I wish HK (or someone) would make a semi auto MP5 clone
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FIVETWOSEVEN
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Because HK sues those that copy the MP5 in semi auto and HK I don't think is allowed to make a semi auto MP5 for civies because of government contract reasons.
There are several on the market. Multiple Todd Bailey brands (coharie, bobcat, vector...). The Turkish MKE makes a nice clone. Dakota tactical makes arguably the finest clones, but they command a premium and there is a long wait.
I really wish PTR would start cranking em out.
I really wish PTR would start cranking em out.
FIVETWOSEVEN
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Because as I said, HK sues those making MP5 clones. They don't care about the G3 anymore but they still make the MP5.
If that were the case, why are there several clone manufacturers still operating. PTR probably doesn't manufacture them because the demand won't meet their required production volume. Cheaper brands like vector undercut them for those wanting a cheap version, MKE covers those that want decent quality at a higher price, and custom shops like Dakota tactical and parabellum combat systems cover those that want HK quality at a premium price. The market is covered, so there's not much room for them to compete, nor is it a very large market to begin with.
How is a $2000+ Vector a cheaper version? PTRs in all other calibers tend to be around $1000 for a basic model.
All the MP5 semi auto clones are horribly over priced for what you're getting IMHO. Add to that how silly they are with a 16" barrel and the need to SBR them.
vaupet
Member
Bizar,
because in Belgium, the H&K importer, who services leo and military, sells factory made semi auto mp5 to the general public (provided they get licenses for it)
I even have one friend who legally ownes a fulll auto mp5 with silencer.
greetz
Peter
because in Belgium, the H&K importer, who services leo and military, sells factory made semi auto mp5 to the general public (provided they get licenses for it)
I even have one friend who legally ownes a fulll auto mp5 with silencer.
greetz
Peter
Actually, they are not new but reconditioned former police carbines. Ask me how I know …
If HK wanted to export MP5’s for civilians they would have to develop a ’sport’ version in accordance with German export laws.
Something like the SL8 (sport version of G36) or the USC45 (sport version of UMP45).
vaupet
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you learn some thing every day
txs
Peter
txs
Peter
Giterboosted
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Umm hk makes one, we have one at work, it's a true hk 9mm "rifle" it's not called mp5 but literally the only difference is semi vs auto
nwilliams
Member
There is certainly a market for it, the GSG-5 and Umarex MP-5-22 has proven that and there have been numerous HK-94 clones on the market ever since HK stopped importing the 94, some good and some really bad.
The Vector ones were decent and reasonably priced and can still be found fairly easily although they've gone up in value. I would personally stay away from most others especially the ones Vulcan (Hesse) made for a short time, they were complete garbage.
ATI imported the Turkish MKE AT-94 for a short time and they were the first HK-94 clones that were pretty much on par in quality with the HK version. I picked one up a few years back and several thousand rounds later I have yet to have a single malfunction. Sadly ATI stopped importing the MKE AT-94 and they are getting harder to find and starting to climb in value like the original HK-94.
16" barrel or not I still have a blast shooting my MKE AT-94. Eventually I'll SBR it but that's low on the priority list right now of ways to spend my money.
Dlowe167
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MachIVshooter
Member
And US import laws.
Of course, both could be avoided by simply manufacturing here. Domestic manufacturers can build and sell to the public anything they can dream up, except full auto. Some things require a few hoops be jumped through, of course. That MP5K you have pictured is a title II NFA firearm here, and would require an SBR tax stamp, which is $200 and a ~6 month wait. But if made without a stock and sold as a handgun, is a title I gun, nothing more than an instant background check to buy. Yeah, I know............
Destructo6
Member
The Turkish company MKE imported a license built MP5 clone up until about a year ago, the At-94.
Last gunshow, I saw a few for $1,000 each.
Last gunshow, I saw a few for $1,000 each.
boricua9mm
Member
This question seems to pop up every few months. There is a market for it, but to put it simply, these guns are not cheap to manufacture, yet the cheap American consumer wants a military grade firearm for $600.
Your options here in the US are:
HK94: $4000+, if you can swing it, do it.
Special Weapons, Coharie, Black Market Parts: These are the Todd Bailey guns. Some people are unaware that Todd did not always make all of his own parts. For a while RCM was making parts exclusively for Todd. They, like everyone else, had a falling out and they are no longer affiliated with one another. Todd argues that RCM is the reason for those of his guns that were problematic. RCM disputes it, saying they made all parts to Bailey's specs. Fact is that RCM is now known for making excellent parts for roller-locked HK pattern guns.
Bobcat Weapons and Vector Arms: People erroneously lump these together with Todd bailey's other companies. They are not. They had agreements with Todd to use receivers, barrels and parts (exact lists unknown), but Todd did not bend them, weld them or finish them. Eventually Todd decided he wanted the market all to himself so he broke off his agreements with both these companies.
MKE: These are the Turkish clones previously mentioned. Some folks claim they are the best thing short of an Oberndorf rifle. My opinion is different; the ones I have seen all had some nasty welds and appeared to be made from used parts kits, and were marked in a fashion which supports it. Some folks say the earlier rifles were much better, which may be true. I have seen 5 or 6 of them, and all looked like poorly made kit guns.
Bellator Arms: I don't know much about these other than they are most likely made with the latest Black Market Parts (Todd bailey) barreled receivers. From what I understand the chambers are un-fluted, which is strange. I believe they also have a strange ribbed cocking tube in order to skirt the trade dress issues from H&K.
Getz Firearms: He's a member over at HKPro. I believe he may be using receivers from Todd bailey, which isn't surprising b/c there's very few, if any, people making MP5 receivers right now. End user reports say that these builds are great.
Dakota Tactical: These are custom builds made using RCM parts or German kits. Build quality is reported to be excellent, but there is a significant wait time. Not sure whose receivers they are, most likely LSC flats.
Parabellum Combat Systems: Also known as "Ghillibear," Jeff is a custom builder. Super nice guy who is very talented and capable of producing some very interesting odd projects. You provide him with everything and he builds it.
_________________________
Personally, I have a BW5 that has been SBRd and it runs great. It had some problems feeding flat point ammo, but that is a pretty common issue with MP5s; there is no feed ramp to speak of and the rounds get slammed into the top of the chamber in order to feed. The only gripe I have with mine is that the barrel was not pressed in with pinpoint accuracy, so the rear sight needed to be drifted a good bit to get zeroed. I'm a "set and forget" guy so I could care less.
To me, if you've got a good barreled receiver with an RCM bolt group and a genuine HK trigger group, it is a beautiful thing. Most problems can be solved with a $10 extractor spring, a $50 German extractor, or a $50 ejector. A lot of people get upset that they would pay over $1k and have to debug it, but "it is what it is."
Video: The Truth About MP5 Clones
Me...I don't regret it one bit...
In more classic dress:
Your options here in the US are:
HK94: $4000+, if you can swing it, do it.
Special Weapons, Coharie, Black Market Parts: These are the Todd Bailey guns. Some people are unaware that Todd did not always make all of his own parts. For a while RCM was making parts exclusively for Todd. They, like everyone else, had a falling out and they are no longer affiliated with one another. Todd argues that RCM is the reason for those of his guns that were problematic. RCM disputes it, saying they made all parts to Bailey's specs. Fact is that RCM is now known for making excellent parts for roller-locked HK pattern guns.
Bobcat Weapons and Vector Arms: People erroneously lump these together with Todd bailey's other companies. They are not. They had agreements with Todd to use receivers, barrels and parts (exact lists unknown), but Todd did not bend them, weld them or finish them. Eventually Todd decided he wanted the market all to himself so he broke off his agreements with both these companies.
MKE: These are the Turkish clones previously mentioned. Some folks claim they are the best thing short of an Oberndorf rifle. My opinion is different; the ones I have seen all had some nasty welds and appeared to be made from used parts kits, and were marked in a fashion which supports it. Some folks say the earlier rifles were much better, which may be true. I have seen 5 or 6 of them, and all looked like poorly made kit guns.
Bellator Arms: I don't know much about these other than they are most likely made with the latest Black Market Parts (Todd bailey) barreled receivers. From what I understand the chambers are un-fluted, which is strange. I believe they also have a strange ribbed cocking tube in order to skirt the trade dress issues from H&K.
Getz Firearms: He's a member over at HKPro. I believe he may be using receivers from Todd bailey, which isn't surprising b/c there's very few, if any, people making MP5 receivers right now. End user reports say that these builds are great.
Dakota Tactical: These are custom builds made using RCM parts or German kits. Build quality is reported to be excellent, but there is a significant wait time. Not sure whose receivers they are, most likely LSC flats.
Parabellum Combat Systems: Also known as "Ghillibear," Jeff is a custom builder. Super nice guy who is very talented and capable of producing some very interesting odd projects. You provide him with everything and he builds it.
_________________________
Personally, I have a BW5 that has been SBRd and it runs great. It had some problems feeding flat point ammo, but that is a pretty common issue with MP5s; there is no feed ramp to speak of and the rounds get slammed into the top of the chamber in order to feed. The only gripe I have with mine is that the barrel was not pressed in with pinpoint accuracy, so the rear sight needed to be drifted a good bit to get zeroed. I'm a "set and forget" guy so I could care less.
To me, if you've got a good barreled receiver with an RCM bolt group and a genuine HK trigger group, it is a beautiful thing. Most problems can be solved with a $10 extractor spring, a $50 German extractor, or a $50 ejector. A lot of people get upset that they would pay over $1k and have to debug it, but "it is what it is."
Video: The Truth About MP5 Clones
Me...I don't regret it one bit...
In more classic dress:
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