Keltec p11

[wild cat mccane]

You get negligence and a civil suit if your gun fires and hits someone.

If X~ is the legal standard of care, where X~=X*, and you purposefully bought a gun in these modern times that didn't come with a drop safety mechnism in it I would use the Hand rule to sue every dollar out of you for an estate or family of a person killed by your drop fired P11. Average wrongful is 1-7 million in the US.

NO way would I carry one chambered. Fine if not. But don't be a child in your response.

 

[Jeremiah10:23]

NO way would I carry one chambered. Fine if not. But don't be a child in your response.
__________________

Which post are you referring to?

 

[gpr]

you can get a 9mm upper and have the best of both worlds.....gary

 

[wild cat mccane]

in response to meef. I am sure he is a lovely person, but the conversation skills were childish.

For example, California did not just adopt the drop test law just because it hates guns. There are social costs when a person dies from a gun dropping and firing. The cost to include a drop safe hammer block is essentially nothing. Gun companies should be held liable for not using a standard of care and should be negligent for not including a drop safety. No arguement would hold up today considering all modernly designed guns have them.
Law& Economics. Powerful stuff.

 

[meef]

In response to wild cat mccane. I'm actually not a lovely person, but thank you ever so much for the very generous benefit of the doubt.

Regarding:

For example, California did not just adopt the drop test law just because it hates guns.

Using California and all of the attendant examples to make a point is fine irony.

Of all the nanny states, California is the preeminent Grand Dame.

The OSHA cowboy is alive and well.

 

[Onward Allusion]

Jeremiah10:23
Just got a message from Bud's. They told me they were changing the sale log to show I received a .40

I am now the proud new owner of a P-40. Hopefully I can get a chance to shoot it soon. Not bad for $189.

You may want to hold on to it just for its collectible value. Like someone else said, the P-40 is pretty rare these days. Kind of like the S&W Sigma in 357 SIG. Pretty sure there are some people out there that will give you at least twice what you'd paid for it.

 

[Walt Sherrill]

You may want to hold on to it just for its collectible value. Like someone else said, the P-40 is pretty rare these days.

It may be rare for a reason. The P-40 has some fans, but also a lot of detractors. Feeding problems and mag problems were pretty common. I think K-T discontinued it because many folks just couldn't make it work for them. (Not necessarily a problem with the gun, but simply a matter of the ergonomics not suiting too many people, in that caliber.)

Just because something is rare doesn't necessarily mean it will be collectible or valuable.

Think not? How much would you pay for an American Motors PACER or a Chevy Vega (from back in the '70s)? I'm sure there are buyers out there for both of those cars, somewhere, but I wouldn't buy one in hopes of seeing a big return on my investment, later...

Ditto the P-40. There are probably some hard-core Kel-Tec owners who'd like to have one, or a .357 SIG barrel for that same gun (there are supposed to be a few, floating around), but you may wait a long time to find a buyer who'll make it worth your time.

(I'm NOT a Kel-Tec hater: I've had a P-11, which I liked, a P3AT, and now have a PF9. I like the PF9 better than all the rest. I'm on a waiting list to get a PMR-30, too.)

 

[Jim NE]

They are not target gun they are save your life in a close situation guns.

I agree with the above assessment of the P-11.

I sometimes wonder if the people who gripe about the P-11 are people who can maybe only afford one or two guns, so they're looking for a 9mm that's the best of several (or all) world's - Target, defense, carry, etc.

Don't get me wrong, I can appreciate those economic circumstances, and in a situation like that, the P-11 probably isn't the gun for you. Not if you like to target shoot a lot. On the other hand, target shooting at 30 feet is fun for me, and my P-11 is accurate at that distance, so no problem. When all is said and done, it's hard to find that much 9mm firepower in that small of a package at ANY price, let alone the $249 I paid for a new P-11.

Problems:
-Yes, the P-11 does have too stiff of a trigger pull WHEN YOU FIRST BUY IT. It used to actually hurt my trigger finger until I sanded smooth the jagged surface of the trigger and shot the gun enough to reduce the spring tension.

-Control. The P-11 was never really accurate for me until the spring tension was reduced with use AND I extended the grip with a grip shoe OR a second aftermarket hi-cap mag that was longer. BEWARE: You just can't buy the hi-cap mag and expect it to work. You have to do some mods (See KTOG site.)

-The slide spring is so stiff that I can't close the slide merely by releasing the slide catch with my thumb on my shooting hand. Closing the slide has always been a two handed operation for me - I have to push the slide back a bit with my left hand so I can release the catch with my right. Don't know if they're all like this, or just mine.

-My slide catch broke so that the slide doesn't stay open after the last round is shot from the mag. I haven't fixed it yet. Haven't decided if I ever will (since closing the slide from a locked open position is a two handed operation anyway.) The slide catch still works perfectly good It just sheared off the tab that's activated by the mag.


So when all is said and done, the P-11 isn't all that user friendly, but one you address some issues, it's a good really small 9mm. Despite the issues, it's been more reliable in shooting function than either my S&W or Ruger 9mm's.

 

[wild cat mccane]

Well, is accuracy, a good trigger, and low weight really mutually exclusive? No.

So we can't say it is because the P11 has 8-12 pound trigger that it makes it a self defense gun can we? No.

 

[Onward Allusion]

Walt Sherrill

Quote:
You may want to hold on to it just for its collectible value. Like someone else said, the P-40 is pretty rare these days.

It may be rare for a reason.

Did you say AMC Pacer?! Now THAT is a collectible! Going back to the P-40, if I got one for $200, I would keep it just for the novelty value. And yes, I know the P-40 had major issues.