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Is jhp overkill in 45 acp?

Discussion in 'Handguns: General Discussion' started by brewer12345, Aug 8, 2018.

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  1. 460Shooter

    460Shooter Member

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    I guess I don't even really understand the concern. Overkill in what regard? If a situation is bad enough that you actually need to plug someone, you want to do the most damage per shot with little or no over penetration. Using a non expanding bullet increases the chance of over penetration and collateral damage.

    No, 45 caliber JHP are not overkill.
     
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  2. JR24

    JR24 Member

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    230 grain HST is an amazing bullet in every testing medium I've seen.

    And if you need your .45 you need all the help you can get, because you'll need your deadly threat stopper NOW.

    Heavy .45s will penetrate well.
     
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  3. Riomouse911

    Riomouse911 Member

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    When your life or the life of a loved one is on the line, you will be wanting the hammer of Thor to strike the suspect and stop him NOW. People RARELY flop down and stay down forever after one shot, that's Hollywood. People may fall after being hit with a bullet, but they're still in the fight until they choose to stop (or their body shuts down). Your selection of a quality JHP in .45 ACP is a very good choice for such an encounter.

    No such thing as "overkill" in such a situation IMHO. If the threat is stopped before any innocents were hurt, it was the perfect amount of "kill" to keep you and yours alive.

    As for the suspect, he chose his path in life. And his actions alone put you in a position where you were forced to end it. No tears shed for him here...

    Hopefully you'll never have to find out how effective your chosen load/caliber/firearm combo is:).

    Stay safe!
     
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  4. Deanimator

    Deanimator Member

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    I never carry anything but JHPs in my semi-auto pistols.

    I usually carry a 3 1/2" M1911, uaually loaded with Hornady or Speer 200gr. JHPs.

    In Ohio, a criminal assailant in a justified shooting or his survivors can't collect monetary damages. The person hit by a through and through can.
     
  5. CDW4ME

    CDW4ME Member

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    If (when) I'm carrying a 45 it will be loaded with HST or Ranger T
    I'll not intentionally handicap myself with FMJ
    FMJ.jpg
     
  6. buck460XVR

    buck460XVR Member

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    I never understood the thinking that there is such a thing as "overkill" when you are trying to kill something. If I'm trying to stop an attacker and have judged it's him or me, and my desire is to do it a quickly as possible, can I possibly make him "overdead"? The military uses FMJ for humanitarian reasons. I see no reason to do anything similar to someone who want to do me great bodily harm.
     
  7. FL-NC

    FL-NC Member

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    HP rounds perform better than ball. That's a fact. If they function reliably in the pistol (and no reason why they wouldn't do do in a XD) and they don't decrease performance or make the pistol less capable in terms of increased recoil or weight, or decreased accuracy (they won't) then the only reason not to use JHP would be if there is some law that says you aren't allowed to use them. They are the universal choice of armed professionals. This pistol may be used to save the life of you or someone else- so "overkill" should not be a consideration.
     
  8. Deanimator

    Deanimator Member

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    A .452 JHP may or may not get bigger in diameter in human tissue.

    It won't get SMALLER.
     
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  9. Garandimal

    Garandimal Member

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    Facts and the Truth.



    Or, put yourself at the other end of this range with a handgun and see how you come out.





    GR
     
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  10. Stevie-Ray

    Stevie-Ray Member

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    I shoot nothing but 230 gr Hydra-Shoks in my EDC. I've tried nearly all the others, including HSTs. HSTs, I find to be woefully inconsistent in my gun, and is the only cartridge that has ever caused a malfunction. Hydra-Shoks, OTOH have always shot exactly where I'm aiming, and still have a great reputation for expansion.
     
  11. JudgeHolden10

    JudgeHolden10 Member

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    boom boom and Mike J like this.
  12. Ironicaintit

    Ironicaintit Member

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    He's a smart and well read man, that Mr. Ettin
     
  13. RA40

    RA40 Member

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    +1 to that, very well written post.

    Now if one comes across a T-800 or T-1000 Terminator, a handgun is not going to be very effective. ;)
     
  14. mdauben

    mdauben Member

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    At one time I used to carry Hydra-Shok in both my 9mm (124gr) and my .45 (230gr) guns. Since then, I've seen enough evidence that newer JHP like Gold Dots and HST have improved on the old 9mm Hydra--Shock bullet that I've switched my 9mm carry guns over, but recent testing on the .45 version seem to me to show that in that caliber the old Hydra-Shok is still competitive with the newer JHP rounds.
     
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  15. Vern Humphrey

    Vern Humphrey Member

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    There is no such thing as "overkill." There is, however, such a thing as "underkill." I once made the mistake of stepping over a "dead" man -- and he came back to life and attempted to shoot me in the back.
     
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  16. JR24

    JR24 Member

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    Yikes!
     
  17. Sistema1927

    Sistema1927 Member

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    Vern,

    Glad that you are still kicking. Was he dead, dead after that encounter?
     
  18. Vern Humphrey

    Vern Humphrey Member

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    A man following me put a full magazine into him. After that, he was dead. We sealed off the village and Ruff/Puffs searched it the next day, while he lay next to the command post.
     
  19. John Joseph

    John Joseph Member

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    Not exactly.
    Aside from one treaty specifying humanitarian reasons, the military uses FMJ for reliability. Considering the thousands, even hundreds of thousands of different weapons, magazines and the conditions military ammo needs to function, FMJ performs the one size fits all protocol. LEOs and CCWs aren't so restricted
     
  20. paulsj

    paulsj Member

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    I like HST but settled on Gold Dots because those were on sale when I was buying.
     
  21. 1976B.L.Johns.

    1976B.L.Johns. Member

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    [QUOTE="jmorris, Define “overkill"
    The use of more destructive force than necessary, but I am sure you know that:)

    [QUOTE="Vern Humphrey, There is no such thing as "overkill."
    In a way I have to agree. But would you not rather be sure of "kill" than just hoping for the best? I am sure you would being in your profession! (Kudos, thanks for your service!):)

    Overkill is just another word or phrase like "common sense". Poor use of the English language!

    Getting back to the OP, I have to agree using a jhp, like charlie98 said in post #2.
     
  22. The Evangelist Cowboy

    The Evangelist Cowboy Member

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    In a .45 caliber I dont see much that can go wrong, a HP will work fine, my .45 preference is .45 colt over acp but either way choose a reputable brand and provided it shoots well in the gun carry it. I know a guy that only shoots ball in their weapon cause thats all that functions and they dont want to buy another gun (Ive tried talking to them to no avail).
     
  23. Oldschool shooter

    Oldschool shooter Member

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    I have always carried JHP in my carry gun. That being said, if someone is shooting at me, I don't think I would be hoping they were using FMJ instead of JHP. Either way, if you are on the receiving end, it isn't good.
     
  24. Double Naught Spy

    Double Naught Spy Sus Venator

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    And By God, so has .22 lr.!!!

    The issue isn't whether or not it will kill.
     
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  25. paulsj

    paulsj Member

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    Now we can get them Winchester commemorative 1941-1945 230GR ball loads. The case head is marked m1911 and there is also very nice Chinese-made pine box. How kool is that....KOOL AIIIID!
     
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