Ideas for 6.5 Grendel build...

[David4516]

Hey THR,

I had another thread going here:

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=803118

But it devolved into a debate about weather or not .308 was a good long range cartridge. So I'm starting a new thread...

Anyway, I am working on building an AR-15 in 6.5 Grendel, specially for shooting at longer distances (500 yards +). So far I have an upper and a scope. Not sure where to go from here, and would value your opinions / advice.

This is the upper I've got:

http://shop.redxarms.com/20-RXA15-65-GRENDEL-TACTICAL-FLUTED-SS-UPPER-2065GRENDELUH.htm

Here is the scope:

http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-16x42-Tactical-Riflescope-P53715.aspx

So next step is to get a lower and a scope mount.

I was thinking the basic weaver scope mount would work, I don't think I need a 20MOA mount because I don't think this cartridge is capable of shooting far enough to need one anyway. If I'm wrong please let me know.

http://swfa.com/Weaver-Thumb-Nut-SPR-Optics-30mm-Mount-P67295.aspx

As for the lower, I think the lower itself is a non-issue, from my limited experience lowers are all pretty much the same, just have a different logo on the side.

I know that the trigger will be important, I see alot of "drop in" triggers for about $200+ and the regular "mil spec" trigger for WAY cheaper. Is there no middle ground on these?

Not sure about the stock either. This thing looked kinda cool:

http://www.luth-ar.com/product/the-mba-modular-buttstock-assembly/

Like a Magpul PRS but without the pricetag. I know most the time you "get what you pay for" though so I'm wondering if this stock will hold up? Anybody here ever tried one?

I've also thought about getting a cheaper stock for now and just upgrading later (or just keeping the basic stock if it turns out to be OK for me). Something like this maybe:

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/972740/hogue-overmolded-collapsible-stock-ar-15-lr-308

This upper has quad-rail (not a huge fan, lots of sharp edges). The only thing I think I'm going to attach to it is a bipod. I see they make rail adapters for a sling mount bipod. Is there any such thing as a bipod that just mounts directly to the rail without needing an adapter?

The one thing I'm really not sure about though is the muzzle device. I'd like something to limit muzzle climb. Ideally I think it would be cool to be able to watch my bullet impact. I'm not worried about the recoil so much as the jump if that makes sense.

I don't know if this is even possible though. I have zero experience with breaks or compensators. I also want to be courteous to anybody who might be standing nearby, and I'm told that brakes can cause alot of concussion. Is there any such thing as a break that vents upward instead of sideways? My other challenge is that the treading on the muzzle is an oddball, it's 9/16-24, I don't think this is a common thread for most muzzle devices. Do you guys have any suggestions? Or should I just forget about it and put a thread protector on there?

Sorry this is a pretty vague / open ended set of questions. I'd appreciate your input though. Thanks in advance.

 

[blueskyjaunte]

I shoot a 6.5 Grendel that I built around a 20" Black Hole Weaponry barrel (technically .264 LBC). I learned a lot about building a precision AR over the course of this.

Whether your rifle is capable of sub-MOA accuracy has a lot to do with the quality of the upper (the barrel, especially). The barrel for my rifle cost nearly as much as your complete upper, so I have to wonder how well-made your barrel is. You'll only know for certain once you get out and shoot using match-grade ammunition. If you don't reload, I recommend the Hornady 123 gr. A-Max. I have had good luck with it. I have not had consistent results with the cheaper stuff (especially Prvi Partizan).

To answer your questions:

1) Scope mount: Whether you "need" a 20 MOA base depends on how much upward adjustment your scope offers. If you're planning to shoot mostly long distance, you might as well make the investment. Personally, I went with an ADM AD-RECON with a 20 MOA incline. Whatever you get, make sure it locks down SOLIDLY. You do not want a mount that will work itself loose.

2) Lowers are all pretty much the same, in my experience. ALG makes a very nice "mil-spec plus" trigger for under $80. At right around $120 is the Rock River National Match trigger, which is a two-stage affair with a nice crisp break. I use a Geissele SSA-E in my 6.5G, but I have the RR NM and ALG triggers in my other rifles.

3) Just get the Magpul PRS. It's really the best compromise for adjustment and cost. I have no experience with the Luth-AR but I knew a guy named Luther in college and didn't like him very much.

4) There are many bipods that mount directly to a rail. Even Harris makes them now.

5) 6.5 Grendel doesn't kick much at all. And when shooting over 500 meters your time of flight will give you plenty of opportunity to get back on target and observe your impacts (or misses...). A thread protector or simple birdcage will serve you just fine. I use a SilencerCo ASR brake to mount my SpecWar 7.62. Unsuppressed it's still a lot better than the .223 and .308 guys I was shooting next to during my last class--some of those guys were running comps that were downright obnoxious.

Hope this helps.

 

[David4516]

The barrel for my rifle cost nearly as much as your complete upper, so I have to wonder how well-made your barrel is.

Yeah I had never heard of this company before so I'm taking a gamble. Won't know if it shoots well until I get it completed and out to the range. My budget for this project wasn't that big in the first place so I decided to risk going with one of the cheaper options (hopefully it won't come back to bite me)

I knew a guy named Luther in college and didn't like him very much

There are many bipods that mount directly to a rail. Even Harris makes them now.

Thanks for the tip about harris that is news to me. I have the old sling swivel mount harris bipod on another rifle and I really like it. If they have a rail mount version that would be perfect.

6.5 Grendel doesn't kick much at all.

I've never shot one but being based on the 7.62x39 case I'd assume recoil would be similar. I'm not too worried about the recoil on my shoulder heck I'd even be ok with MORE recoil if it meant no muzzle jump. I just want the gun to stay on target to "observe my misses" (and hopefully be able to make corrections without having to have a spotter)

Hope this helps.

I does, thanks for your input!

 

[barnbwt]

Hey, cheap barrels are sometimes good; heck, Sarco has chambered blanks for 50$. Am I expecting to win a Palma match? No, but I am expecting to save several hundred dollars which went toward reloading supplies & ammo (and the bore looks pretty nice, too)

TCB

 

[MErl]

Regarding that Luth stock compared to the PRS
It is much lighter
It is not as easy to adjust but still workable. The cheekpiece is difficult to adjust after a point as it has to spring over the buffer tube. Whether this is an issue would depend on how high you want to go.
The PRS is much sturdier.

If weight matters go with the Luth. If you'll be adjusting it often go with the PRS. If you are dragging it around in the field it is up to you if durability trumps mass.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Gotta agree that lowers are pretty generic. The keys to a good lower for me are the trigger assembly I put into it and whatever the buttstock is. I am pretty forgiving on the buttstocks and can use just about anything from the cheapest faux military version to the higher end versions. I like the high end versions better, usually getting better cheap welds with them, but the trigger is not something on which I would compromise. Your Luther looks interesting!

 

[David4516]

Looks like my best bet for now is to go cheap on the other parts except for the trigger. I can always buy a nicer stock later for example...

I didn't see anything on the Harris Bipod website for a direct rail mount option, but I might just be looking in the wrong place. I did however find this "Odin low-profile" adapter that looks like it might work well with the bipod I already have

http://www.odinworks.com/P_Pod_p/acc-p-pod.htm

Still looking into the possibility of a comp too, found some "linear" compensators that look pretty cool, but none of them have the right thread

 

[Llama Bob]

Harris doesn't make a direct rail attach bipod for whatever reason although they do make adaptors. I've had good luck with the Larue modified version:

http://www.larue.com/harris-bipod-brm-s-and-larue-tactical-lt130-qd-mount

 

[Actionjrs]

I would suggest the rock river trigger I have one. I got it at mas defense for 90$ it's a 4.5lb trigger and it's pretty smooth. As for the lowers there pretty much all the same I have found that spikes lowers are a nice tight fit (better for accuracy)

 

[David4516]

I'm thinking about getting an SAA lower, mainly because I like their cross hair logo

I just bought my first two parts for the lower, a BAD level and an "enhanced" trigger guard (for no other reason than I think they look cooler than the standard trigger guard).

I'm thinking about getting the rifle stock instead of a mil-spec or commercial carbine stock. I am under the impression that the rifle stock requires a different buffer and buffer spring? Does the fact that this is a 6.5 and not a 5.56 have any impact/effect on the buffer choice (basically wondering if I can just used the standard stuff or do I need something special)?

 

[blueskyjaunte]

I use a standard carbine buffer and spring in my 6.5. I'm running a Magpul UBR stock on it because I need the collapsibility over the adjustability a PRS would provide. No issues ... so far.

A fixed rifle stock would require a rifle spring and buffer.

 

[David4516]

I'm thinking I might just buy one of these "stock kits" for starters and upgrade to a PRS or something later when I've got more money (yeah like that will ever happen LOL)

http://palmettostatearmory.com/a2-rifle-stock-kit.html

 

[David4516]

Another dumb question:

Can one use a pistol comp on a rifle?

https://www.lonewolfdist.com/Detail.aspx?PROD=919522&CAT=313

The .40 cal comp has the same thread as my 6.5 barrel...

 

[David4516]

Rifle is pretty much complete at this point, I'm attaching a photo. The scope in the photo was just a "place holder", I didn't have a 30mm mount so I had a cheap bushnell scope on there in a 1 inch mount. I got a 30mm mount a few days ago so now I've got the 16X SWFA scope on there... I'll have an updated photo later showing it with the correct optic...

On the lower I went with the SAA, standard parts except for I got a RISE 3.5 pound trigger and anti-rotation pins. Went cheap for starters with a magpul MOE stock, might upgrade this later (but then again if it works ok with the basic stock I'll probably just go with it).

 

[Double Naught Spy]

That should do, nicely.

 

[David4516]

Took it to the range on Monday, shooting 0.4 inch group at 100 yards and hitting steel targets out to 525 with relative ease. I need a longer range to really test the limits of this thing...

 

[LoonWulf]

excellent, glad your builds working out for you!
The grendels are a blast. Low recoil excellent bullet performance, acceptable hold overs.

I only shot my long range grendel for a bit before trading it, but it was nice being able to watch my rounds land on or near target at range. All of my other longer range guns i need a spotter to call shots.
I still have a light weight 20" build, havent run that one at range yet. Maybe this week if i can get out.

 

[wally]

I just want the gun to stay on target to "observe my misses"

To "observe your misses" with a 6.5m at 500 yards you are going to need a very high dollar scope! if its even possible -- its why they make expensive "spotter scopes"

 

[crazysccrmd]

To "observe your misses" with a 6.5m at 500 yards you are going to need a very high dollar scope! if its even possible -- its why they make expensive "spotter scopes"

That all depends on the background of the target. I can spot misses out beyond 800m with my 6.5-284 when the target background is dirt or rock. I can't do that if the background is vegetation, especially on tundra. I have a 6-24x50 PST on that rifle.

 

[LoonWulf]

]Not really to hard to spot misse dependent on environment. where i shoot you can usually see dust or rock chunk puffs. Its not a horribly efficient way to shoot long range, but i had no problem walking my shots in on torso size rocks at well over the 400 some od yards my old range finder worked at....and scope was a leupold mark ar, not supper expensive.

 

[dh1633pm]

I have had good luck with the Rock River Arms Match Trigger. Less expensive than many and a good trigger.

 

[David4516]

The range I usually shoot at has dirt berms that make it fairly easy to spot where your round is going if you miss the target. In areas with grass or other vegetation it would be considerably more difficult. So far it's been a moot point as I'm not missing