(IN) Police want firearms with more power

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Rick, if keeping them out of the LOS of Barry BG and Sally Socermommie is the objective, then why not carry them as does Trooper Helmer in his state po-po commission, up top, zipped up out of sight? If you need it, whether a shotgun or kotex for a new hole, shouldn't it be where you are? Don't know how IPD's insurance is written, could be a factor.

Just asking. I've always found it strange that any copper would carry a weapon "in the trunk." What if BG is shooting at you with his CKC and won't let you get to the trunk? Yeah, it'll never happen.:)

If IPD does get new gear, I hope someone considers that.
 
el tejon

How did you know where I keep my shotgun? You almost described it to the letter. I keep mine zipped up and protected, but next to my hip between the seat and the door.


I will probably never need a rifle, but I would like to have it if I needed it. I have had several incidents that could have become worse and where a long arms would have put me in a better situation.We had two police action shootings involving open ground fire from a suspect. One situation we were waiting for the ERT team to arrive and the situation developed before they could arrive. The second situation developed with the ERT team present, but they were the only officers with rifles.

We lucked out in both cases. Slugs and buckshot are not enough at 100 yards on. Believe it or not that was the distance at which the suspect engaged us with his rifle.
 
tlhelmer, oh, I believe it. Don't forget someone had to read all those police reports that you guys generate.

How did I know? Well, about `96, a bunch of us DPAs volunteered to drink and take FSTs from rookie troopers at the West Lafayette post. An alleged training (that word again) experience

I showed up early to yak. Rich Kelley and Brent Bible gave me a tour of the joint. They let me sit in Rich's commission and showed me the radio. I just happen to notice the shotgun and asked where the carbine was. They both looked at me like I was drinking already.

I don't see why the Super won't let you have carbines, at least PODA if budget problems. If liability concerns, wouln't a shotgun be of greater concern as there are 9 lawsuits there as compared to a single .223 bullet? As long as you guys get your hours, you should have them. I couldn't imagine patrolling some parts of the state where you can get mighty lonely without it.

Yellow footprints aside, I can't see why Mel won't address your concerns. You sure it comes from his office? Seems like a reasonable fellow.
 
Rick,
That's exactly what I was thinking. It wouldn't take formal competition either, just a couple guys with a portable thrower. Doubles would be a challenge with a short barrel and cylinder bore. I haven't tried it with my slug barrel, but it might be fun to try.
 
What's the fixation with the long weapon "in the trunk"?
Click to expand...

For those of us who are non "high-speed/low-drag" LEO types, KSF... er, El Tejon, this is a metaphor for "available". ;)

I don't care if it's a Mini-14 in a roof rack or a pistol caliber carbine stuffed in the top of his Hi-Tec boot; it would be nice if he had a weapon with a shoulder stock, a long sight radius, and the ability to connect solidly at 100 yards available to him.

This can be done without putting him in black fatigues with a K-pot and pintle-mounting an M2HB on his Crown Vic, thereby making us taxpayers feel as though we were living in El Banana Republico...
 
Tamara, O.K., but "in the trunk" assumes Barry BG will let you get to the trunk with the squad key before lighting you up with his CKC or whatever. From what I gather the IPD puppies could not call "King's X" and go access their trunks. I would want it up front with me, but maybe I'm insecure.:confused:

Maybe, as usual, I'm making too big a deal of it, but just wanted to know why people think the trunk is a good place for a weapon. Geez, can't a guy free associate on the Errornet?

Tamara, besides the only "high-speed/low-drag" work I did in LE or the militree was speed dialing the telephone!:D
 
More long guns are "lost" during donut shoppe stops, I'll wager than "needed" during BG confrontations. Just my thoughts, worth whut ya paid!
 
tlhelmer, when you see 1st Sgt. Bible next, tell him you met Kirk on the Errornet and say "hi." He'll just shake his head, sigh, and then start muttering about having to wait outside in the hallway during a day off (ask him about the peepee OWI/RLE we had)when Freeman or Gutwein HAD to have a trial or having a report sent back with questions scrawled over it. Not dealing with me makes all his paperwork headaches worthwhile:D
 
El Tejon,

It helps that new cruisers have trunk releases up front, so you hit the button and dash round back. The problem I've seen with keeping a gun in a zipped case in a vehicle is condensation will quickly turn your gun that ghastly orange color.

Our new racks will put the guns up outta sight and secure them in an electrical lock with a key bypass in a location readily available to the officer. That should make things better all around.

I'd rather see some form of rifle in the car but the powers that be don't see the necessity and their eyes kind of glaze over when I bring the concept up.

Tamara,

A lot of people are put off by the BDU look, maybe we need a thread on what is dignified, approachable and sensible for LEO wear.

Rick
 
Liability. This is the same reason the LAPD has just put a moratorium on high-speed chases. Of course the flip side is training, which translates into money.
 
I doubt modern cars provide much cover from any rifle round. Matter of fact one of the killin's I helped investigate where the shooter had an SKS the car looked like Swiss Cheese. Chinese ammo, Russian rifle and Japanese car had to come all the way to WV to meet.

Rick
 
I'd never go so far as to say that IPD has an internal policy that "discourages" patrol officers from having a 12-gauge, but their officers sure have to jump through a bunch of hoops to get a shotgun issued to them. Most just opt to do without and not mess with the hassle. IPD has around 1,200 sworn personnel and I tell you what...if that department owns more than 250 shotguns, I'd sure be surprized.
 
Short of shooting .454 Casull's, I don't see a handgun matching any rifles anytime soon. So how is it that it takes so long to consider a rifle in the trunk?
 
The so called high power assault rifles in this article and others are nothing more than military weapons in calibers that have been around for the last 100 years. It seems like people now a days will call any military rifle produced in the last 100 years an assault rifle. Frank Hammer when chasing Bonnie & Clyde over 70 years ago had his specially modified .35 caliber Remington rifle. The other lawmen were equally armed with lever action 30\30's, BAR 30.06's and an assortment of other hunting caliber rifles. I have never seen why police officers were not allowed to have with them on duty a hunting caliber rifle in the trunk for when then occasion warrants. A shotgun is mainly a crowd control weapon at best, not an accurate medium or long range weapon. Even in the frontier days lawmen carried a long gun.
 
I don't think LEOs should have better firepower. They need to set a good, non-violent example for us all.

They shouldn't even be carrying handguns. Why, they could hurt someone!

Seriously, good for them. I hope they get the equipment they need to do their jobs more efficiently and effectively.
 
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