NMGonzo
Member
And you still get the factory service on the gun?
How to tell if SA 1911 is US or not?
- Thread starter Ash
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And you still get the factory service on the gun?
tipoc
Member
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- Mar 9, 2006
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Toforo,
I get your point about marketing but, seems to me, your points could be more easily understood if you stayed on the good side of rational.
I can consider a product as U.S. made one if the majority of the parts that make it up are produced in the U.S. and it is assembled here. If all the parts that make up the item are made in the U.S. but the lubricating oil is from Spain that alone should not invalidate the claim of U.S. made. Same as the loc-tite used by Ruger. That it is made by a German owned company changes nothing of note.
Now all this matters not if a fella, like me, does not care whether the gun is made in the U.S., Austria, or parts come from Brazil. A good gun is a good gun. I've also been immune to the bosses using sex, patriotism, love of mother, or the promise that I will become cool, sexy and James Bond like dangerous by purchasing their stuff, for quite some time.
tipoc
I get your point about marketing but, seems to me, your points could be more easily understood if you stayed on the good side of rational.
I can consider a product as U.S. made one if the majority of the parts that make it up are produced in the U.S. and it is assembled here. If all the parts that make up the item are made in the U.S. but the lubricating oil is from Spain that alone should not invalidate the claim of U.S. made. Same as the loc-tite used by Ruger. That it is made by a German owned company changes nothing of note.
Now all this matters not if a fella, like me, does not care whether the gun is made in the U.S., Austria, or parts come from Brazil. A good gun is a good gun. I've also been immune to the bosses using sex, patriotism, love of mother, or the promise that I will become cool, sexy and James Bond like dangerous by purchasing their stuff, for quite some time.
tipoc
Toforo
Member
tipoc - I agree whole-heartedly. I buy what best fits my needs at a level of quality and service that can reach or exceed my expectations.
With regard to the post in which you were referring, I was simply responding to this:
(harmon rabb's post)
" i don't think any springfields are made 100% here. buy ruger if you want 100% american made (and not stupidly expensive). "
With regard to the post in which you were referring, I was simply responding to this:
(harmon rabb's post)
" i don't think any springfields are made 100% here. buy ruger if you want 100% american made (and not stupidly expensive). "
Quack
Member
$400 s a good buy...
and this is from my blog
A lot of debate has gone around on the internet about what the "NM" serial number prefix stands for. Some believe that it stands for "National Match", which is typically the case when you see that marking, however it's not so with Springfield 1911's. It is well known that Springfield Armory Inc. 1911's start from IMBEL forgings from Brazil. The 1911's that have the "Brazil" import marking's on the frame have more than 50% of the work performed by IMBEL, these would have the "N" prefix. The GI's are also made in Brazil and have the WW prefix. The Mil-spec model's can have either a N or NM prefix, with the N being more common.
Springfield's Loaded models, could either have the N or NM prefix. Model's with the N prefix are imported almost complete with the exception of the sight and beavertail grip safety cut's. These cuts are done at Springfield's facility in Geneseo, IL. The NM prefix Loaded's (as well as the Range Officer, TRP and Trophy Match) have the magwell and most of the internal cuts done, but no rail cuts. The final CNC machining on NM prefixes is done in Illinois. This information was from this article.
The rest of the 1911 prefixes such as LW, TGO-2, TGO-3 and EMP all come from Springfield's Illinois facility, though I have seen some older LW's marked "Brazil". The Custom Shop gun prefixes such as CRG, FBI, DEA, and TGO-1, as well as any other Custom Shop marked gun, are also made in Illinois. According to Springfield, the Custom Shop marked guns are built using "National Match" frames.
Is there a difference in build quality? In my opinion/experience...yes. In general the NM marked guns have a better frame/slide fit, than the similar model with a N prefix. Other's on the internet tend to look for the NM marked 1911's as well.
and this is from my blog
A lot of debate has gone around on the internet about what the "NM" serial number prefix stands for. Some believe that it stands for "National Match", which is typically the case when you see that marking, however it's not so with Springfield 1911's. It is well known that Springfield Armory Inc. 1911's start from IMBEL forgings from Brazil. The 1911's that have the "Brazil" import marking's on the frame have more than 50% of the work performed by IMBEL, these would have the "N" prefix. The GI's are also made in Brazil and have the WW prefix. The Mil-spec model's can have either a N or NM prefix, with the N being more common.
Springfield's Loaded models, could either have the N or NM prefix. Model's with the N prefix are imported almost complete with the exception of the sight and beavertail grip safety cut's. These cuts are done at Springfield's facility in Geneseo, IL. The NM prefix Loaded's (as well as the Range Officer, TRP and Trophy Match) have the magwell and most of the internal cuts done, but no rail cuts. The final CNC machining on NM prefixes is done in Illinois. This information was from this article.
The rest of the 1911 prefixes such as LW, TGO-2, TGO-3 and EMP all come from Springfield's Illinois facility, though I have seen some older LW's marked "Brazil". The Custom Shop gun prefixes such as CRG, FBI, DEA, and TGO-1, as well as any other Custom Shop marked gun, are also made in Illinois. According to Springfield, the Custom Shop marked guns are built using "National Match" frames.
Springfield Inc said:
Is there a difference in build quality? In my opinion/experience...yes. In general the NM marked guns have a better frame/slide fit, than the similar model with a N prefix. Other's on the internet tend to look for the NM marked 1911's as well.
Double Vision
Member
Quack, great info. Thanks.
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