ISP trooper pleads guilty

[Deanimator]

BTW, I do not claim to know how to deal effectively with that particular problem. It seems clear to me that while it is not as pervasive a problem as some seem to think, it is a far greater problem than others want to admit.

The way to fight it is to not let these sorts of things slide by unnoticed.

When I was in college, there was a fratboy who was pretty much of a lowlife. He ran for student government. Some friends and I sent letters to the editor of the school newspaper. They wouldn't print them. So instead, we printed them and posted them all over campus. He lost the election. He ran again. He lost again. He ran a third time, and lost by a landslide.

You can often derail shady deals. Even when you can't, you can take the fun out of them for the participants. These troopers may skate. We still have the power to embarass the people trying to help them do so. You can even do that in Chicago... if you have the guts.

 

[cordex]

Okay, DMF is right.

If you or I were in a similar situation and we chose to plead guilty, chances are we wouldn't do the 10 years, and chances are neither will the officers in this case. Sifting through US Federal Appeals Court decisions is enlightening.

Whether or not high ranking politicians and police officers would try to influence a trial for you or I is another matter altogether. Additionally, how that influence will play out in setencing will be revealing.

 

[Deanimator]

Okay, DMF is right.

If you or I were in a similar situation and we chose to plead guilty, chances are we wouldn't do the 10 years, and chances are neither will the officers in this case. Sifting through US Federal Appeals Court decisions is enlightening.

IS he? Says who? Let's see the data. If you're not an LEO, I'll bet you'd do more time than these individuals will unless decency and common sense prevail.

Not ten years? Ok, how MANY years would a civilian get? Not NO time.

I'm simply astonished at the support some people display for an ADMITTED criminal.

 

[DMF]

Says the published Federal Sentencing Guidelines. I don't make this stuff up, it's based on actually knowing how the criminal justice system is set up and operates.

For giggles I looked this up to today. Now keep in mind we only know part of the facts involved in determining where he falls in the sentencing guidelines, so there could be some significant departures. Also, I don't regularly calculate these things, that's something the courts do, and I have never even looked at it for this crime before, so my calculations could be off a little.

That being said:

1st, it's a crime involving a firearm as defined in 26USC5845, which makes it base level 18 points.

2nd, a guilty plea and acceptance of responsibility could get him a 2 or 3 point downward departure. However, it's likely on the advice of counsel he did everything necessary to get the 3 point departure. Putting him at 15 points.

3rd, if he has no criminal record he is 0 point, or Level I offender for sentencing.

All of that puts him at 15 points, and at the very bottom of sentencing in Zone D. Zone D is the highest sentencing category. A 15 point, Level I offender in Zone D must serve a minimum of 18 months according to the sentencing guidelines.

However, there may be facts unknown based on the news reporting that could be mitigating factors allowing for a further downward departure. If he gets a couple more points shaved off he could get into Zone C and only be looking at a minimum of 8 months. If he could get a total of 5 more points, he'd be in Zone B, and could possibly do zero time in prison.

Jail time or not, someone in this situation will serve a period of probation/supervised release.

Assuming he stays at offense level 15 he would also be looking at a fine anywhere from $4000 to $40000, and will have to pay a special assessment of $100 for the felony conviction.

Also, there are some things which could create an upward departure, but there is nothing in the story which indicates he would face any upward departure. Further, based on a recent Supreme Court ruling judges are no longer strictly bound by the sentencing guidelines, but it is rare that they don't follow them.

All of the above is the same whether the person was a cop or not.

 

[ilbob]

I think he will rat and do no time.

BTW, I am not all that sure that ratting on other criminals is such a bad thing. It is not the ideal way to run a criminal justice system, but it is cost effective.

And it is not that unusual for well known people including politicians and government officials to write letters supporting lenient sentencing for an offender. What is unusual is that so many high ranking LEOs would support an admitted felon. But given his position, these are people he knows who are willing to help him out. If I had a friend in the same boat, I would be willing to write such a letter.

In most cases, i suspect the letter is largely composed by the defense attorney anyway.

 

[KenpoProfessor]

I'd say

Get this case in a Federal District Court, let them off with a slap on the wrist and no FELONY conviction, then use this as a precedence for future cases involving the same. This way, everyone benefits from the ruling of a Federal District court for the rest of the states.

BTW, I think cops should be held to a higher standard of moral character, just as I think Vets should be. We swore an oath to defend the COTUS, and I'll die doing that to this day, even living in the no 2nd Amend State of California.

Have a great Kenpo day

Clyde

 

[ilbob]

I think cops should be held to a higher standard of moral character, just as I think Vets should be

I think a good argument can be had for holding LE to a higher standard, but it is hard for me to come up with a rationale for holding former military personnel to the same standard.

To me, once you are back to being a civillian, you go back to being a civillian.

 

[KenpoProfessor]

Interesting

Did we not swear an oath to defend the COTUS? I didn't realize there was a time limit imposed on it once you were out, kinda like wedding vows LOL.

Have a great Kenpo day

Clyde

 

[JERRY]

so, if Joe Shmuckatelli the plumber of Smallville Ill. had these guns, no criminal record, gave to the red cross, fed the homeless, ran meals on wheels for shut ins, was a boyscout troop leader for 20 years for his 8 sons and 16 grandsons, was a deacon in the local church, was a volunteer firefighter, had been to the many firearms training centers in this country that teach police and private citizens alike...........would the Il. S.P. be paticianing for him to be given leanency?

 

[Ryder]

Live by the s(word) die by the s(word). I wonder why anyone would embrace the law so intimately. I equate that to playing with fire. You're bound to get burned eventually.

 

[wdlsguy]

The federal government will not issue the stamps or even look at your NFA paperwork if you're from Illinois.

I got the skinny on this from a couple of NFA dealers on another forum. It is possible for an Illinois resident (for example) to legally own a machinegun, but it involves jumping through a few extra hoops, it has to be stored and used in an NFA-friendly state, it can't be brought into Illinois.

These guys were only a few miles from Missouri, which allows machinegun ownership with a C&R license, so that could have worked for them.

 

[cassandrasdaddy]

how many pleaded guilty

did the last 2 plead guilty? that should be fun to watch they all pleaded not guilty initially

 

[DMF]

Get this case in a Federal District Court . . .

Please go back to the first post in this thread, and read the posted news story:

. . . an attorney representing the trooper declined to comment on the plea, made in the federal district court in East St. Louis.

If that wasn't enough to clue you in, the mention of ATF, and federal prosecutors should have made it clear this was a federal case.

Here is the press release from the US Attorney's Office in the Southern District of Illinois if you want it directly from a government source: http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/ils/press/2006/Jul/07252006_Mugge plea pr.pdf

 

[Don Gwinn]

It is possible for an Illinois resident (for example) to legally own a machinegun, but it involves jumping through a few extra hoops, it has to be stored and used in an NFA-friendly state, it can't be brought into Illinois.

Sure, fine, I'll stipulate that. It's irrelevant to the facts of this case, and it doesn't change my frustration. You and I both know that the reporters who wrote this report did NOT intend to tell people that these cops broke the law by not storing their machine guns in Missouri or Kentucky. They meant to tell people that Illinois citizens can do what these guys did and do it legally if they do the right paperwork.
That is not true.

I appreciate you keeping things honest, though.

 

[cordex]

so, if Joe Shmuckatelli the plumber of Smallville Ill. had these guns, no criminal record, gave to the red cross, fed the homeless, ran meals on wheels for shut ins, was a boyscout troop leader for 20 years for his 8 sons and 16 grandsons, was a deacon in the local church, was a volunteer firefighter, had been to the many firearms training centers in this country that teach police and private citizens alike...........would the Il. S.P. be paticianing for him to be given leanency?

Of course not. ISP and state politicians would just as soon hang him out to dry, but DMF's point was that Joe Shmuckatelli would not do 10 years like myself and others were ignorantly claiming. In fact, in reading Federal Appeals Court decisions, even felons in possession of machine guns rarely get the full 10 years.

I'm willing to wait and see.