How do you change calibers on LNL-AP?

[mallc]

Following is a quote from a question in another thread on powder checks used on the LNL-AP. I re-post it here to investigate how THR members manage caliber changes on the LNL-AP.

I bought the LnL because it has 60sec primer size changes, 60sec caliber changes, and a better powder measure.

Curious as to how you accomplish re-setting the case activated powder drop inside a 60 second change over. Does it require an additional powder measure?

Thanks,
Scott

 

[Balrog]

It changes over pretty fast, but not that fast.

Changing the dies is easy with the LNL. You screw your dies into a bushing, and then the bushings lock into the press. If you already have your dies appropriately screwed into the bushings, you can easily change your dies in just a minute or two.

The primer change will take a little longer... but still only a few minutes. You have to swap out the part for large and small primers.

Recalibrating the powder drop is easy, if you are changing from one pistol caliber to another, or one rifle caliber to another. You just screw the measuring nob in or out until you get the load you want. You might also have to back the powder measure out a little (or screw it in a little more) to accomodate the new case length size. If you are going from a pistol to a rifle, or vice vera, you swap out the rotor on the drop.

I think claiming it only takes a couple of minutes to completely change to a new caliber is an exaggeration, especially if you are having to do a primer change also, or going from pistol to rifle.

 

[showmebob]

Also, don't forget the possibility of having to change out the shell plate which takes another minute.

 

[Walkalong]

I pre-prime with a RCBS hand primer, and I use a Redding measure which does not need anything but to be dialed in (and a 30 second powder drop bushing change under/over 9MM/.38 caliber), so 30 seconds for that occasionally, a 30 second die change, and a 30 second shell plate change, and I'm good to go. 2 minutes or under easily.

Plus primer change? I don't know.

 

[jbrown13]

Here is my scenario. I only reload 9mm and 38 Spcl. My dies are pre-adjusted and locked in LnL bushings. I have two "Quick Change Powder Dies" (the lower part of the case activated powder drop), one labeled for 9mm and one labeled for 38. I have all my brass pre-prepped, that is trimmed(if required), sized and primed. So when I change calibers I remove three dies (case flare, seating, crimping) with a quarter-turn twist, which takes maybe 30 seconds. I remove the return spring and linkage connecting screw from the powder drop, which takes another 30 seconds. I then remove the "Quick Change Powder Die" (QCPD) and bushing and switch the pistol powder sleeve to the other QCPD and putting it in the press, which might take 60 seconds. I put the powder measure into the QCPD and re-attach the linkage screw and return spring, another 30 seconds. I then install the 3 dies for the new caliber in the press, another 30 seconds. I then change the shell plate and re-install the case retaining spring, maybe another 60 seconds. So, if my math is correct that adds up to 240 seconds. Time does not include unboxing and reboxing dies and shellplate, nor does it include wiping them down. Change assumes starting with an empty powder measure and being finished with an empty powder measure. YMMV.

 

[Balrog]

So under very special circumstances, a change can be made in 4 minutes.

Now go from 380 ACP to 45-70 Govt and tell me how long it takes...

The LNL is a great press. But caliber changes are kind of slow on any progressive. LNL is probably about as good as it gets, but still it is not what I would call fast. But whats the worry about changing quickly? I load in large batches. Constantly switching back and two between calibers is not efficient.

 

[Lloyd Smale]

I keep extra measure inserts in specific charge weights and either have measures set up or the lowers set for about every differnt lenght of cases. I also have presses set up in large and small primer so changing calibers for me is a one minute job. You could do the same with a dillon but youd need seperate tool heads and powder measures and the powder slides are much more time consuming to swap then the snap in hornadys.

 

[Walkalong]

I use the regular expander die in station two, then powder drop in station three. I never have to adjust my belling when I change calibers. With 5 stations, one has plenty of options. We don't have to use the powder through expander in the measure if we don't want to. That should speed things up some, but I like the two step expanders like Lyman and Redding make, so I would rather use them anyway on the calibers I have them for, whether it saved time or not.

Size in station one. Then trim, tumble, hand prime. etc

Then, without a sizer in station one, expander in station two, powder drop in station three, seat (and sometimes crimp) in station four, crimp in station five.

Not having to set the belling in the LNL measure set up should save a good bit of time. Just dial up the charge, and maybe change the bushing the powder drops through for large vs small calibers.

 

[jbrown13]

So under very special circumstances, a change can be made in 4 minutes.

Now go from 380 ACP to 45-70 Govt and tell me how long it takes...

The LNL is a great press. But caliber changes are kind of slow on any progressive. LNL is probably about as good as it gets, but still it is not what I would call fast. But whats the worry about changing quickly? I load in large batches. Constantly switching back and two between calibers is not efficient.

I don't reload either caliber, so I can't respond. There would definitely be additional time involved because of different powder measure rotor and primer changeover. I prefaced my post that I only load 9mm and 38 Spcl and added that YMMV.

This is a very difficult question to answer and compare. Different scenarios will produce different results. Different start and end points will produce different results. That is why I clearly defined my scenario.

 

[David Wile]

Hey folks,

I am going to base my response on the premise that I am changing from a pistol caliber using small primers to a big rifle caliber using large primers.

1. The first thing I would do is remove the pistol dies and bushings. That would take all of thirty seconds to remove three dies and put them in their die case.

2. The second thing I would do would be to change the shell plates, and that should take less than a minute.

3. Next I would remove the primer feeder and change the small primer shuttle to the large one. Then I would have to change from the small primer seater unit to the large primer seater unit. These two switches should not take more than three or four minutes to accomplish.

4. With all the dies off the top of the press, I would then change the case activated powder measure so it would throw proper charges for a big rifle caliber. It is much easier to make the changes and adjustments to the powder measure while the top of the press is clear of any dies or the primer feeder tube. To change from pistol to rifle metering, will require changing the small adjustable thing to the large adjustable thing. That's only a two or three minute job at most. Then the whole case activation mechanism must be adjusted for the new rifle case to be loaded. This process should not take more than five minutes - maybe less. Once the case activation mechanism is working properly for the new rifle case, then the actual powder measure must be calibrated for the correct charge. This means adjusting the meter, dropping a charge, weighing it, and making further adjustment until you have it just right. I know some folks will say they can dial in their load on the micrometer setting without checking on a powder scale, but that is not for me. I will weigh and adjust till I am satisfied. For me, I would guess a reasonably estimated time to change the whole powder measure and case activated mechanism may take ten minutes.

5. I would then have to refill the primer feeder with a hundred or so large primers and put it back in place on the press. Filling the primer tube and putting it back should not take more than about five minutes I would guess.

6. With the primer mechanism in place and the powder measure in place, I would then put the three dies I would use for 45-70 in place. If the three dies are already locked in L&L bushings, this would not take more than 30 seconds.

At this point I am ready to start loading 45-70 cartridges at a really quick rate, and I can do hundreds of them in a very short time. How long did it take to switch from a small primer pistol setup to the large primer 45-70 setup and be ready to load? No more than twenty minutes, and maybe just a little less. Some folks may say a lot less. Me, I'm just slower I guess, but I really do not think that is a lot of time to make a complete change of calibers on a progressive press.

I actually spend a bit more time with my changes because I do not keep all my dies in bushings. I use most of my dies on both the progressive as well as single stage presses, and I often find myself taking the dies out of the bushings at one time and putting them back in when I want to use them on the progressive. I do have a few calibers (45-70 is one of them) where I have more than one die set and keep one set of dies in the bushings.

Best wishes,
Dave Wile

 

[pinkymingeo]

All of my dies are in bushings and preset. I have a preadjusted quick change powder drop for each caliber, and preset inserts. Caliber changes happen in the blink of an eye. I don't know how you could spend more than 2min on a primer size change unless you interrupt it for a pit stop, and one minute is easy. I use longnose pliers to pull the slide spring, then remove it. A 7/16 box end spins the old plunger out and new one in. Slip in the new slide and hook the spring. Replace the primer tube. Happens much faster than it takes to list the steps.

 

[David Wile]

Hey Pinky,

You have different powder measures preset for each caliber? Geez, I thought I had to be afraid and ashamed to tell my wife what I have spent on reloading over the years. Now I can point to you and tell her that she should be happy she is not married to you.

I'm a real cheapskate compared to you. I only have the one original case activated powder measure that came with my press, and I have to change and adjust it each time I change calibers. I got one of the first L&L AP presses when they first came out in 1996 or 1997, and I still use it as it was originally issued - no new modifications. The one problem I encountered with my press is finding that a few of my RCBS die sets were not long enough to reach through the thicker L&L press. I think all my Lyman dies worked, but a few of the RCBS were a little too short, and for those I just bought Hornady die sets.

You said you did not know how one could spend more than two minutes on changing the primer size unless you go for a pit stop. Well, I'll just tell you how to spend more than two minutes - you get old and slower. Pit stops are another thing all their own. Now I am not suggesting that making caliber changes to the L&L AP is difficult in any way, nor am I suggesting that it takes "too long." It does, however, take me longer than it takes you. Then again, I am a cheapskate without extra powder measures and few extra bushings, and I don't mind changing dies.

Best wishes,
Dave Wile