How did you pick your carry ammo?
- Thread starter Alan Fud
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Valkman
Member
I knew I wanted HP for stopping power and over-penetration issues, the only question was which one for my .45acp. I figure there's not a whole lot of difference between rounds like Golden Saber, Hydrashock, Ranger, etc., and had carried Hydrashocks before. This time though I went with Rangers because it's what alot of LEO's use and I heard good things about it from people I trust. Nothing very scientific about it - in fact I may make up my own reloads to carry when I have the time to work on them.
Hkmp5sd
Member
First and foremost, it had to be 100% reliable in my carry gun. Then I read magazines and reports on the effectiveness of each round compared to the others. One that would adequately expand and provide enough energy transfer to do sufficient damage without overpenetration problems.
Chip Dixon
Member
Well, that depends on the gun type. For my 1911 (semi-auto) carry piece, I got 400 rounds of a lot of different types of hollow points (for summer carry). I got Corbons +P HPs, Winchester silvertips, Winchester white box HPs, and hydrashoks. I did not manage to make the gun choke once on any of these loads, so none of them were disqualified by that criteria. So, I picked the one that did the most damage to my targets (fruit and wood) and that I had the most accuracy with.
That was the Cor-Bon 185 gr. JHP 45 ACP+Ps.
When I can find them around here (or I can order some with my next C&R shipment..) I will be trying some PowrBall ammo and Gold Dots to compare. I usually carry FMJ in the winter for penetration purposes, but the PowrBall may be my new choice come this winter if I like it.
For revolvers, less ammo is needed to test for reliablility. Basically, if it ejects easy it is okay to use. I tend to carry my Model 10 as my beater gun, (as the finish is long gone) loaded either with Winchester 125 gr. 38sp+Ps, 158 gr. LSWCHP, or straight up 150gr. lead. (depending on the weather, and therefore what type of clothing I would have to shoot through)
Don't just go make an ammo choice for semi-auto carrying based on hype. You NEED to make sure it doesn't jam up your gun, and that you can shoot accurately with it. 2 guns of the same make and model can have completely different preferences when it comes to ammo. It's kind of like shotgun ammo patterning in that regard. You're betting your life on your ammo choice. Spend the money to make sure you make the right choice. Carry ammo isn't cheap for non-reloaders, but your life is priceless.
Best Regards,
Chip Dixon
That was the Cor-Bon 185 gr. JHP 45 ACP+Ps.
When I can find them around here (or I can order some with my next C&R shipment..) I will be trying some PowrBall ammo and Gold Dots to compare. I usually carry FMJ in the winter for penetration purposes, but the PowrBall may be my new choice come this winter if I like it.
For revolvers, less ammo is needed to test for reliablility. Basically, if it ejects easy it is okay to use. I tend to carry my Model 10 as my beater gun, (as the finish is long gone) loaded either with Winchester 125 gr. 38sp+Ps, 158 gr. LSWCHP, or straight up 150gr. lead. (depending on the weather, and therefore what type of clothing I would have to shoot through)
Don't just go make an ammo choice for semi-auto carrying based on hype. You NEED to make sure it doesn't jam up your gun, and that you can shoot accurately with it. 2 guns of the same make and model can have completely different preferences when it comes to ammo. It's kind of like shotgun ammo patterning in that regard. You're betting your life on your ammo choice. Spend the money to make sure you make the right choice. Carry ammo isn't cheap for non-reloaders, but your life is priceless.
Best Regards,
Chip Dixon
sm
member
Thanks a lot cordex...you coulda shared the info. Could've had a goat roast and invited folks 
I Ran a min of 200 rds for 100% reliabilty with various ammo I checked POI/POA , tested via the "Scientific Mud Test" ( tm) and " I shoot Dirt Test" ( tm)
So I grab what is handy from those I tested.
I Ran a min of 200 rds for 100% reliabilty with various ammo I checked POI/POA , tested via the "Scientific Mud Test" ( tm) and " I shoot Dirt Test" ( tm)
So I grab what is handy from those I tested.
I read everything I could get my hands on, payed close attention to many (many) online debates between people who know alot more about this stuff than I do and from those debates, I decide who I think is making the most sense. Then I look at what they recommend.
Works for me.
- Gabe
Works for me.
- Gabe
mainmech48
Member
Pretty much the same as the others. I looked over the published data, bought a couple of hundred rounds of each of the top picks, and tried them in my CCW pistol. When reliability didn't present itself as an issue, I went with the one that grouped best in my gun and shot to POA.
M2 Carbine
member
I test it myself.
For expanding/hollowpoints I shoot a one gallon water jug with a box of rags behind to catch the bullet.
The base line being, if a bullet won't expand in a water jug I'm not interested.
Once in a while I read where a bullet that I rejected does expand in jello. I still won't use it, there's too many other good bullets to use that aren't that borderline.
But mostly over the years my informal tests are close to the jello tests, within reason.
Nothing is perfect.
Then I chronograph the round.
So between how good the bullet expands, how far it penetrates the rag box and it's speed I decide if it's worth a lot of shooting for reliability.
Most all of the modern loads are pretty good.
For expanding/hollowpoints I shoot a one gallon water jug with a box of rags behind to catch the bullet.
The base line being, if a bullet won't expand in a water jug I'm not interested.
Once in a while I read where a bullet that I rejected does expand in jello. I still won't use it, there's too many other good bullets to use that aren't that borderline.
But mostly over the years my informal tests are close to the jello tests, within reason.
Nothing is perfect.
Then I chronograph the round.
So between how good the bullet expands, how far it penetrates the rag box and it's speed I decide if it's worth a lot of shooting for reliability.
Most all of the modern loads are pretty good.
L
Logistar
Guest
When I got my 9mm carry gun I bought Winchester White Box Personal Protection HPs at Wal-Mart.
The idea was that I'd use these until I found what I liked best. I then tried Speer, etc. For some reason I LIKED them but the search went on for that KILLER round.
While trying all kinds of stuff, I never found anything I liked any better (even though everything else was MUCH more expensive). THEN I found some tests (AMMOLAB maybe???) and the WWB JHPs ranked right up there in the tests.
I gave up. I am happy with the Winchesters.
1. Feed reliably. (Speer didn't seem as "smooth" in my gun.)
2. Accurate. Plenty good for a short barrel and me behind it!
3. Inexpensive! I can shoot my carry load a LOT and cycle it often!
Works for me!
Logistar
The idea was that I'd use these until I found what I liked best. I then tried Speer, etc. For some reason I LIKED them but the search went on for that KILLER round.
While trying all kinds of stuff, I never found anything I liked any better (even though everything else was MUCH more expensive). THEN I found some tests (AMMOLAB maybe???) and the WWB JHPs ranked right up there in the tests.
I gave up. I am happy with the Winchesters.
1. Feed reliably. (Speer didn't seem as "smooth" in my gun.)
2. Accurate. Plenty good for a short barrel and me behind it!
3. Inexpensive! I can shoot my carry load a LOT and cycle it often!
Works for me!
Logistar
Chupacabra
Member
I picked Golden Sabers because the name sounds cool!
J/K!
Seriously - In the beginning, I had heard a lot of good things about Hydrashocks so I bought a couple boxes for my USP. They worked flawlessly (of course) and I carried those for about a year. Then I bought a 1911 and used Hydrashocks in that. Worked great. Then one day I decided it was time to cycle the carry ammo and I shot all of it up. On a whim, I decided to try the Golden Sabres. Tested them out in both my guns and they work great too. I've been carrying those ever since (165s for the USP and 230s for the 1911). I figure someday I'll decide to try something new again, maybe CorBons, Gold Dots or those fancy-schmansy Ranger SXT's! They're all good.
J/K!
Seriously - In the beginning, I had heard a lot of good things about Hydrashocks so I bought a couple boxes for my USP. They worked flawlessly (of course) and I carried those for about a year. Then I bought a 1911 and used Hydrashocks in that. Worked great. Then one day I decided it was time to cycle the carry ammo and I shot all of it up. On a whim, I decided to try the Golden Sabres. Tested them out in both my guns and they work great too. I've been carrying those ever since (165s for the USP and 230s for the 1911). I figure someday I'll decide to try something new again, maybe CorBons, Gold Dots or those fancy-schmansy Ranger SXT's! They're all good.
cratz2
Member
Well, back in the day, I always though 230 Gr HydraShoks were the way to go and that probably had a lot to do with what Evan Marshall said would work. And with as many people that took his advice (both citizens and LEAs) that seemed like the round to carry.
Flash forward several years to around 1997, I was on a CorBon/Triton trip. I was mostly into 9mms by then and was a big believer in the faster the better, without much regard to bullet design.
A bit more recently than that, I like Gold Dots and Winchester Talons/Rangers in 9mm, 40 and 45 and Golden Sabers in 40 and 45. They tend to be reliable in modern pistols and seem to be well respected with pretty much any 'authority' including Marshall and his detractors. I figure when both sides agree, they must be on to something.
As long as they are reliable in the gun, I'd feel very condifent with Gold Dots or Rangers. And Golden Sabers in 40 and 45... just not fond of the Remingtons in 9mm.
Flash forward several years to around 1997, I was on a CorBon/Triton trip. I was mostly into 9mms by then and was a big believer in the faster the better, without much regard to bullet design.
A bit more recently than that, I like Gold Dots and Winchester Talons/Rangers in 9mm, 40 and 45 and Golden Sabers in 40 and 45. They tend to be reliable in modern pistols and seem to be well respected with pretty much any 'authority' including Marshall and his detractors. I figure when both sides agree, they must be on to something.
As long as they are reliable in the gun, I'd feel very condifent with Gold Dots or Rangers. And Golden Sabers in 40 and 45... just not fond of the Remingtons in 9mm.
Treylis
Member
230-grain .45ACP Ranger Talons because of the ballistics I've read about and because of their former "evil history" as Black Talons. ;-)
Mannlicher
Member
I am always looking at different ammo. I need whatever I carry to be reliable, and accurate. These two are more important to me than terminal performance.
In some of my handguns, I like Factory ammo. I carry HydroShocks in my .45 ACP, and in my BHP .40, and CZ Compact 9mm
I carry handloads in all my revolvers
In some of my handguns, I like Factory ammo. I carry HydroShocks in my .45 ACP, and in my BHP .40, and CZ Compact 9mm
I carry handloads in all my revolvers
Lone_Gunman
Member
In 45, I pick 230g Hardball in my 1911s. It'll blow your head clean off, you know.
Treylis
Member
Yeah, I heard that if you get hit on the pinky of your hand, you'll not only be stone-dead, you'll also do a twisting pirouette in the air as you get knocked back. ;-)
duckfoot
member
Surplus mil spec .45ACP 230 FMJ's. Had to mercy shoot a cow, that was hit by a truck and have seen what hard ball will do, made me a believer.
BluesBear
member
I just watch CSI and pay attention to whatever they dig out of a corpse and then I go out and buy a case.
priv8ter
Member
Guess I'm not very scientific
Then, where did you find the meat bullets? I could use some.
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=16718&highlight=meat+bullet
In my .45's, I carry 230gr Hardball. The 1911, because it is what is was designed for, and in the Firestorm, because I fear the barrel might be too short to get good expansion out of a HP.
In my wifes .380, we use Federal Hyrda-shoks. They were the first HP's we tried, and they have worked whenever she pulled the trigger. I haven't seen anything ballistically on paper that has convinced me to spend the money to test out anything else.
In my SP-101, I load whatever happens to be cheapest when I need new ammo. For a while, it was 125gr WWB 38 +P. Right now, it's WWB 110 .357. I might move back up in weight the more I hear about the new 135gr load out there.
greg
Then, where did you find the meat bullets? I could use some.
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=16718&highlight=meat+bullet
In my .45's, I carry 230gr Hardball. The 1911, because it is what is was designed for, and in the Firestorm, because I fear the barrel might be too short to get good expansion out of a HP.
In my wifes .380, we use Federal Hyrda-shoks. They were the first HP's we tried, and they have worked whenever she pulled the trigger. I haven't seen anything ballistically on paper that has convinced me to spend the money to test out anything else.
In my SP-101, I load whatever happens to be cheapest when I need new ammo. For a while, it was 125gr WWB 38 +P. Right now, it's WWB 110 .357. I might move back up in weight the more I hear about the new 135gr load out there.
greg
Ben Shepherd
Member
I use handloaded 158gr gold dots in my 357mag sp101.
Chose them because the expand in almost any medium if they're at 1100fps or better. But when you run them real fast(rifle) they still hold together pretty well.
Also in the accuracy dept, they will cut a 5 shot 40 caliber ragged hole at 10 yards all day long out of my sp101. And out of my rifle they run that same hole at 25 yards.
I carry my handloads not because the factory gold dot is bad, but mostly because I wanted just a tad more speed than the factory speer load offers for my snubby. In my 3" security six, or any of my other 357s with a longer barrel the factory round is hard to beat(unless you're building garret/buffalo bore style stuff).
Chose them because the expand in almost any medium if they're at 1100fps or better. But when you run them real fast(rifle) they still hold together pretty well.
Also in the accuracy dept, they will cut a 5 shot 40 caliber ragged hole at 10 yards all day long out of my sp101. And out of my rifle they run that same hole at 25 yards.
I carry my handloads not because the factory gold dot is bad, but mostly because I wanted just a tad more speed than the factory speer load offers for my snubby. In my 3" security six, or any of my other 357s with a longer barrel the factory round is hard to beat(unless you're building garret/buffalo bore style stuff).
mspears
Member
I try to follow what Evan Marshall recommends for a given caliber and barrel length. Since he has documented so many real street shootings, I feel his observations and recommendations only make sense to follow. For example: Evan Marshall AND Masaad Ayoob both recommend Federal (or Remington)125 grain JHP in .357. That's what I carry in my 2.25" Ruger SP101. I figure I can't go wrong with that one. Evan also very highly recommends 158 grain LSWCHP +P's for the .38 special in snubby barrels. I would carry this load IF I could find it, but the manual for my Taurus model 85CHULT UltraLite/Titanium wants me to ONLY shoot jacketd ammo. In this case I've chosen CorBon's .38 110 grain JHP +P's bases on e-mails to CorBon reqesting test information (Mike Shovel at CorBon is very good at replying to e-mails) and running those results by Evan on his web site. By the way, CorBon is releasing a .38 DPX (Barnes X-Bullet) soon and Evan will jello test it and post the results. Bottom line is, I rely heavily on the people I feel really know what to recommend based on real life shootings.
BluesBear
member
A 230gr JHP should penetrate just fine and it will have less riccochet possibilities if you should miss. FMJ tend to skip and keep going when they hit a hard surface while JHP tend to tumble and slow down rapidly.
If you should get lucky and get expansion then that's all the better.
I use whatever is the most reliable. IMHO, combat accuracy is about the same with most ammo. In a real life gun fight, I'll probably be within bad breath range so a fraction of an inch difference in accuracy at 35 yards is not important. If it won't feed and extract reliably, who cares how accurate it is or if it expands in water jugs or what the muzzle velocity is? If you do your part, the ammo will do its part. YMMV.
Ben Shepherd
Member
Ky Larry (and any others following this thread) let me clarify. I agree with Larry on the combat accuracy point, but it's good to know that match grade accuracy is there if needed. I intend to stack the chips as far in my favor as possible.
No flamin' on the new guy(mspears WELCOME ABOARD!!!) . He answered the question asked, and this isn't a Fackler vs. Marshall thread.
No flamin' on the new guy(mspears WELCOME ABOARD!!!) . He answered the question asked, and this isn't a Fackler vs. Marshall thread.
1. Make sure what you pick is reliable in THAT SPECIFIC WEAPON.
2. Check for reliability, again, just to make sure (use whatever number of rounds you are comfortable with).
3. All else is tertiary if it won't cycle in your semi-auto (revo-packers get by easy).
As to specifics for MY weapons:
SW1911 likes Remmy 230gr Golden Sabers. Reliable, accurate. I carried 230gr hardball until I tested the GS & did not feel I was compromising. If your .45 will only feed hardball, no need to wail & gnash your teeth. HPs are preferred, but .45 hardball will do the trick.
AMT .45 Backup likes 230gr hardball & that's what it gets. I could spend time/$$$ looking for a reliable HP for it, but with a 3" bbl, expansion will be a fluke. AMT may have had spotty quality, but this baby is a case in point that a short bbl doesn't mean short on acuracy. Its kinda scary, actually. FWIW, it will also cycle CCI ratshot cartridges. Uncanny.
Kel-tec P40 likes Federal 165gr Hydro shoks & thats it for HP.
Kel-tec P32 will feed & fire any .32ACP I have stuffed into its magazine.
2. Check for reliability, again, just to make sure (use whatever number of rounds you are comfortable with).
3. All else is tertiary if it won't cycle in your semi-auto (revo-packers get by easy).
As to specifics for MY weapons:
SW1911 likes Remmy 230gr Golden Sabers. Reliable, accurate. I carried 230gr hardball until I tested the GS & did not feel I was compromising. If your .45 will only feed hardball, no need to wail & gnash your teeth. HPs are preferred, but .45 hardball will do the trick.
AMT .45 Backup likes 230gr hardball & that's what it gets. I could spend time/$$$ looking for a reliable HP for it, but with a 3" bbl, expansion will be a fluke. AMT may have had spotty quality, but this baby is a case in point that a short bbl doesn't mean short on acuracy. Its kinda scary, actually. FWIW, it will also cycle CCI ratshot cartridges. Uncanny.
Kel-tec P40 likes Federal 165gr Hydro shoks & thats it for HP.
Kel-tec P32 will feed & fire any .32ACP I have stuffed into its magazine.
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