
     
  22. taprackbang

    taprackbang member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2008
    Messages:
    411
    Best PTR 91 ammo

    SaxonPig, cool story about getting your HK back and your original FN. Genuine FNs are going for around $4,000 now.

    I called PTR about what is the best surp ammo. They said best Surp ammo is:

    1. Lake City
    2. Argentine
    3. British
    4. Spanish
    5. Australian

    I fired Australian surp and found it to be accurate. Couple of 1/2 groups at one inch black squares at 25 meters. I just bought some Czech ammo for .33 cents a round, but no report on it yet. The reason for the 5 preferred types is because they don't use any tar sealer in production.

    Stay away from Israeli, Indian, and Pakistani. Just what I heard, but you guys may already know about this.
     
  23. taprackbang

    taprackbang member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2008
    Messages:
    411
    Ammo

    Oh, I forgot about Portuguese. This is good ammo for the PTR.
    I figured out the bolt re-assembly, but it took me about 30 min.
    of finding out the trick of getting the bolt head back on.

    And yes I heard that the PTR 91 is indeed an improved HK91.
     
  24. taprackbang

    taprackbang member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2008
    Messages:
    411
    Has anyone here swapped out the original PTR buttstock for a CETME buttstock? If so, can you tell much of a difference?
     
  25. W.E.G.

    W.E.G. Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2006
    Messages:
    7,362
    Location:
    all over Virginia
    Skateboard-tape CETME.

    Aint she purrrrr-ty?

    [​IMG]
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page