Kel Tec P32 or P380?

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In the 380 gelatin tests done by the stoppingpower.net group, the 380 rounds that did not expand went completely through 16" gelatin blocks!

Precisely why I do not use anything but ball in the 32 and why if a 380HP opens at all, it will not be as deep as the 32.

Brownie
 
Precisely why I do not use anything but ball in the 32 and why if a 380HP opens at all, it will not be as deep as the 32.
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brownie, do you mean the 380will not penetrate as deeply as a 32 expanded HP or as deep as a 32 fmj?
 
Sorry if I was unclear with that last post sir.

A 32 ball will penetrate deeper than a 380hp that expands.

Most ball will go deeper/further than HP's that expand

Where you from in Az Kokapelli? I'm east of Phoenix

Brownie
 
Where you from in Az Kokapelli? I'm east of Phoenix

Brownie
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I'm at the extreme southeast corner of Maricopa county and on the border of the Gila River Indian reservation.
 
32acp

I agree with the information on gold...... wed site, 32 acp great little rnd. I just bought 4 extended 10 rnd mags for my P32 great fun at the range.
 
I look upon .32 as I do .25, usable on mice. I really don't like to carry the .380, but if I need maximum concealment, it's my bottom level cartridge. I shoot a 90 grain Hornady XTP JHP out of mine at about 200 ft lbs, pretty accurate and 100 percent reliable. I want expansion and the XTP will penetrate enough. It's gonna take more'n one round at this level, I'm afraid, no matter what. I haven't got a P3AT YET, though. I am thinking I will pick one up. You can hide that thing no matter what you decide to wear. I doubt I'd carry it much, prefer my .38 snub or my 9mm Kel Tec P11, but there are times when those guns just won't do, just a tad too big. A P3AT would be a good back up, too. I just have absolutely no confidence in the .32 cartridge, a little more with the .380. There is a place in the wardrobe for this size of pocket gun, though, even if the calibers are marginal. The P3AT is just as concealable as the little .32, so why would I go for the weaker cartridge? There isn't a point. The P3AT from what I've read is a good, reliable, almost accurate gun. I don't think there's a big difference in reliability and I'd give the edge to the rimless .380 ACP at any rate, no possibility of "rim lock".
 
I just ordered a KT 32. For those few times that I can't carry a bigger gun. But those really are far a few between. I was just at a family gathering today. Packing my 1911 Officer's model. T-shirt and jeans. I guess if I had the .32 I might have carried that instead. Left the .45 in the car. I'm sure if I would have gotten "made" it would not have gone over very well.

I had the KT .380, a few problems when I got it. I traded it for a .38 snub. That turned out to be not very reliable. Sold the .38 at a gun show after the 2nd trip back from the factory. I spent sometime lurking on ktog.org, before I made this purchase. It seems like the .32 has less problems then the .380.

One downside of the .32 seems to be the cost of the ammo. I guess I'll be reloading .32s soon. :)
 
DPX 380 meets FBI 12" test?

Also, check this article out:

http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/Bersa Thunder.htm

In which the author states:

"the good folks at Corbon were listening and have completed work on their .380 DPX. This standard pressure load uses a solid copper alloy bullet with a large hollow cavity. It has been tweaked by Corbon to provide both expansion and still meet the FBI's 12" minimum."
 
Also, check this article out:

http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/Bersa Thunder.htm
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Mr. Camp is extrapolating his wet pack results to gelatin.

Here are actual calibrated gelatin test results of the DPX 380 round fired from a P-3AT.

Test were done by the good people at stoppingpower.net.

The gelatin has 4 layers of denim barrier.

Expansion is great, but penetration is poor!

Penetration: 6.75
Recovered Weight: 80.8 gr.
Expansion*: .732 cal.
Velocity: 958.6 fps
 
If you have to resort to ball ammo, I'd just move up to the 9mm in a compact gun. The PF9 is out now, ya know.

I will NEVER carry ball for self defense. I'm a hunter and have actual experience in watching critters run off when bullets don't expand. Funny thing is how such a tiny hollowpoint as a .22LR has can make all the difference anchoring a rabbit.

Like I say, .380 is marginal and I don't like to resort to carrying it, but sometimes you just have to. .32? Nah, I have .22s for that job and the ammo's a lot cheaper and no .32 can match the concealability of my NAA mini revolver. .32 is a lot closer in actual ballistics to the .22 LR than it is to the .380, sorry, just fact. If a .32 is putting up 120 ft lbs, it's likely out of a 4" pressure barrel, maybe even 6". Out of a P32 I doubt ANY .32 could break a hundred ft lbs. A good .22 out of a 1" mini will put up 75 ft lbs. My .380 puts up just below 200 ft lbs. It has almost 3" of barrel and packs 12 rounds (11+1) At least I have another round if the first 11 don't work. :D

If I was paranoid I wouldn't get enough penetration, I do have a handload that involves a 105 grain SWC, a Lee .358 mold that I size to .357 and load in .380 acp. I can push this bullet to about 200 ft lbs. and it's very reliable. It has a long nose that feeds well even in my Grendel and the flat SWC profile would be WAY, WAY better than any round nose ball for doing tissue damage on the way through the target. 105 grains doesn't hurt penetration, either. I could whip a few of these up if someone wanted to test them in jello, but I'm not a jello guy. I load this bullet down a bit for practice. This bullet is VERY accurate in everything I've tried it, from .38 revolvers to 9mm to .380, my little secret. :D
 
PF9 is on my shopping list. :)
Waiting for it to actually show up in the shops.

Reloading for practice. I'll get a factory load for carry, maybe +P. I guess there .32 +P out there.
Well if it is as good as a .22 at least it is a center fire .22 :)
And weighs less the most .22 auto loaders I have seen.
Like said this will be the only carry gun about twice a year if that.


/ sarcasm on
And we all know that more people have and been killed with a .22 then any other round ;)
sarcasm off/
 
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32? Nah, I have .22s for that job and the ammo's a lot cheaper and no .32 can match the conceal ability of my NAA mini revolver.
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Right and the NAA mini revolver only holds 5 rounds, needs to be cocked for every round and takes about 30 seconds to reload, if your good!

I had a NAA mini revolver and couldn't hit the side of a barn with it, even when I was inside the barn.

.32 is a lot closer in actual ballistics to the .22 LR than it is to the .380, sorry, just fact. If a .32 is putting up 120 ft lbs, it's likely out of a 4" pressure barrel, maybe even 6". Out of a P32 I doubt ANY .32 could break a hundred ft lbs. A good .22 out of a 1" mini will put up 75 ft lbs.
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You are just kidding! Right?

If your not, I would like to refer you to the website below for a true comparison of 32acp vs 22 cal.


http://www.goldenloki.com/ammo/gel/32acp/gel32acp.htm

http://www.goldenloki.com/ammo/gel/22lr/gel22lr.htm
 
32acp

This week end I bought the new stile winchester 32acp 60 gr. it performed better than the old stile it even expanded shadering bone material. I have these test on film, its great the results, Mabe the new 380 acp also performs beter than the old stile, I call the old stile like the one goldylock used in his test, I had these for quite a while, The ones I call new that have been out there for a while also look like the old XTP but in silver. All of these expanded or desintigrated into several separet pieces. they all reach betwin 6"-7" still not deep but they shadered bone material in stead of bouncing off. This is why I will try the 380 new silver tips. I will inform the results.......:cuss: :banghead: :confused: :what:
 
Got a P-3AT about 9 months ago. It FTE'd & FTF'd on every magazine, and never ejected the bottom round. Also damn near broke my wrist.

Had my FFL send it back to KT. A month later --- Presto! New slide. Now I understand the "busted wrist" syndrome --- the slide wasn't coming out of battery properly, which explains all the other nonsense.

Took it from the FFL directly to the range and dumped 100 rounds through it, with no problems. Wasn't even like the same gun.

Since then, it has performed "better" (i.e., fewer jams) than my Defender. Go figure.

So --- two weeks after buying the P-3AT, I asked the dealer if he'd take it back. (Well, he knew I was kidding ...) Now, it pretty much stays in my pocket at home. I figure it just might give me time to get to something more "meaningful."

I feed it Federals and Silvertips. I'm inclined toward the Federals.

BTW --- this is Long Island, locked in the Stone Age where only the BG's are supposed to carry. So even my "Carry" permit isn't quite what it should be. Realistically, this makes a difference in what one tends to "wear." In a different locale, a slightly odd lump would make less fuss.

P-3AT's are invisible. Feed them properly, get a death-grip them, aim high (seems they all shoot low), and keep them clean.
 
51Cards said:
BTW --- this is Long Island, locked in the Stone Age where only the BG's are supposed to carry. So even my "Carry" permit isn't quite what it should be. Realistically, this makes a difference in what one tends to "wear." In a different locale, a slightly odd lump would make less fuss.
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Been there, done that - sad state of affairs when you are more afraid of the law then violent criminals. :banghead:

Glad to hear KT was able to get your pistol to perform properly. :cool:

It isn't a "death grip" you need, but a locked wrist and a firm grip IMO.
 
32acp VS 380 acp

I have done the same test with Cor bon's new ammo 32 acp, 60 gr 1,050 fps and 380 acp cor bon 1050 fps. shooting through Pork shoulder, jeans, bottles, books and others, Penetration on bouth were the same, 10"- 12" same disruption of tishue and bone matter, same results, they all expanded or fragmented:what:I have changed my mind :banghead: so my opinion has change, By the way when I purchased the COR BON it wasn't + P ammo, I called them and the techy adviced me they were using a new blend of powder that they reserch, kept the presure normal while giving more velocity, Means less damage to youre pistol. I think is great job by Cor Bon, So on these 2 rds 32acp & 380 acp Cor Bon hollow point then FMJ I am now carrying COR BONs uding Kel tec P3at, P32.:D
 
boy, am I late to this party.

The P32 has slide lock back on empty, and I heard they were a bit more reliable than the P380. Any more info on this?
At close quarters last ditch defense gun, it won't make much difference if the round is a .32ACP or .380ACP. I'd be aiming for the face anyway
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You have already enumerated the advantages of the P32.
You have made zero points in favor of the P3AT.
You have stated that the diiference in caliber is inconsequential.

I cannot see where there is any rooom for discussion. You have yourself convinced.

The purpose of this post, was...what?
 
40jjb said:
All it is a faster burning powder, NO MAGIC
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They seemed to have dropped the "+P" designation about the same time they joined SAAMI. Pretty hypocritical to be part of a industry standards organization that doesn't recognize a +P standard for .380ACP but sell it anyway. IMO, the story they told you was a bunch of BS, it was never over the standard and the "+P" designation was for marketing purposes to begin with.

Come to think of it, I know it was never over pressure: the head of CorBon (Mr. Peter Pi) once explained it on one of the forums that +P sometimes was just used by them to designate "hotter than normal", but not over pressure.
 
cor bon

Thanks for the info, i learned something today, It was just a lot of promotional stunt from Cor Bon, It still performed better than before. Thanks Pocketgun its helpfull.:scrutiny:
 
Up to you, really

Many people say that the .380 is the minimum self-defense caliber. I think that a quality .32 round is pretty comparable to a .380 in efficacy.

I have read many more posts indicating reliability issues with the P3AT that aren't there with the P32. There are just as many, however, that say the P3ATs (especially newer ones) are very reliable.

Both are small guns and I wouldn't say either is fun to shoot--the .32 does has less bite than the .380. I know, they're not designed to be fun, but you're more likely to practice with a gun that doesn't make you wince in pain every time you pull the trigger.

Another reason I chose the .32 was because I had other .32 guns but no .380s. If I had no .32s prior to the purchase of my Kel-Tec, I would probably have given the P3AT a try first.
 
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