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Is the 1911 Still Relevant?

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by 94045, May 2, 2019.

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  1. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator Staff Member

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    People always talk about the "bulk" or "weight" of call it "full sized" etc, but forget or don't know it is also slimmer than most and that goes a long way towards carry comfort and concealment.

    I see in print where someone says the 1911 is too big, then they name a pistol just about as large in length and height, yet is fatter. :)
     
  2. 460Shooter

    460Shooter Member

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    I agree. Many folks also forget or just don’t know that with a good gun belt and holster, weight can easily be overcome and concealment can be fairly easy.

    I conceal carry much smaller guns than even a commander sized 1911, but it’s game on for open carry.
     
  3. JR24

    JR24 Member

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    Yep, despite the general dimensions of a Glock 17, my VBob carries much closer to a Glock 19 for me, so basically it conceals under any tshirt I'd leave the house in.

    My CCO conceals even better.
     
  4. Buzznrose

    Buzznrose Member

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    Perhaps a dumb question, but why is the top round in that magazine backwards?
     
  5. JR24

    JR24 Member

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    I imagine as a nod to the classic HK advertisement with the backwards loaded round
     
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  6. tarosean

    tarosean Member

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    Its kind of an homage to a rather infamous HK ad..
    Everytime I take a pic with a magazine out of a gun I'll do it.

    sketch-1556989019445.png
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2019
  7. Al-jim19

    Al-jim19 Member

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    “Still relevant” is sort of an open ended way to look at this. Lots of people own 1911s in .45 so it’s still relevant in that sense.

    Is it the best objective choice for carry or HD? I would have a hard time saying yes, considering that most 1911s are heavier, larger in footprint, and have maybe half the capacity of comparable 9mm plastic pistols.

    None of the above is meant to say that a 1911 can’t get the job done for whatever your needs are, just that it’s hard to make a case that it is objectively the best choice for most applications.

    The only caveat is if for some reason a person just can’t use or shoot a plastic pistol.
     
  8. tarosean

    tarosean Member

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    agreed... I absolutely hate any gun over 1" slide thickness for IWB carry.
     
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  9. BSA1

    BSA1 member

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    The 1911 and 45 ACP go together like a peanut butter and jelly sandwich. Which is fine until you want a ham sandwich.

    As the saying goes “When the legend becomes fact print the legend.”

    It is large ignored that the Army was looking for a replacement of the 1911 before W.W. 2. Even then the Army was having trouble training and qualifying soldiers with it. The Depression prevented the Army from actively pursuing a replacement program and with the outbreak of war and especially after Pearl Harbor there was overwhelming demand of all types of weapons which meant little resources for R&D. It was good enough for the task at hand.

    Growing up I remember hearing more b.s. about the 1911 and the 45 than about any other weapon. I heard from war vets about how if a person was hit in the finger by a 45 it would knock them off of their feet.

    Then came IPSC and I had to have several of them to play. I sunk a lot of money into them. I never really warmed up to the 1911 but I have spent so much money customizing them I can not bring myself to take the loss by selling them.

    Ammunition improvements and great handgun designs has left the 1911 way behind. While it enjoys good sales I wonder where they are going? They certainly are not in the holster of LEO’s and the vast majority of conceal carry owners. It may be that folks want a piece of history and it spends most of it’s time in the gun safe with occasional trips to the range.

    I edc a Beretta 92 which is also large. It actually weighs less than the 1911 and the increase in firepower can not be ignored. With 18 vs 9 in the gun and 17 vs 8 in a spare magazine the 1911 isn’t even in the running.

    With modern gun designs I am considering rejoining shooting the 45 ACP with a eye towards edc. I am leaning towards getting a plastic frame striker pistol such as the S&W M&P before the 2020 elections. If the Democrats win the Presidential elections and the NRA collapses like so members of THR are hoping for with the help of the RINO’s massive new gun laws will be quickly passed. With 10 round magazine restrictions the 45 becomes worth considering for edc. I will be pulling my 1911’s out of the safe, upgrading their 1980’s parts such the sights and hitting the range.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2019
  10. JR24

    JR24 Member

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    Just had my EDC 9mm 1911 out today again. Wore a 2" hole out at 10 and 12 yards (I'm more like 4" at that range with a bitty polymer), completed a triple nickle 2 out of 3 tries (cant do that with my Glock 26, 17 or 19X sure) and reaffirmed that I shoot the 1911 better than just about anything else, better yet a 9mm 1911 (I also ran a hundred or so .45 through my VBob) and had a ball.

    Not irrelevant to me.
     
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  11. jeepnik

    jeepnik Member

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    I was referring to the question in the first line of your post.
     
  12. paulsj

    paulsj member

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    Come on, the Colt Defender weight is 24oz and the gun is not very large for .45ACP.
     
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  13. FL-NC

    FL-NC Member

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    The exception
     
  14. SCMikeyP

    SCMikeyP Member

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    Well said. Sounds like we found our middle ground.

    I don’t carry a 1911 either. I’m just here for the good conversation.
     
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  15. Old Dog

    Old Dog Member

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    Of course, at this point, everyone with a modicum of critical thinking skills should be asking themselves, "Self, why are so many firearms manufacturers still producing 1911s?" and "Self, why are 1911s still such hot sellers on the firearms market?"

    So, ah, yeah … still relevant. Kind of like a quality cigar or a really good bourbon … if you can't appreciate the difference, you just don't get it and probably never will. Don't worry, though, no one here is judging you; there's plenty of folks out there that waste a lot of time and money shooting a lot of ammo through mediocre firearms who don't get handgun ergonomics and good triggers.
     
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  16. 243winxb

    243winxb Member

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    Every month there seems to be a review of a new AR or 1911 in the American Rifleman Magazine. Boring.

    Only accurate firearms are interesting.

    1911 - 3" groups @ 50 yards.

    AR15/10 - 1" or smaller & 100 yards.

    Forget spray and pray. Imo. :)
     
    Last edited: May 5, 2019
  17. mavracer

    mavracer Member

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    Come on, there's a metric crapload of lightweight 3-4" 1911s.
    I have a STI VIP double stack 4" 26oz 10+1 45acp.
    It has a ~3.5# glass rod trigger and will shoot 1.5" groups at 25 yards. VIP_08_Aluminum_Main_280w.jpg
     
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  18. Derek Zeanah

    Derek Zeanah System Administrator Staff Member

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    We took one of those to Gunsite and it was an absolute gem. Congrats on such a solid choice.
     
  19. tarosean

    tarosean Member

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    Pretty much... It seems most are still stuck on the notion that a 1911 is a 5" all steel 45 ACP that only holds 7rds. When they can be had in polymers and exotic alloys like Titanium, Magnesium, etc. in all sorts of configurations.
     
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  20. JR24

    JR24 Member

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    Right, my Valkyrie CCO fully loaded is only about 4 oz heavier than a loaded Glock 19.

    Sure I give up 6 rounds, but the thinner profile and superior shooting (in my hands) offset that for me. 10 is plenty of 9mm for my basic, low risk, CCW needs.
     
  21. mavracer

    mavracer Member

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    Yes it is, it's been regulated to nightstand duty for the foreseeable future.
     
  22. GEM

    GEM Moderator Staff Member

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    At a Tom Givens' instructor get together, IIRC, it was reported that of 50 higher end instructors, most carried 9mm Glock and then M&Ps. Of the group, only 2 had 1911s. Tom carried a Glock 34 - which was change for him as I heard him present years ago, how the 1911 was the gun of choice, as compared to the polymers. Times and ammo change. His analysis of time in the fight (meaning when is your gun out of the action due to capacity) is what he is thinking now. That being said, 9 shots of 45 ACP and two extra mags, is a viable gun. However, more rounds in a Glock or similar is better for a higher intensity unpleasant situation.

    I've carried my SW 1911Sc Commander with two extra mags. It's not that bad but I like the Glocks better for the added capacity. Both rounds are quite shootable by me. No recoil control problems.
     
  23. JTQ

    JTQ Member

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    It was probably a G35. One of his quotes is... "The 1911 is a one or two bad guy gun, in a three or four bad guy world."

    https://rangemaster.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/2017-01_RFTS-Newsletter.pdf

    My understanding is Tom Givens now is using a G17.
     
  24. JTQ

    JTQ Member

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    Then there is the late Pat Rogers who moved to the M&P http://www.swatvault.com/weapons-training-and-tactics/putting-down-the-man-gun/

    I'm still a 1911 guy, but I do see myself moving away from the 1911 in the not too distant future, not because it isn't relevant, or is heavy, is best when pared with the relatively expensive and heavy recoiling .45 Auto, or low capacity, or has a safety. My primary reason for leaving the 1911 will most likely be because I think the 1911 is a gunsmith gun while the more modern guns are armorer guns.

    When I began shooting the 1911 in the late 1980's, there was somebody at nearly every gun shop, even in small towns, who could skillfully work on 1911's, though even then, those guys were getting a old. Today, most folks working in a gun shop don't know how to work a thumb safety, or realize you probably can't release the slide of a 1911 with an empty mag inserted. Sure, there are some spectacular gunsmiths working 1911's these days, and some are probably the best ever, but many, if not most, have wait times measured in months, if not years.

    On the other hand, even if you have no mechanical skills yourself, you can find just about anybody at the local gun store who can install new sights on a Glock in a few minutes, and nearly every part can be swapped out without using a file or stone, and they just snap into place.
     
  25. czhen

    czhen Member

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    As far is reliable, I would no issues to pick one if it is needed.
    Good mags 7/8 rounders, 230 grains ball ammo and you are good to go.
     
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