I was caught CCW during State employment

[Redfern]

Since the small .22 semi-auto (Jennings)was seen behind my belt during field work, I was reported.

The first Comittee meeting: I try to lie, and claim it was a CO2 pellet gun.

The second Comittee meeting I came clean and admitted I carried it.

I haven't been punished or fired yet: I am claiming that my "High Anxiety" from a fear of being attacked was the reason I carried. I am a non-confrontational person but I am concerned about my personal safety during field work.

Meanwhile, I just received notice of an independent medical exam i should go to ( in 2 weeks).

Do I need an Attorney? Or am I just screwed, and out of a job?

 

[Mike Irwin]

Big question is, what do your terms of employment say about carrying guns.

Is the medical exam a psych exam?

 

[Dave R]

If it were me...this is one of those times when an attorney is worth the fee. For a consult, if nothing else.

 

[Sprout]

Lawyer up. Most attorneys will do a consultation for free.

 

[Andrew Wyatt]

were you carrying legally?

 

[Double Naught Spy]

If carrying is not permitted by your employer and your employer is emphatic about it, then your employer can fire you. The fact that you initially lied about the gun is not going to work in your favor.

No doubt your "high anxiety" of being attacked is going to be perceived as being paranoid unless you can produce some sort of valid/justified argument to substantiate your fear. Even if against the rules, if you can show a valid reason you were carrying (and assuming you didn't break any laws), then they may opt not to fire you.

Sadly, you were caught CCW because your weren't actually carrying concealed.

 

[Frohickey]

Independent medical exam...

Hmm... its time to cut your losses and ditch the job. You don't know what that medical exam has in store for you.

 

[Matt G]

Redfern:

Get a lawyer? Yes. Actually. You should.

--Matt G.

 

[swampsniper]

QUIT WHILE YOUR'E AHEAD

I carried, against company rules, for the last six years I worked. I would have been out the door in an instant had I been caught, but it was a dangerous job. I hung on to the job because it was dangerous enough that they could get few people to stay, and I needed the money all the resulting overtime brought. The Cops that worked the area knew I was armed, thought it was a good idea, and did not report me to the company. Somehow, through the grapevine, all the drunks, addicts and other possible trouble sources got the word that the old guy behind the counter might be a bit dangerous, and I had a lot less trouble than most who worked my hours when I was off. I imagine I have the Cops to thank for this.
I can understand company policies. You have to make your own decisions, however, and understand the risks involved. At your point, I would resign. No telling what the company doctor or shrink will make you out to be.

http://groups.msn.com/Riflephotos

 

[gunsmith]

jennings?

jennings?
that was your first mistake.
get a North American Mini Arms in .22mag
to keep in your pocket.
tell the central committee your sorry,just saw "bowling for columbine"
and now you know the error of your ways.
The central committee being a bunch of insipid morons (all anti gun folks are real dumb)
will believe you and you can keep your job.
keep it concealed and it will be concealed...you have a permit right?


__________________

mike moore is a jerk!

 

[swingset]

My advice? There are a million jobs, but only 1 you. You carried, you got caught, if they can you fine move on and find something else.

I carry against company policy, but my basic human rights override my paranoid boss, so I fully accept the risk and the consequences.

BTW, I don't wanna be a jerk, but a .22 Jennings is not much of a carry gun - in fact it's a piss-poor one to rely on to save your life. See the video of the lawyer getting shot 6 times to convince yourself your gun is nearly useless in a gun battle.

A good .40 cal in a small frame can be had for $250, God sakes go buy yourself one.

 

[telewinz]

State employment..you knew you were wrong

I wish you the best of luck in your case but what you did is just plain DUMB! Why not leave a bottle of Jim Beam on your desk also, that way you will be ready when you or a co-worker might need a drink. You are letting your passion for guns cloud your judgement and control your life. You are on your way out (due process) the medical exam will test your mental health more than anything else, get a lawyer. If you are taking any medications maybe the lawyer can claim impaired judgement (side effects) or agree to counseling and get you off with a suspension. IT IS MOST LIKELY your best option is to resign before you are terminated, but there are not a million GOOD paying jobs out there. You need to change your behavior if you ever wish to obtain and KEEP a good paying job. Swingset is correct, there are a million (jobs) pizza delivery jobs out there but is that the "career" you will be happy with when you are 40?

my basic human rights override my paranoid boss, so I fully accept the risk and the consequences.

CCW in many states (and locations) is not a basic human right, its a felony!

 

[Lone_Gunman]

I think you might be wasting your money on a lawyer, not sure how a lawyer could help.

If the company has a "no guns" policy, then a lawyer really can't help you.

Lying about the gun certainly didnt help either.

Were you otherwise carrying legally, company policy not withstanding?

This medical exam thing is interesting. Would you have had to undergo it anyway? or is this in response to the gun?

 

[swingset]

IT IS MOST LIKELY your best option is to resign before you are terminated, but there are not a million GOOD paying jobs out there. You need to change your behavior if you ever wish to obtain and KEEP a good paying job. Swingset is correct, there are a million (jobs) pizza delivery jobs out there but is that the "career" you will be happy with when you are 40?

You're awful judgmental, and I mean that in the harshest way I can say and still be a good board member. Lookie here, you wanna lay down your BASIC HUMAN RIGHT to defend your life for an unconsitutional law or for a job, fine - better to comply with the law. You'll thank yourself when you're life is threatened. As someone who's been through an assault, let me say have a good time, I hope you're last thought is "Well, at least I didn't piss my boss off".

And, as for jobs, you're totally wrong. There are good jobs, and no job is worth dying for. None. I lost a very good job several years ago over an ethics question, and walked out without prospects in the middle of a bad time for my industry. Things were tough for a while, then I landed a better job. I don't deliver pizzas, either.

The guy did something that has consequences, but it doesn't make it wrong. Lay off him. Better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.

 

[Jack19]

I haven't read through all the responses, but....this is what gives responsible firearms owners a bad name.

Your agency policy will play into this, although the fact that you've been to two "committee" meetings tell me that it frowns, officially, on weapons carry.

If it isn't an officially written policy you could have claimed ignorance if you had not already lied to them about what it was. That indicates to me that you knew their policy. Now, everything you say is suspect.

Still, I don't have an issue with your carrying even when it was against the policy of your employer, lots of people make that decision. But, the lying was a huge mistake. Odds are they may fire you for lying if their firearms policy isn't clear.

How did you fail to conceal a Jennings .22?

At this point, I'd have a heart to heart with my boss. Confess to extreme stupidity, poor decision making, fear, enlightenment, and, then, promise that it will never happen again and see if he, or she, will go to bat for you with the powers-that-be.

On the up side, the order to report for the IME is semi-positive. If they were going to fire you right away, they'd just do it. On the other hand, if it's a psych exam.......

And, yeah, I'd also heed the advice to lawyer up. At least as far as a consultation regarding how to handle the IME. Beyond that, I think you're wasting your money if the policy is written and you had knowledge of it. You won't be winning any wrongful termination suits.

 

[TonyB]

I too work in a state run facility(mental hospital)...and do not carry while at work.....we have a security office that I sometimes keep my gun in their safe......it does suck but I NEED my job.....I carry at all other times....good luck man......I'd avoid the "medical exam" if at all possible..it's going to be a psych exam and it could lead to your CCW being pulled......

 

[Waitone]

Get a lawyer and let him tell you that you are screwed.

Beware the medical exam. I suspect it is connected with your recent troubles. A psych exam can really mess up your future use of firearms.

Yea, a lawyer sounds good to me.

 

[Bill Hook]

Never lie, as this alone is grounds for termination and what I'd suspect they'll use as the reason, rather than the gun.

A lawyer might beat a fuzzy weapons policy, but not untruthfulness. I'd look into resigning and a new job, after consulting with a lawyer who specializes in employment issues. Be sure to bring all the copies of you agency's policies w/ you to make it more productive.

 

[Andrew Rothman]

Redfern wrote on April 14th (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=18475):

When I asked the "Executives" of my department to obtain "advanced written permission" to carry in the field, I was told that the "Firearms Prohibited Policy" is completely defensible in Washington State's AG's office, and I would lose my job.

So clearly he had already asked for, and been denied, permission to carry.

You're outa luck, dude. Quit while you're ahead.

 

[444]

There isn't enough information to answer. Is there a clear cut policy against carrying on the job ? And most important of all, are you a union worker ?

 

[swampsniper]

NO SHRINKS!!!!

There is also no doubt in my mind that the exam will be by a shrink. It will not matter what your actual mental condition is if the Doctor happens to be one of the many that believe that anyone associated with a gun has mental problems. One little note on a report can put you on the list for no more guns as long as you live. I would not allow this exam to take place.
You can find a job. Take this as an example of what happens when you are a little careless, take the hit on your lifestyle for a while if you have to, and work through it. If you fight it your'e going to lose.
By the way, some of you folks would be amazed to know what a buddy of mine makes delivering pizza.

http://groups.msn.com/Riflephotos

 

[spacemanspiff]

CCW in many states (and locations) is not a basic human right, its a felony!

its only a felony because those states/locations arbitrarily reject the human rights that the Constitution recognizes. the human right to self defense is still there, but the powers that be refuse to let their servants defend themselves.

 

[OF]

Consult a lawyer and ask them what happens if you quit. Then quit. What good could possibly come from staying on?

- Gabe

 

[444]

Before everyone gets too carried away we need to find out what the rules of the game are.
Do they have a specific written policy in regard to carry concealed weapons ? If they do, there isn't much you can do about it. You violated one of the rules and you will be punished. If this is the case I would just quit rather than go to the "Physical".
If there is no clear cut written policy, are you a union worker ? If you are a union worker, you have recourse. #1 you won't have to take the "physical" #2 you won't be disiplined since you didn't violate any of the rules #3 if they want to push it, the union will provide the lawyer. If you are a union worker, you need to immediately contact your union and discuss the matter with them. Don't do anything without representation.
Did you violate any law by carrying ? Was concealed carry legal where you did it ? Do you have a concealed carry permit ?

 

[Obiwan]

I feel bad for your situation

But I always wonder when people break the rules and then try to find a way around it.

Don't like the rules...find a place with better rules...

or follow the rules......

Or break them......but don't whine if you get caught.

And lying just digs the hole deeper...

I am big on second chances in most cases ...but not when the guy lies.

And I would resign rather than take the IME...work out the best severance you can.