Is this time different - is this a tipping point?

[Warp]

It's the smart thing to do?

Is it?

We should know by now that the more hoops you make people jump through to do something, the fewer people there are who will do it. We see it with carry licenses, make it take more time, more effort, more expensive, and fewer do it.

The more training you require of anybody to arm themselves, in this case teachers, the fewer there are who will do it...which lessens the chance of there being one in the right place and time to make a difference in the future.

And there is of course the co$t.

Millions of people are licensed to carry, or legal to carry in Constitutional carry states, without any training requirements or mandates, and they are doing just fine. I don't see why teachers that are allowed to carry would need to have this huge level of training

 

[Walkalong]

Is it?

Yes, training is good. I agree they don't need 10 months of boot camp, but a reasonable amount of training is essential IMO. The argument/debate of how/how much would be another topic.

Millions of people are licensed to carry, or legal to carry in Constitutional carry states, without any training requirements or mandates, and they are doing just fine.

Yes, they are, but that is different than arming teachers in a school and then expecting them to stop a crazy killer. I expect they would want some training. Not everyone, not even every gun owner, shoots and trains as much as some of us here.

 

[Deanimator]

I closely follow European news sources. The idea of arming schoolteachers has made America into a laughingstock internationally.

This is not helping our international credibility.

I couldn't care less what those capons think.

 

[Warp]

Yes, training is good. I agree they don't need 10 months of boot camp, but a reasonable amount of training is essential IMO. The argument/debate of how/how much would be another topic.

Training is good.

Mandated training, not as simple of an answer.

Yes, they are, but that is different than arming teachers in a school and then expecting them to stop a crazy killer. I expect they would want some training. Not everyone, not even every gun owner, shoots and trains as much as some of us here.

Are we 'arming' them, or are we getting rid of the laws that DISarm them and leaving it on them? Or are we doing both? I want to start with simply getting rid of the asinine "gun free" school zone laws. Actively arming teachers, giving them guns, telling them they have a responsibility, separate thing.

I expect that if they wanted training and it wasn't provided by big daddy fed money, enough local govs and private entities would step up and offer stuff for free that they'd be covered.

 

[flphotog]

Tipping point? That was Sandyhook, One could draw the conclusion that is why Remington in filing for Bankruptcy.

Tipping point for the FBI ? It seems when the mass shooting is investigated and the shooter was known to them proir to one could question their judgment and or motives.

That would be a wrong conclusion, Remington is filing for bankruptcy for a number of reasons including a lack of quality, being owned by an anti-gun group, poor product planning and a whole lot of other reasons Sandyhook had little if anything to do with it..

 

[Aim1]

Today is National School Walkout to prevent gun violence and students all over the nation are walking out of class. I think some teacher caught flack for even making it mandatory.


This time could be different.

National School Walkout: Students protest gun violence, call for action one month after Parkland shooting

By Christopher Carbone | Fox News

Thousands of students walked out of classrooms nationwide Wednesday to protest gun violence and call for new gun control measures on the one month anniversary of the Parkland school shooting that left 17 dead and sparked a grassroots wave of activism.

 

[Kaybee]

7000 shoes left in front of the white house in protest blaming dead kids for lack of gun laws.

This time it's different. I don't know what we can do? The social media and television machines are cranking up on full blast. This whole thing has me very nervous.

 

[barnbwt]

Well, we can start by telling everyone who will listen that we won't accept new laws and restrictions.

But since we haven't been doing that, stunned by a coordinated national advertising campaign, we are accepting new laws and restrictions.

Maybe after the inevitable next time, the idiot squishes will realize that giving up a few policy areas only emboldens political enemies.

 

[SilentStalker]

It appears that this time is different. If we don’t do something fast I fear we will wind up like Australia with a quickness. I even suggested we try to get some pro 2A kids to start screaming as loud as possible and it seems most think that’s a bad idea even though I think that’s what it’s going to take to turn the hearts and minds. Other than that I don’t think we can do anything. Everyone is too against each other and always decides that nothing is the best course of action other than donating to your pro gun org if choice. But, I don’t think that’s going to do a damn thing this time. They are organized and their efforts are paying off. They have learned from previous demonstrations. So, your fears may be valid. As far as all the chest thumping and people screaming that they won’t come take them blah blah, we all know at the end of the day that’s just a bunch of crap. There isn’t going to be any resistance or any of that craziness.

On the other hand, the media that is driving all of this also said Hilary had a 98% chance of winning. So, who knows?

 

[GEM]

Well, we can start by telling everyone who will listen that we won't accept new laws and restrictions.

Telling people that you won't obey the law? Is that a plan to get support for your position? Posturing on the Internet is useless. It's not like you have major support as when there were demonstrations against the Jim Crow laws.

So let's not go there. Perhaps, a decent legislative strategy from the major gun organizations as compared to ranting might help.

 

[748]

In two weeks you won't hear about it again.

This one took about 3 weeks.
Luckily they have a short attention span.

 

[plinky]

No single event is a tipping point but every attempt by the left to stampede us into giving up crucial freedom in exchange for safety that they can't deliver IS an intelligence test.

The tipping point is when we as a country can no longer pass the test.

 

[CLP]

7000 shoes left in front of the white house in protest blaming dead kids for lack of gun laws.

This time it's different. I don't know what we can do? View attachment 781691

Not the White House...

 

[readyeddy]

The media tries to make it look like the tipping point. The school walkout is as useless as it looks, and is obviously a MSM and a social media event.

The reality is that many Americans don't buy into the anti 2A movement. Even the Democrats realize this. That's why the Democratic party hand picked Conor Lamb (veteran, former prosecutor and pro gun) to run in the special election.

 

[GEM]

How do you know that we won't have a tipping point? Wasn't there one that brought about the original AWB? Oops - those that forget history, blah, blah.

A new horror. A flip in the Congress, a different president or even this one - tip over.

 

[Walkalong]

7000 shoes left in front of the white house in protest blaming dead kids for lack of gun laws.

It is ridiculous to blame black kids being killed by other black kids on guns, but that is how they antis work, always blame the gun.

 

[readyeddy]

Of course there can be a tipping point, but IMO this isn't it.

Maintaining our vigilance and standing our ground and being concerned is all very good, but declaring the tipping point of the end of our gun rights or predicting our eventual demise does us no good.

In fact, when gun owners start talking about "this time it's different", all they are doing is confirming the anti's that yes, this time it's different.

Perception in politics is important, and a part of that is acting like we are right and that we are "cautiously optimistic" based on our correct position. We don't want to appear arrogant, but we shouldn't appear to be doubtful of our future, especially where, so far, all we have seen are the usual suspects and a school walkout of high school students.

 

[CapnMac]

the incident that happened when mass media had finally reached the Tipping Point.

This is an important point.

Our opposition had been preparing for just this sort of thing. Doing lots of legwork, phone bank time; getting media (and personalities) ready; focus group testing slogans and the like. Professional organisers set this up, and had it on the shelf ready to go.

Contirbutions by big stars barely hours after the fact, to already-in-place accounts; slogans, planned events; bus trips to DC--all this materialized out of nowhere--not.

Our side has an organization problem. Not because we are not competent, but becasue, we work for a living. We care for families and provide for their needs. We do not have event planners on staff just waiting to spring to actiion. We do not have legions of idle unemployed to legwork tedious organizational stuff about. We have lives, we like being outdoors, at the range--not on a phone bank bothering people who have better things

 

[CapnMac]

Saw a bon mot the other day (which I cannot properly attribute)--only in the first of the first world would we have children marching to have their rights restricted and reduced.

 

[Deanimator]

It is ridiculous to blame black kids being killed by other black kids on guns, but that is how they antis work, always blame the gun.

Frankly, personal experience tells me that's because they view us (Black people) as at best children, at worst subhuman.

They HAVE to blame the gun, because viewing us as incompetent to make our own decisions as adult humans, they CAN'T blame us.

 

[danez71]

....children marching to have their rights restricted and reduced.

A somber site it is....

 

[HOWARD J]

Best pro gun comment I have seen so far:the kid shooting his mouth off for CNN is that Hogg kid. His mother said" you better leave my son alone---he is going to get rid of the guns & his father carries a gun & is protecting him.

 

[mokin]

The power the mass media wields and commands on young impressionable minds has reached a tipping point. Organizations like Google, Facebook, YouTube, Wikipedia etc are all extremely left-wing and are beginning to censor everything. We are rapidly heading into a situation where mass media is going to be no more reliable than state-sponsored media because smaller media Outlets are going to be silenced by the big players. If Google, Safari, or Internet Explorer want only one half of the story told, that's the way it's going to be.

Agreed. This isn't so much a tipping point but it should be a serious wake up call to us that the playing field has been drastically altered - not in our favor.

 

[CapnMac]

Speaking of tipping points, this is germane to the discussion (but not really to THR): https://medium.com/s/story/the-tech-industrys-psychological-war-on-kids-c452870464ce

Article notes how tech, gaming, and social media are using psychology to design products which absorb the attention of the users. And that children and young adults are especially susceptible to such manipulations. Which may or may not lead to disassociation for life, school, reality et al. Which might or might not explain why such chilluns would up and shoot up their schools. Your mileage may vary.

A long article, and a bit of a tedious read, but informative.

 

[CLP]

Not yet. Just wait until a Manson-like cult of a dozen people attack a school. And it will happen; the only question is when.

A crowd of riotous high-schoolers destroying their local Wal-Mart and assaulting patrons during a school "walk out" is a much likelier scenario...