kahr cm9/pm9

[thefamcnaj]

I have sent 500 rounds with out a single problem. Its a great little shooter.
I understand its quiet a bit cheaper than the pm9. I know the extra machining and better barrel go into the pm9.
Is there any difference in the frame? Mainly is there any more steel on the frame rails of the pm9 as opposed to the cm9? I've notice on my cm9 that the left frame rail is starting to round off quiet a bit. Its almost like the slide is just rolling the corner of the rail into a little ball. Is this normal wear for a kahr frame?

 

[Fishbed77]

Is there any difference in the frame? Mainly is there any more steel on the frame rails of the pm9 as opposed to the cm9?

There is no difference in the frames between the PM9 and CM9 as far as I can tell.

I've notice on my cm9 that the left frame rail is starting to round off quiet a bit. Its almost like the slide is just rolling the corner of the rail into a little ball. Is this normal wear for a kahr frame?

The CM9 slide rides on steel inserts in the dust cover up front and near the back of the frame above the grip. The polymer "rail" your speak of (that extends out on front of the rear steel inserts) merely extends up to prevent debris from entering the pistol. It is common for these polymer projections to wear a bit from movement of the slide. Since they are not critical structurally, this wear should have no effect on function of the pistol.

 

[thefamcnaj]

Thank you, for that detailed answer. Makes since and eases my mind on the "wear". I didn't fully understand the operation of the pistol. Thanks again.

 

[wally]

Mine was great until the front frame rail broke
Kahr customer support is not being helpful and they are not answering my Emails.

There is no difference in the frames between the PM9 and CM9 as far as I can tell.

Not true the "C" guns have a "notch" in the polymer frame on the right side in front of the takedown lever hole. There is a protrusion on the "C" barrels that enter this notch. A "C" barrel will not fit a "P" frame because of this.

If you look at my photo of the broken front frame rail, you can see the notch in that the polymer is wider on the left side (top of photo) at the rear of the front frame rail.

 

[thefamcnaj]

I'm hoping its normal wear. I haven't had to use Kahr's customer service, and from what I have been hearing I don't want to.
I don't think its in the best interest for this cm9 to get up into the thousands as far as round count
I'm no expert on polymer or anything, but the frame looks "weak" compared to other polymer framed guns I have.
It just doesn't look built to withstand the type of round counts that: m&p's, xd's or glocks can get up to.

 

[chris in va]

I wouldn't call the P-series barrel 'better'. It's polygonal, but you can't shoot lead through it. It's really the only thing I don't like about my K9.

 

[JimC]

Not true the "C" guns have a "notch" in the polymer frame on the right side in front of the takedown lever hole. There is a protrusion on the "C" barrels that enter this notch. A "C" barrel will not fit a "P" frame because of this.

I believe this to be correct.
I attempted to buy a 9mm CM barrel from Kahr for my 9mm PM9. I was told that I could not.
All I wanted to do was to compare the velocities from the PM and CM barrels with specific ammo.
When I contacted Kahr CS and asked why...I wasn't given a specific reason why but was told that the CM9 barrel would not fit/function in my PM9.
And of course, the "experts" on Kahr Talk disputed this response from Kahr CS to the point of arguing that they would interchange.

Here is the email that I sent...

Good afternoon;

I would like to know if the CM9 barrel, # 002CM9, can be "dropped" into a
PM9 slide w/o any modifications and have the PM9 function properly?

Thanks,


Best Regards,

Answer from Jay...

Good morning. Thank you for the question. Unfortunately they are not
interchangeable.
sincerely,
Jay
Kahr Customer Service

 

[340PD]

thefamcnaj: It sounds like you are having fun with your new gun. You nailed the differences between the PM/Cm series. The different sights should be added to that list. The polymer wear is normal and will smooth out along with the entire action of your pistol. If Kahr CM's have a fault, it usually will show up with broken magazine followers. They are replaced free, but if it repeats, the gun may need to have a small amount of metal removed from the feed ramp. I do not know if this occurs with the PM9's as this gun uses a different barrel. I own the PM/9 and it refuses to give me any trouble with any of my reloads or bullet shapes. If Kahr says the CM?PM barrels are not interchangeable, I would not change the barrels.

I would not lose sleep over frame rails breaking or undue frame wear. Enjoy your new gun.

 

[railroader]

thefamcnaj: It sounds like you are having fun with your new gun. You nailed the differences between the PM/Cm series. The different sights should be added to that list. The polymer wear is normal and will smooth out along with the entire action of your pistol. If Kahr CM's have a fault, it usually will show up with broken magazine followers. They are replaced free, but if it repeats, the gun may need to have a small amount of metal removed from the feed ramp. I do not know if this occurs with the PM9's as this gun uses a different barrel. I own the PM/9 and it refuses to give me any trouble with any of my reloads or bullet shapes. If Kahr says the CM?PM barrels are not interchangeable, I would not change the barrels.

I would not lose sleep over frame rails breaking or undue frame wear. Enjoy your new gun.

You are right about broken followers. I had my CM9 twice to the range and broke a follower each time. It's back at Kahr being fixed right now. Great little gun though.

 

[C0untZer0]

CM9 with a PM9 barrel

Here is a Kahr owner shooting his CM9 with a PM9 replacement barrel:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHBdi8tzGvg

 

[wally]

Answer from Jay...

Back when "Jay" was there they at least offered some customer support

Here is a Kahr owner shooting his CM9 with a PM9 replacement barrel:

As I said, the "P" barrels lack the protrusion and will fit in the "C" frames, I doubt if the missing plastic from the "notch" in the "C" frame will really matter.

I would not lose sleep over frame rails breaking

Sorry, I most definitely do. That's kind of like saying I wouldn't worry about a gun that jams.

The frame is the "firearm" anything else I can fix myself if I can find the replacement part.


I've switched to S&W Shield, as I invest too much in practice time and ammo to carry a gun that the manufacturer won't stand behind! Already I shoot it faster and more accurately that my Kahr despite having practiced with various Kahr pistols since about 2005.

 

[gym]

Mine is not perfectly straight, the front of the frame, but it never has changed, and continues to shoot without a hiccup. There seems to be an allowable flex in the frame. When looking from the bottom, there is a slight curve, a few hundredths, on the rt side.
The inside looks straight.

 

[CMC]

From Kahr website:
Differences between the CM models and PM models are the CM9093 has a conventional rifled barrel instead of the match grade polygonal barrel on Kahr's PM series; the CM slide stop lever is MIM (metal-injection-molded) instead of machined; the CM series slide has fewer machining operations and uses simple roll marking instead of engraved markings and finally the CM series are shipped with one magazine instead of two magazines

 

[Jim Watson]

I have a CW9 which has given me no trouble.
The differences listed between C and P guns are mostly cosmetic and trivial to me with only two exceptions.
The lack of a spare magazine with the C is a hidden cost that goes a good way toward closing the price gap.
The plastic C front sight limits your choice in sights and is less durable than the P dovetail.
My CW9 sights are adequate, but my old E9 which looks really crude, kicked its plastic front sight off about the second trip to the range. Kahr replaced it but it should have been stuck on better to start with.

I am really confused about the "match grade polygonal barrel" business.
Even assuming it IS more accurate than the standard rifled economy model barrel, what does it matter and how can you tell it on a pocket pistol? The only match I have ever shot mine in was IDPA BUG and that is not exactly a long range precision shooting challenge.
I would not have thought it was worth their while to stock two entirely different barrels. Maybe some customers are gullible enough to buy the high priced spread on that claim.

 

[340PD]

Wally: I am sorry you had problems with your Kahr and I am sure it has happened to someone else in the history of Kahr manufacturing handguns. My point is, it is not a complaint I have ever seen in all the years of owning Kahr pistols, except for that same picture you post every time someone starts a thread about how happy they are with their new Kahr handgun.

How about moving on and let this guy enjoy shooting his new purchase?

 

[C0untZer0]

If Kahr would fix Wally's pistol I'm sure he would post a picture of that too...

But they haven't,

So he hasn't.

 

[Walt Sherrill]

RE: emailing Kahr and getting not response...

Emailing ANY gunmaker tends to get unpredictable results. Phone calls seem to be the best way of contacting most of them.

 

[JimC]

RE: emailing Kahr and getting not response...

Emailing ANY gun maker tends to get unpredictable results. Phone calls seem to be the best way of contacting most of them.

I found this to be just the opposite when I bought my PM9 three years ago.
Kahr CS was then, very responsive to emails, especially Jay when he was in CS. He would normally respond in less than 24 hrs.

Three levels of being a Kahr pistol owner...

1 - Very happy with your pistol
2 - Very unhappy with your pistol
3 - In denial about your pistol and Kahr in general

 

[Jlr2267]

I found this to be just the opposite when I bought my PM9 three years ago.
Kahr CS was then, very responsive to emails, especially Jay when he was in CS. He would normally respond in less than 24 hrs.

Three levels of being a Kahr pistol owner...

1 - Very happy with your pistol
2 - Very unhappy with your pistol
3 - In denial about your pistol and Kahr in general

For a great example of #3, visit Kahrtalk.

 

[JimC]

For a great example of #3, visit KahrTalk

I can't...I was banned forever for being a "brand basher" there.

But your correct, those fan boys really like the Kahr Kool-Aid.

"You don't have a problem with your Kahr, it's just you...just rack the slide 500 or more times and shoot it like you stole it!!!"

 

[bannockburn]

I had a CW40 about 7 1/2 years ago where pieces of the frame were coming off in the area around where the slide release was located.

My PM9 has been totally fine; no problems to report.

 

[Jlr2267]

Wally: I am sorry you had problems with your Kahr and I am sure it has happened to someone else in the history of Kahr manufacturing handguns. My point is, it is not a complaint I have ever seen in all the years of owning Kahr pistols, except for that same picture you post every time someone starts a thread about how happy they are with their new Kahr handgun.

How about moving on and let this guy enjoy shooting his new purchase?

I think his complaint is more about how Kahr has handled the customer service, than with the gun. All guns can break or have quality issues, that is understandable. Treating your customers badly when they have a problem is not understandable or, in my opinion, acceptable. Yes, I recently experienced Kahr C/S so I am biased. All I can say is that if you get a good Kahr pistol, they are sweet. If you get a bad one, it can be a nightmare getting the problem resolved.

 

[gym]

I have to agree with the , "let's move on" like a few of you have mentioned. I know I am carrying my PM9 today as every other day, it has yet to have any kind of firing problem with a dozen different types of ammo, and I don't think it will. If it does, I will post it. But every gun has problems, from a few years ago when every other post was about KaBooms from the 40 Glock, to the lousy triggers in the M&P, or the Kel-Tec , FTE's FTF's , the unreliable 1911's, they are really just machines. Theoretically the more expensive they are the better they should work, but that seems to be marginal also.
My philosophy has always been buy it, shoot it, and either keep it or sell it if it sucks.

 

[fxstchewy]

"You don't have a problem with your Kahr, it's just you...just rack the slide 500 or more times and shoot it like you stole it!!!"

That's Funny!

 

[gym]

Just looked over at Kahrtalk forum, They seem extremely happy with their guns. It's nice to see such joy, everyone seems pleased with their purchase, very unusual for any brand. Many have between 6-12 Kahr firearms. Very interesting