Horseback shooting

[geim druth]

Anyone ever done much shooting from horseback?

I've been reading 'My Sixty Years on the Plains' by William Hamilton. In one part Hamilton and his fellow trappers hold horseback shooting contests with some Shoshones, Utes, and Navajos.

"Three posts were set in the ground, about 25 yards apart. They stood 6 feet out of the ground and were 10 inches in diameter. The top of the post was squared for a distance of about 12 inches. The arms to be used were Colt's six-shooters. Horses were to be put at full speed, passing the posts not closer than 10 feet, and the contestant was to fire 2 shots at each post.
Some of our party put 2 bullets in each post and all at least one. I tried it twice, and was somewhat surprised to find that the best I could do was to place one bullet in each post."


To tell the truth, I'd be happy if I could get one hit from the saddle of a galloping horse! What's it like shooting from horseback?

 

[TonyRumore]

I can't imagine actually firing a round while being on the horse. Growing up in the 80's, my dad normally kept 5 hunting horses on hand at all times. We would normally load out with each of us on a riding horse and he would tow the pack horse with all our crap.

Many times, we would jump a buck, dismount and fire. Even though the horses were acustomed to plenty of gunfire, they would always recoil back and attempt to get the hell out of there pronto. You had better be holding on to the lead rope or your horse would leave your ass stranded in the middle of nowhere.

You better have a trained horse before you try that for the first time, or you're going to find your ass in the dirt.

Tony Rumore
Tromix Corp

 

[TallPine]

One of my goals is to try this, but so far I haven't got past the getting my horse accustomed to gunfire stage yet. Seems that it is either too cold or I am too busy or too tired.

I could probably run a chainsaw from my horse's back though, since he is used to me cutting firewood out of a woodpile right near the corral

 

[TonyRumore]

Our shooting range was only about 40 yards or so from where our horses were kept, and even firing a 7mm Mag or something, they would just look up when the shot went off. No excitement whatsoever. I fired some sort of gun just about every day for about a decade straight.

BUT, when you lit off a high powered rifle 3 feet away from them, you would get a completely different result.

 

[mete]

If you do some searching you could find the old cavalry shooting courses !!

 

[geim druth]

Hamilton and his friends kept certain horses as their 'war' horses.

"The horses also were drilled to stand fire and to be quick in evolutions. The war-whoops and yells of Indians did not affect them. They simply pricked up their ears or looked unconcerned."


I'd expect that the first prerequisite would be to be an excellent horseman.

 

[Dienekes]

I am not a horse person but my wife is; we have had about ten over the years, of which 2.5 had some brains. The good ones were pretty well accustomed to just about anything but not too thrilled about gunfire right next to them or off them. Have shot some pistol off them,though. 22 LR not too bad. .38 wadcutters ok on some days, and black powder wasn't too hard on their ears. The cocking of a SA pistol is often enough to get them acting antsy, and horses are often looking for excuses to goof off anyway. One way or another everybody's adrenaline will be pumping before you're done.

I have copies of the old mounted pistol course, and anyone who performed well on it has my respect. Personally the racket of .45 hardball is loud to me and I can't imagine a horse caring for it very much next to his head.

Someone will probably chime in here and say that Old Dobbin just loves 7mm Magnums going off between his ears and will stand for it all day.

Whatever.

 

[Moondoggie]

Interesting responses.

I owned a wonderful horse for 10 yrs. He was an excellent roper when I bought him, and I spent a lot of time barrel racing and other gymkhana stuff on him. He was exceptionally dependable and even-tempered.

I could never get him to accept gunfire. I put cotton in his ears, even tranqced him (mildly) once...no dice. I really wanted to use him to hunt deer in the Coastal NC forest.

Just cocking the hammer on a pistol when I was aboard him and we'd practically be "off to the rodeo".

 

[adobewalls]

I tried it once when I was in college. One of the horses his folks had was gun conditioned, so I asked if I could try the horseback thing with my winchester. It took a couple of gallops to get the bugs worked out of how to hold the reins, stand in the stirrups and take the gun out of the scabbard. After that I made the money run, put the horse into a gallop, held the reins in my left hand, pulled the rifle out of the scabbard with the right, stood up in the stirrups, got with the rythm of the horse and aimed at a 5 gallon bucket when it was about 30 yards away and off to the left.

I missed the bucket, but not by much. The horse was OK with the discharge. I also found it pretty amazing at how steady you can hold the rifle at a gallop once you are synch'ed with the horse.

Bottom line, I don't think it would take much practise to become effective.

 

[wizard of oz]

A friend of mine used to go to a private (boarding) school in the outback where each student had their own horse to look after since the cadet corps was based on the immortal Australian Light Horse. .303 SMLE carried in a scabbard by the saddle, ammo carried on bandoliers and extra bandoliers over the pommel. Shooting was practised on horseback from a standing position with knees cinched in (charging) - but mainly one would dismount to shoot and hide behind the horse. Of course, that was a few years ago and in a different political climate (!) than now and this info is hearsay not personal experience. Highroaders might find the following interesting however....
(especially Beersheba 'the last successful great cavalry charge')

http://www.lighthorse.org.au/

 

[230RN]

Looked the site over briefly. Wonder what the Aussies use in their re-enactments nowadays... slingshots?

Or are those illegal, too?

 

[Sharps-shooter]

I recommend a book called "how to bombproof your horse". It's about a training method for keeping horses from spooking, and it's used by people who use horses for crowd control and in other situations where one never really knows what to expect.

 

[wizard of oz]

Ah sarcasm in response to a well intentioned post...
.303 is the australian fiream and popular to collect and shoot here.

 

[Colt46]

Not too impressed with the concept.

I've participated twice in mounted shooting events of an informal scale. This was the type where blackpowder is used to burst balloons as you gallop across the corral. Twice I've seen negligent discharges from inexperianced shooters. The first was an english gal, who could ride, that cranked one off into her thigh. She was wearing chaps which negated any serious injury or burn. The second was a discharge into the horse's neck. Not seriously injured, but really rattled and spooked. The second incident pulled the plug on the rest of the event. I can see why the events use black powder blanks ONLY.
A horse, trained or not, offers another variable to the already difficult job of maintaining the safety rules needed for using firearms.

There are some that spend the time to hone their skills and make their horse bombproof. My hat is off to them. Still, a horse is another variable that I would never be able to trust with certainty.

 

[Harve Curry]

I do quite a bit of shooting from horseback. There's lots of groups, competitive and living history, that regulary drill and train with revolvers and long guns.
A competition called Cow Boy Mounted Shooters Association (CMSA) started about 1993 in Phoenix Az. Now it's real popular and there are more organizations promoting the sport, SASS, AMSA.
Civil War era and up reenactors of cavalry really have the most extreme test of horse, rider, horsemanship because you are mixing it up with very loud artillery, mortars, muskets, and the revolvers or carbines/shotguns you are shooting.
Not all horses will put up with it. I have two that enjoy it and 2 that don't.
The two that do are competitive and they really get into it.

Hitting targets like you describe above is very do able with practice.

Shooting live ammo requires extra care and alot of paying attention to details because you can really screw up.

You need to be real proficient on the ground with the gun your using BEFORE you shoot from horseback. Then you need to know that the horse will let you do it. There's methods to that.
Any horse will let you shoot off him once

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Many of the old timers (and the cavalry) simply shot over their horses' ears with no ear protection -- the horses would go deaf and that would solve the problem. Hardly an acceptable solution nowadays, though!

 

[Art Eatman]

Back some 35 years ago I had a palomino gelding that was a sort of "I don't really care." type of critter. I worked with him, first with a .22 rifle and then a .22 pistol. He got pretty much used to it. He didn't really care much for an '06 going off, though.

I got him to where if we saw a deer, he'd stop and turn off so I could shoot. He'd put his head down, ears back and not do anything until after the gun went off. He'd always sorta hunch, but never buck.

I never tried shooting on the run or any of that cowboy stuff, though. I worked my cattle; didn't shoot at 'em.

Art

 

[Gifted]

http://www.sassnet.com/Mounted-Main-001A.php
SASS mounted shooting. BP blanks.

As far as cavalry goes, I've been interested in doing more modern stuff. We used cavalry past WWII, and that's an era I've been interested in. Supposedly there's a group in Illinois that does WWII era cavalry reenactments, but I haven't been able to get ahold of them yet.

I'm sure you had a lot of deaf horses in the cavalry. I'd imagine you could design an ear plug for a horse-they did gas masks after all-but again, training is the big key. And horses are like people, some will go for it, some will hate you forever. Pick the right horse, and do the right training the way it's supposed to be done, and you'll be fine.

A horse, trained or not, offers another variable to the already difficult job of maintaining the safety rules needed for using firearms.

True, but in some situations, a horse would help. He's got a better nose and (provided you can keep them protected) ears than you do, and may end up providing an advantage. I can certainly see a significant cavalry element to a militia force.

 

[LoneCoon]

My girlfriend wants to get into this. She's an excellent horsewoman, and a pretty fair hand at shooting. I offered her my SAA .357 to shoot with if she can train her horse to do it.

 

[another okie]

There's an old saying that you can shoot off the back of any horse - once.

 

[Biker]

I've tried shooting from my Harley at various speeds and ranges (has to be left hand) and it was hopeless unless shooting at a target behind me.
Don't know a damn thing about flesh and blood horses.

Biker

 

[Harve Curry]

Most competitions nowadays are set up for 45 long Colt revolvers and rifles that take the same. Also cap and ball guns with some cream of wheat to cover the powder works well. Remember NOTHING is a true blank.

 

[shooter503]

Winston Churchill was one of the last horse-cavalry officers. He took part in the last British cavalry charge to use swords, against the Mahdi in the Sudan.

He states that aiming a pistol from a horse does not work. He describes their technique as riding towards the target with the pistol pointing vertically (to avoid accidently shooting your companions) then (the expression he used is "chopping down") lowering the pistol and firing at the last second. He stated this technique worked surprisingly well.

(Winston Churchill - "A Roving Commission". Contains a terrific description of the Cavalry charge.)

 

[mljdeckard]

I never hunted horseback, but my best friend growing up had horses in his family, and they always did. When I became an 'adult' and took down my PSS to show off, with the bipod and Leupold, being very impressed with myself, his took one look at it, and asked, "Will you strap it to a saddlehorn? No? Then what good is it?"

They tell a story, which would have occurred when I was very small, they took one of their rookie friends out with them, hunting deer on horseback on the desert plains. He saw a deer running in front of him from left to right, grabbed his rifle, followed it, started to squeeze, and as the deer crossed and the rifle went off, the horse decided to raise his head right in front of the muzzle.

OOPS.

No, I have never tried hunting from horseback.

 

[Harve Curry]

QUOTE: "geim druth Anyone ever done much shooting from horseback?

I've been reading 'My Sixty Years on the Plains' by William Hamilton. In one part Hamilton and his fellow trappers hold horseback shooting contests with some Shoshones, Utes, and Navajos.

"Three posts were set in the ground, about 25 yards apart. They stood 6 feet out of the ground and were 10 inches in diameter. The top of the post was squared for a distance of about 12 inches. The arms to be used were Colt's six-shooters. Horses were to be put at full speed, passing the posts not closer than 10 feet, and the contestant was to fire 2 shots at each post.
Some of our party put 2 bullets in each post and all at least one. I tried it twice, and was somewhat surprised to find that the best I could do was to place one bullet in each post.
To tell the truth, I'd be happy if I could get one hit from the saddle of a galloping horse! What's it like shooting from horseback? "
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That sounds llike a fun target course to try. The target is a generous size being 12" T x 10"W, balloons we use today are smaller then that.
25 yards between targets is about right, usually we're set up about 30 to 50 feet between each target or shot. What I really like about it is the 10' rule, you have to look down your barrel, aware of your front sight and the target.
I'll try it this spring.

Another good book with shooting from horse back is The Life of Buffalo Bill, by him. Using a trapdoor Springfield 50-70 Rifle and winning against a 1866 Winchester repeater.
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