I don't BELIEVE this @#$% judge!!!

Status
Not open for further replies.
Critical Thinking

odysseus said:
. . . . I personally also think this is less my opinion and more the art of critical thinking when we look to this case. I see less a reason to raise the flag to all about Christian Biblical reasoning for the concept of justice in this, than as a gross negligence of a misguided and irresponsible judge abusing his bench power.
Click to expand...

I agree. Thinking critically (an esoteric art in today's society), I am compelled to concede that we are essentially saying the same thing--since you put it that way.:rolleyes: But--continuing our critical line of thought--wouldn't you feel dumb if the sun didn't rise? Or--more specifically--if your sun didn't rise? I personally would hate to have to justify all that presumptuousness to God, if I said the sun were going to rise, and my sun didn't rise. I mean, thinking critically, of course.
 
Last edited:
matis said:
Again, without wishing to get into religious argument, both of your characterizations here mean little without the interpretaton and commentary that has become part of the religion.


Turning the other cheek is not the complete teaching of Christianity. Or there would be no Christian members of this gun forum.


As for an eye for an eye, this too is interpreted and means that retribution (something given or demanded in payment, especially in religion) must be exacted. This is translated into money damages. The perpetrator must pay for the damage he inflicted. Without consequences how can you expect people to keep the laws? Most of us are not saints, are we?


If you look at a page of Pentateuch (first five books of Moses = Old Testament), even an English translation, you will see a small rectangle of print in a box in the center. That is verse, a passge from Torah. All the rest of the page surrounding this central box, more than half, is devoted to commentary on the passage. The commentary comes from various writers, some going back over 1000 years. They explicate the text in the greatest of detail. They discuss the meaning of the words, the letters, why, say, plural rather than signular was used, and so on. Since Judaism is thousands of years old, the Torah and its commentary comprise a body of knowledge profound in its philosophy and sublime in its wisdom.


One doesn't have to believe in G-d to acknowledge this. One needs only to be objective and fair-minded.



And in Deuteronomy are to be founds words to the effect that a judge must neither be lenient toward the rich out of respect, nor toward the poor out of pity.

Has human nature changed in any way so as to invalidate that?

That, to my mind, is justice. And that is what we have fallen a long way from, to our detriment.


I don't think this is thread drift, I think this is part of the thread subject -- how has that judge gone astray. Again, not trying to start a religious argument.





matis
Click to expand...

I'm glad that you did all that work and spared me, Baruch ha'shem. In nomine Patris et Filii et Spiritus Sancti, amen.
 
And now - the rest of the story:

Burlington, Vermont -- January 6, 2006

A judge's ruling for a sex offender not only raises concerns about sentencing limits, but about Vermont's sex offender therapy program.

At issue is a prison policy that delays therapy for some sex offenders until they are back on the streets.

Under law, the primary mission of Vermont's prison system is to rehabilitate criminals to rejoin society.

The programs include corrective-therapy for sex offenders.

Problem is, some sex offenders must first be released to get into the program.

"I'm not surprised that the community is upset about this. Sex offenses are very serious," said Georgia Cumming, Executive Director of Vermont's Sex Offender Treatment Program.

Cumming says she understands why the public was upset when child-rapist Mark Hulett received a 60-day sentence for repeatedly raping a little girl.

Judge Edward Cashman has come under fire for the sentence. The judge says getting Hulett out of prison quickly is the only way to get Hulett into sex offender treatment program quickly because Hulett is classified as a low-risk offender, so he ineligible for in-prison treatment.

"All of the literature I've read said if you're interested in changing behavior, you don't have to do it inside. If anything, you have a better chance of success with an outside program," said Cashman when he handed out the 60-day sentence to Hulett on Wednesday.

Vermont's sex offender program has three categories of sex offender starting with level A -- like Hulett. He is considered to be low-risk and treatment starts only after he gets out of prison. Level B are medium to high risk offenders. They begin treatment inside prison. Level C are considered very high risk to re-offend and they begin treatment only near the end of their sentence, if at all.

Cumming says many factors are taken into consideration to determine the classifications.

"We look at does a person have a prior sexual offense? Does the offender have a prior non-sexual record? Has that offender offended against a stranger. So, the relationship of the offender to the victim tells you something about the type of risk they pose," Cumming explained.

As for Hulett, despite the severity of his crime, because he molested a neighbor's child, he qualifies as low-risk under the rating system.

"Well, offenders who have offended against a family member or another relative or neighbor who has not committed a prior offense typically score low on these risk assessment instruments, particularly if they have not, do not have any prior criminal history," Cumming added.

Governor Douglas asked his staff to reexamine sex offender classification policies. In the meantime, the Chittenden County prosecutor and Vermont's Attorney General say they may ask Judge Cashman to reconsider the sentence of Mark Hulett, and the possibility of appealing the sentence to the Supreme Court.
Click to expand...
- http://www.wcax.com/Global/story.asp?S=4330770
 
All nice and legal with all the right words and phrases and concepts.

All except for one tiny little factoid. There is no justice for the molested child.

Absolutely classic example of how the law and justice are not one and the same.

This episode is just one more piece of evidence that says our system of law is substituting process for justice. We will never have perfect justice this side of eternity, but we can do a damn sight better. :scrutiny:
 
A Tee-shirt

I know, political philosophy from a shirt is kinda screwy, but reading this made me think of one I read. "When injustice becomes law, rebellion becomes duty."
 
I get a total of 68 days in jail plus 2 years of probation for a non-violent misdemeanor and a child molester only gets 60 days for raping a child. As I have said before, I love this country because it's my home. I'm ashamed on how $#@%ed up the justice system is.
 
I am not sure what recourse the people of this judge's community have for removing him from the bench. Is he appoint4ed for life? Elected? If the latter, the folks who are concerned about this ought to make sure it doesn't happen again by removing him from the bench.

But I think that there is a better way to do this:
When the rapist gets out, palster posters with his pic and the statemant: "This man is a child-molester and rapist!" With his name and address on them, all over the town. Make sure he is not accepted anywhere.

Similar action could be done for the judge. Place postera with his pic, name, and job description saying: "This man freed a child molester and rapist after (howevermany) days in prison. The rapist could be living next door to YOU!"

Make sure that the judge cannot show his face in public. Let us see how long he and his family tolerate this behavior. I guess it used to be called "shunning" in the good old days.
 
Vermont's sex offender program has three categories of sex offender starting with level A -- like Hulett. He is considered to be low-risk and treatment starts only after he gets out of prison. Level B are medium to high risk offenders. They begin treatment inside prison. Level C are considered very high risk to re-offend and they begin treatment only near the end of their sentence, if at all.
Click to expand...
A couple of points:
He molested a seven year old for multiple years and he is a "LEVEL A"? What liberal came up with these levels?

Recidivism of molesters is considered a real problem from all reports I have read (if I am wrong, correct me). Why then is Vermont EVEN CONCERNED with treatment? Punish them for their crimes, up to and including execution IMHO.
 
I have a female family member that was repeately raped by a family aquaintiance from the age of 8-12. She is 31 now, and has a ton of issues/hangups becasue of what that bastard did. Wakes up screaming 2-3 nights a week. This is after 10+ years of counseling. Will not trust ANYONE and is emotionally basically still a hurt 10 year old anytime any stress gets put on her.

She has been in and out of mental institutions a couple times (week or so stays) as a result.

The only acceptable punishment for a child rapist, ESPECIALLY SERIAL ONES is DEATH:cuss:


/rant
 
Thumper723, that wasn't a rant.

In my opinion, It's a thought out opinion that you happen to be emotional about. Mine is the same, with the exception that a rapist should not be given the opportunity to become a serial rapist. My wife was raped by her then brother in law several years before we started dating. He skipped to Canada (born there) and hasn't been seen since. Her sister got a divorce through some legal wrangling without him present. Hell, I'd have been willing to save her the lawyer bills and make her a widow.
 
My take on "serial" was multiple times before they are caught. Once caught and convicted, they get LIFE or DEATH. NO PAROLE, NO REPRIVE, NO RELEASE, unless new evidence surfaces proving their innocence, and is retried and exonerated with the new evidence.

These pansy judges make me :barf:
 
Never let a pacifist/liberal be a judge

The judge said he no longer believes in punishment and is more concerned about rehabilitation.
Click to expand...
So there you go: This so-called judge is doing his job based on his personal opinions, not based on what he is lawfully duty bound to do. There are scentencing requirements for felony crimes and he is ignoring them - and breaking the law in the process.

This "judge" should be removed from the bench and disbarred at the bare minimum.

As far as rehabilitation, surgically removing the rapist's "weapon of choice" sounds to me like the only viable form of rehabilitation. A few years of being gang raped in the shower by his fellow inmates would also be a good choice for rehabilitation - a taste of his own medicine, so to speak.

Why yes, I am mean spirited - thanks for noticing!!:D :D
 
I recently watched a program I believe on A&E about sex offenders. The program talked about two forms of casteration<(spelling). One was chemical where the offender had to get a shot every week, the other was physical where the offender assuming is male has his balls removed.
 
The program talked about two forms of casteration<(spelling). One was chemical where the offender had to get a shot every week, the other was physical where the offender assuming is male has his balls removed.
Click to expand...

From my understanding neither of the methods listed above has been proven to be effective. Removing all male "anatomy" is also not effective from my understanding. There are prosthetic devices available and ordinary objects from the house can be used (and have been ) by someone who is "post surgery" or who is "not fully functional".

My personal opinion is child abuse should lead to either death/permanent life imprisonment after conviction. As always I could be wrong but several decade of imaging and caring for abused children leaves me with my mind made up.

NukemJim
 
My understanding...

is that rape and molestation are not about sex but about violence and power.

Recycling those that rape or molest would seem to be the most sane course of action. Pass them on to their next cycle of reincarnation. Allow them to have a life do-over.

migoi
 
Every day, as I work in the criminal justice system (I'm a criminal defense lawyer) I'm reminded of the gap between the world as it ought to be and the world as it really is. You're all totally right to be outraged at this defendant's behavior. Problem is, what do we do next? "Rehabilitation through reincarnation"? Good slogan, and might be possible in an ideal world. In the real world, more people die of old age on Death Row than get executed. Not gonna happen.

Sure, punishment is a legitimate goal. A bigger goal, IMHO, is to get the offender turned around (if at all possible) so he doesn't do it again when he gets out (at least in my state, the ones who can't get turned around get sent to the "special commitment center"- a prison pretending to be a mental hospital- for life). Yes, he deserves to suffer for this. Is that suffering going to protect the next potential victim when he gets out, as 95% or so of inmates do?

I don't know the details of how they do things in Vermont. Here, if someone is treatable (and that's not always possible) it's possible to get part of the sentence suspended on condition they pass sex offender treatment. Those who do pass are far less likely to reoffend than those who simply serve their time and get released. Blow it, and they serve the original sentence. That sounds like what the judge did in this case- either get your head straight or do the time. In reality, that's a pretty efficient way to deal with a case like this.

I'm trying to avoid the metaphysical aspects of this, but in my (minority) view the offender has already incurred the negative karma of harming another person. He can pay that price later. What I want, as a taxpayer and citizen, is to minimize the likelihood that this will happen again in the most efficient way possible. From that perspective, this judge's decision makes sense.
 
Quote:
I recently watched a program I believe on A&E about sex offenders. The program talked about two forms of casteration<(spelling). One was chemical where the offender had to get a shot every week, the other was physical where the offender assuming is male has his balls removed.
Click to expand...
My mother used to talk about that?......Something about a couple of nails, a stump, and a kick in the chest!!!:D
 
Moderator Note

All right folks, please drop the religious debate or take it over to APS. It does not belong on THR.

thanks.

pax
 
p35 said:
What I want, as a taxpayer and citizen, is to minimize the likelihood that this will happen again in the most efficient way possible. From that perspective, this judge's decision makes sense.
Click to expand...

Actually, given the recidivism rate for this type of offense, locking him up for life is probably a more sensible decision, if you're looking at prevention.
 
anybody got an updated link to the original article? The one on the first page is dead.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Master Blaster
  • Locked
Knives a threat in the hands of the law abiding - no punishment for criminal use (UK)
2
Replies
29
Views
979
thebucket
T
V
  • Locked
Military Judge Rejects England's Plea Deal
Replies
17
Views
632
buzz_knox
B
J
  • Locked
Justice Opposes Sentencing Law
Replies
10
Views
594
jimpeel
J
T
  • Locked
Compensation to family reduces sentence in DUI case
Replies
10
Views
526
harpethriver
H
D
  • Locked
(NV) Judge stops just short of telling abuse victim to get a gun - she didn't
Replies
7
Views
2K
Standing Wolf
S
Back
Top