How do you feel about the prerequisites about obtaining a CCW permit

[kurtmax]

ilbob:

I've already written.. twice. No response. The forms are made by the individual departments so there isn't a state-wide form.

I agree that the courts could very-well say that as long as he is 'consistant' in setting requirements than it's legal. But then that doesn't make sense either. If he required you to be 80 for a permit that would be consistant... The whole thing sounds a bit fishy; specially considering the miniumum age is already written in the code...

Like I said. They entire state is a 'gray area' on pistol permits. If the sheriff doesn't like you then you go to get a lawyer, go to court, and let it get sorted out that way.

 

[jackstinson]

Robert Hairless .... It's at least a bit surprising to see an Ohio resident well along on the path to discretionary issue because your state is known for its cities that have taken that path. The opinion of the mayors and city councils in Columbus, Toledo, and other cities is that no one should even own a handgun much less carry one, and they've attempted to enforce their opinions on other people.

Last March, the signing into law of HB347 changed things in Ohio for municipalities like Columbus, Toledo, etc.
Obtaining a carry permit in Columbus was extremely easy. I took the CCW class on a Thursday, spent 15 minutes in the Franklin County Sheriff's office on Friday, received my CHL in 4 business days.
I'm not "well along on the path to discretionary issue". I simply obeyed the law of my state to get my permit.
Flog me for being a law-abiding citizen. At the same time, I also voted for the people who were responsible for changing the laws which makes it simpler to obtain a permit now. And makes it far simpler to buy and own firearms in Columbus and anywhere in Ohio. And hey, I can have a pistol grip on my 10/22 now!
The class I took was not designed to fail you, it was designed to educate you. Now the State of Ohio (not the cities) sets the requirements to make it quite easy for anyone eligible to get an Ohio permit.
That puts us back to your flogging me for my opinion that it might be a good idea for people to have some sort of basic training if they intend on carrying a firearm. It's just my opinion. I also think you should know how to safely use a chainsaw before cutting down the tree in your own backyard. But you do have the right to not be educated....and saw your arm off, or lay a tree on your neighbor's rooftop.
But wasn't the original question of this thread asking for our opinions?
"How do you feel about the prerequisites about obtaining a CCW permit" .. Well, that's how I feel.
My most sincere apologies that this doesn't match how you feel.
Jack

 

[Robert Hairless]

Jack, I did understand that you were expressing your opinion. I'm sorry that you got the sense that I was flogging you for expressing your opinion. Really and truly I wasn't, and if you read what I said with more sensitivity I think you will see that.

I like it that you expressed your feelings too. Wouldn't this be a wonderful world if everyone (especially men) could get in touch with their feelings and express them freely. But on that point too you misunderstood what I wrote. I wasn't commenting on your feelings. So there's just no need for you to give me your "most sincere apologies" instead of apologies of a less sincere or thoroughly insincere kind because your feelings don't "match" how I feel. I certainly didn't intend to "flog" you "for being a law-abiding citizen," and I don't see how you could feel I did that in what I said. I think it's great that you are a law abiding citizen.

What I argued was that in matters involving rights--especially the right to keep and bear arms--it's essential that we use thought, reason, and reality instead of opinion and feelings.

Perhaps you just don't understand the difference or perhaps you're merely incapable of switching from your gut to your mind. I get the feeling from what you say that you are ruled by your feelings and emotions, and my opinion is that it's far too dangerous for people who are so easily offended to own firearms. I hadn't realized that Ohio was so imprudent as to issue a permit in less than four days from beginnning to end. I feel that it's just not enough time to do the thorough checks that every permit holder should undergo in your state and it's my opinion that the process should take at least 90 days and preferably not less than a year. Those are just my opinions and that's just the way I feel. Please don't flog me for my feelings and opinions. That would be wrong.

You actually intend to put a pistol grip on a rifle! A lot of people feel that a pistol grip turns your Ruger 10/22 .22 caliber rifle into an assault weapon. Their opinion is that it's evil to do what you're doing, serves no sporting purpose, and should be banned. Can't you be more respectful for their feelings and opinions? Good heavens.

I'm quite comfortable talking about feelings and opinions, and if you would prefer to do that instead of talking about thought and reason it's okay with me.

But I think--and feel--that you will be most unhappy with the consequences if your mind ever allows you to understand that your approach is no different from that of the Brady Campaign and everyone else who wants to convince the public and their legislators that the Second Amendment doesn't feel okay.

It doesn't feel okay to you either that there could be a right to keep and bear arms that transcends your feelings and opinions. You don't feel okay if someone doesn't meet your sense of what everyone needs to know before being allowed the means to defend his or her life, and it's your opinion that anyone who doesn't meet your standards should have those means. It might be frightening to know your reaction to entire states--Vermont, for example--that don't meet cater to your feelings about how to do things.

Your point about chainsaws .... Don't you know that there's no right to own or use a chainsaw? Those stupid people who use one without training: should they be prohibited from using a chainsaw until they undergo a background check and training? Should the state of Ohio control the sale of chainsaws and require everyone who buys one to have a permit before using it? Must chainsaws have trigger locks, have their blades and extension cords microstamped, be kept locked away in safes when not in use, and be denied to minors? Should they be allowed to have mufflers without a federal tax stamp? Should they be regulated to prohibit the manufacture of new chainsaws after 1934 except for the military and law enforcement? Should it be a felony to possess a chainsaw without a serial number or with its serial number defaced? Why would anyone need a chainsaw instead of a handsaw when there's no legitimate reason to own one and they're only used by criminals who want to massacre our forests? Should they be limited to one cycle of the blade for each pull on the trigger? Can you see what is wrong with your thinking? If not, why not?

There are lots of other people who operate the way you do. They're how gun owners got into this mess and why we all are likely to lose the right to keep and bear arms in this country. I tried to communicate rationally and involve your mind instead of to your gut and your ego, but they were impenetrable and I failed. It isn't the first time and probably won't be the last, until I decide that it's wasted time and it's hopeless to continue trying.