How do you load your HD/SD shotgun?

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Then out comes the tomahawk.
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Wicked.

Alvin, I find most of your post disturbing.

Wouldn't you want it loaded with your typical hunting loads so it wouldn't look quite
so premeditated to the grand jury, that you were wanting to actually kill somebody?
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Firstly, every load discussed here so far is a hunting load. Secondly it would be very hard for any prosecuter to prove premeditated murder for someone breaking into your home. I would dare say if you can find such a case I would say it is possible, but the odds are awfully high against it.

Seems to me only the police can get away with that.
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I don't understand this comment at all. Are you saying the police are allowed to premeditate and shoot people or are you saying that they are the only ones allowed to carry effective loads? Either way you would be wrong.

And while I'm at it...
Do you really want -any- jury seeing your tack-tee-kewl shotgun with the pistol grip or
any of that other stupid looking military crap on your "simple sweet burgular just trying
to feed his family" (with his mom crying in the front row) "killing device"?
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If you can show me an example of this successfully used as a defense I would like to see it.

To answer the question... :)

3+1/2 - 1+1/18oz - #4 jackrabbit shells <--"high brass load" with less kick ;)
or
3+1/4 - 1+1/18oz - #5 quail shells
or
3+1/4 - 1+1/18oz - #6 dove shells
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These are all fine loads for jackrabbits, quail and dove (although I might use something larger for jack rabbits) but I would not even consider them for effectively dropping a land animal between 150 to 250 pounds, especially if it were my life on the line.

Why don't you do a little more research on the subject and see what you come up with.
 
Wouldn't you want it loaded with your typical hunting loads so it wouldn't look quite
so premeditated to the grand jury, that you were wanting to actually kill somebody? :/

Seems to me only the police can get away with that. :/

And while I'm at it...
Do you really want -any- jury seeing your tack-tee-kewl shotgun with the pistol grip or
any of that other stupid looking military crap on your "simple sweet burgular just trying
to feed his family" (with his mom crying in the front row) "killing device"? :(

To answer the question... :)
3+1/2 - 1+1/18oz - #4 jackrabbit shells <--"high brass load" with less kick ;)
or
3+1/4 - 1+1/18oz - #5 quail shells
or
3+1/4 - 1+1/18oz - #6 dove shells

"because that's what was in the magazine at the time"
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:banghead::banghead::banghead:

Where do people come up with these internet fantasies?

For peets sake people, if it's a lawful self defense shooting it isn't going to matter if it was birdshot or slugs or if it was from an antique SxS or a legal sawn off evil looking 12 gauge (with tax stamp) firing the latest human stopper. A lawful shoot is a lawful shoot; so why handicap yourself shooting birdshot at a person threatening your life? Birdshot and such has been rebuked countless times at being ineffective at stopping human aggressors.

And, quite frankly, in some fantasy world where you DID have to go to trial, you would be much WORSE off with the now blind and maimed 'victim' testifying that he was drunk and stumbled into your house and you shot him in the face with birdshot and blinded him and left him with disfiguring injuries.

Like they say, dead men don't tell tales.
 
I don't mix loads. I download my Mossberg to 4 shells of #1 buck in the tube with 5 slugs and one more #1 buck in the sidesaddle.

With practice changing to a slug from the sidesaddle is quite fast and easy.

And while I'm at it...
Do you really want -any- jury seeing your tack-tee-kewl shotgun with the pistol grip or
any of that other stupid looking military crap on your "simple sweet burgular just trying
to feed his family" (with his mom crying in the front row) "killing device"? :(
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Would'nt bother me a bit. My State laws are very precise in what is a defensable use of lethal force in my home. My "tacticool" shotgun is a non-issue.
 
I have 5 00 buck in the tube,

And on the buttstock holder i have 3 slugs and two more 00 buck. If i need a slug ill slip it in...
 
Hi guys,

I'm new here and I might not fit into the "culture" that's established here. :(

First, who are your fellow Americans? :)
The same ones that are comforted to see your fingernail clippers taken away from you before you board a plane with them. :) They wouldn't get on any of
the planes until after the "security show" was highly publicized.

My libertarian girlfriend was on a grand jury. :)
You don't want to be judged by your fellow 'mercan!

Up close, bird shot is going to be the same as buckshot.

OP you took my rant personal, you sure seem defensive to me. :)

That ain't gonna look good to your fellow 'mercan after you shoot the crap
out of someone with buckshot and brag about how you're going to do that
ahead of time here on the internet.

You think you feel threatened by dumb ol' Alvin on the internet?
...just wait until you are in the hot seat. LOL :)

Laws for your protection so you can kill someone with a shotgun? LOL :)

It all sounds good from this side of it, just wait until you are on the other side
of it yourself. You'll be wishing that shotgun and your buckshot had some other
use you can make it look like you didn't have it all planned out to shoot the
crap out of someone. ...like you really are a deer hunter and it's deer season, that's why it was loaded with buckshot etc. That won't work in AZ.

Just look at the stuff you guys are writing here, have your grandmas and aunts
and gals from work read it. The grandmas and aunts that are ex barflies might agree with you but they pack the grand jury so a libertarian's vote doesn't count for anything at all. My girlfriend convinced a bunch of them to see it another way but in the end, never swayed a single case.

Depends on whether those in charge at the time want to be seen as agreeing
with you or not. It's all politics it's not black and white. If it were black and
white the bleeding heart liberals on the grand jury are going to see your heart
bleed too. :)

As far as reading this stuff. the prosecution will. :)
And the "victim's" lawyer will too. :)
Civil court, ever heard of it? :)

You guys are setting yourselves up for a fall whether you actually fall "all the
way" is another point. I wish you luck I really do. :)

One case involved a guy shooting his gun and not hitting anyone and the police
officer in charge of the case "pleaded" to the jury to let this guy go.
"please listen to this guy's whole story before you decide"
What the guy did was entirely justified from the case officer's and -our- point
of view but we ain't "typical 'mercans". :) Guess how the vote went. ;)

Alvin trying to keep a low profile in AZ
ps- When I went to high school in the DC area for a couple years, I was the only
pro-gun person I met... never met a teacher, student, parent or neighbor that
was pro-gun and I argued the case all by myself.
pps- So now I'm again defending my rights from the "other side" ...from the
"blood thirsty gun nuts" trying to make all us gun people sound defensive,
paranoid and crazy. :) Which side do you want to be "seen" on?
 
Alvin that post was even more disturbing than the first for lots of reasons.

I'm new here and I might not fit into the "culture" that's established here.
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Join Date: 10-19-06
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Up close, bird shot is going to be the same as buckshot.
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If by up close you mean coming out of the barrel than depending upon the load they will be close. But even after ten feet everything will be quite different.

Just look at the stuff you guys are writing here, have your grandmas and aunts
and gals from work read it. The grandmas and aunts that are ex barflies might agree with you but they pack the grand jury so a libertarian's vote doesn't count for anything at all. My girlfriend convinced a bunch of them to see it another way but in the end, never swayed a single case.

Depends on whether those in charge at the time want to be seen as agreeing
with you or not. It's all politics it's not black and white. If it were black and
white the bleeding heart liberals on the grand jury are going to see your heart
bleed too.
Click to expand...

I don't even pretend to understand what that means.

One case involved a guy shooting his gun and not hitting anyone and the police
officer in charge of the case "pleaded" to the jury to let this guy go.
"please listen to this guy's whole story before you decide"
What the guy did was entirely justified from the case officer's and -our- point
of view but we ain't "typical 'mercans". :) Guess how the vote went. ;)
Click to expand...

Why not just show us the case and we can see how it went?
 
Hmmm...
No positive responses so far. :)

Like...
"I see where you're coming from, but..."

I should've known better than to have posted the first post let alone the second!
Sorry, I'll shut the **** up now. :)

Alvin in AZ (post #74, mostly knife stuff, first political stuff)
 
This isnt about politics, it's about the OP wanting opinions on how to load his shotgun. Not how to load my shotgun so it'll look PC in court if I ever have to use it.:rolleyes:

Besides, who are you going to fool with saying you had it loaded in the house for hunting?:scrutiny: Every hunter I know, and I'd venture to say almost all hunters, leave their weapons unloaded until they get to their hunting location.

You keep saying we are setting ourselves up to fall in court. Well, my shotgun full of buckshot gives me a much better chance of living long enough to see court than you're hunting shotgun full of birdshot does if the intruder is intent on hurting you.

BTW, we ARE NOT "blood-thirsty gun nuts," we are people intent on protecting ourselves from 'people' intent on hurting us.

Also, the political section of this board is further up, please take your political comments up there.

Sorry to everyone for contributing to this off-topic topic.
 
Up close, bird shot is going to be the same as buckshot.
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Please, if you do not know to wit you are speaking do not make statements of fact. I have one friend shot with birdshot in the thighs that lived, though it was painful getting the shot scrubbed out, only three inches higher and he might have shot himself though. The lightest effective antipersonnel round that should be used is #4 buck. I have gleaned this from professional police publications, while they do not know everything I will take their advice on this. If you want I can do the research and find the article again.

I personally prefer slugs in my HD shotgun but I spend time practicing with my shotguns. I can keep my shots in the sweet spot up to 50 yards out slow fire and 25 yards rapid fire so I am confident of hitting my target.

I am also not afraid to say on the internet that if a sweet young burglar breaks into my home I will terminate him with prejudice if he does not follow all of my instructions.
 
Alvin,

We all have our opinions on what will will work best for us if that horrible day ever comes and we must use lethal force to protect our loved ones.

What we discuss here isn't blood-lust. We ask others what works for them so that we can sift through the responses and perhaps get some helpfull tips we can use or modify to our own unique sitiuations.So that we can survive a violent break-in.

Some of us take this responsibility of protecting ourselves and loved ones very seriously. My own choices have been learned from the past 31 years of being a shooter.My HD shotgun is one I have owned for the last 16 years,and during that time I have spent a lot of time and money on "gadgets", ammo, and actual practice with both. Plus time spent on learning my laws I live under since I do not wish to survive a violent break-in only to die in prison.

Because of this research I know my shotgun,loads, and laws inside and out.If someday I have to use my HD gun it will be because I have no choice in the matter, that will be decided by who-ever wishes to do me harm.

To me that is not blood lust,simply responsible firearms ownership.


To the OP , I am sorry for the off topic post in your thread.
 
Answering the original question... :)

I load mine with 00 buck. 6 in the magazine, chamber empty.

I hope and pray never to have to use it in a home defense scenario. Best to be prepared, though.
 
Alvin, regardless of the load a shotgun is a firearm, and a firearm is lethal force. Lethal force is used to stop 'Loss of life or limb' or stop 'Grievous bodily injury' or something similarly worded which varies from state to state.

If I'm ever forced to use a firearm to defend myself I want a load that will stop the attacker and prevent me from suffering loss of life or limb, or some other grievous bodily injury. In a shotgun those loads are buckshot or slugs.

If you shoot an attacker 6 times with bird shot and he bleeds out on the way to the hospital long after he's killed or maimed you with his knife then you've killed him; but the load was ineffective because it didn't stop him from killing or severely injuring you. If you shoot him once with buckshot or a slug and hit an organ or break bone stopping his attack then the load was effective. The attacker may very well survive the single or two shot slug of buckshot wound, but the gun and the load still did the job and kept you from getting killed.
 
I read this with some interest, living as I do in a country where I would almost certainly go to prison for shooting and killing a burglar, and would certainly lose my shotgun licence, which is probably my most treasured possesion :(

I do think Alvin has some relevant points though. Yes I've read the Box of Truth and everything, but I surely would want to get shot with a load of #6 pigeon shot from the distance applicable to a living room or bedroom or whole apartment for that matter.

Me I keep a few British size AAA cartridges to defend myself and my family with. Not sure what size they relate to in the USA though, there's about 50 pellets per cartridge.
 
7 00 Buck Winchester WinLite Reduced Recoil in the tube, 3 more on the side saddle, 2 1oz slugs in the saddle.

You totally caught me premeditating how to defend myself most effectively :)
 
I read this with some interest, living as I do in a country where I would almost certainly go to prison for shooting and killing a burglar, and would certainly lose my shotgun licence
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If you live somewhere that you need a licence for a shotgun you are dealing with different legal issues. Besides I think any kind of defense against an intruder is not allowed in the UK.
 
I buy random birdshot shells, dump out all the shot, then recrimp. I keep a racquet by the door so that the invader(s) and I can play a high speed version of Badminton. After the shells have run out, a winner is declared, a ceremony held, medal(s) awarded, and the invader(s) typically leaves with a smile and well wishes. One was a rather poor sport about the whole thing and left with a frown. That was a dark day indeed.
 
Alvin in AZ

I live in a pretty strong "Castle Doctrine" state here in South Carolina. If you are an intruder in my house, the law doesn't give a whit if I shoot you with a BB gun or a 105 Howitzer. It's a valid self defense shoot and will never make it -to- a grand jury, much less past one to a trial.

Oh, as for loading ... 2 x #4 shot followed by 3 x 00 buck in "The Judge", all buckshot in the 870.
 
First three rounds are Federal 9 pellet low recoil OO buck.

Last four are twelve pellet "police grade" OO buck (forgot the name of the company)


I have the side saddle with five more twelve pellet rounds but when I finally make it to PA I'll probably switch that out to slugs.


Alvin in AZ: sorry as others have said 1) if it's a good shoot it should'nt make it to a grand jury much less past there 2) firearm loaded anyway is a deadly weapon might as well have it be effective



Throdgrain: I'm sorry to hear that. My brother studies in London and has discussed his "defensive set-up" and it all revolves around what could be reasonably excpected to be around his house as oppossed to the 12 gauge he used to have here in NY. (WOW- who would have thought NY was better off on firearms than somewhere else)
 
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If you live somewhere that you need a licence for a shotgun you are dealing with different legal issues. Besides I think any kind of defense against an intruder is not allowed in the UK.
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You can think what you like mate, doesnt have to be right though does it ? :p

In this country you are allowed to use "reasonable force" to defend yourself. What of course that means is open to interpretation. They recently updated the law "for clarity" but I still couldnt make head nor tail of it :(

Suffice to say, if anyone was busting into my house they would be meeting with Mr. Short Shrift fairly pronto, know what I mean :)
 
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