Kimber .308 v. Tulammo Misfires

[gbw]

I have a Kimber 84M Classic Select stainless in .308. Nice little rifle, rather overpriced for the quality. Leupold VX4 2.5 x 8-36mm. Anyhow...

Shot it Sat. with Tulammo steel case 150 fmj .308. Decent accuracy, 1.5 - 2" at 100, but I'm not a rifle shot.

Half the cartridges needed 2 strikes to fire. I assume a hard military primer, I haven't had a problem with any domestic commercial hunting ammo.

Just an fyi, anyone else seen this?

 

[ColtPythonElite]

I buy Tula primers. I have had both LP and SP fail to fire on the first strike using double action out of at least half a dozen different handguns. They always go the second time. Never had an issue in single action.... I agree they are hard. I have bought about 30k if them over the past few years, but likely won't buy any more.

 

[Lloyd Smale]

I wouldn't shoot steal jacketed bullets out of my Kimber. that said I have to agree that there a bit overpriced for what they are. I got a heck of deal on a used one or one wouldn't be in the safe.

 

[jrdolall]

I have shot thousands of rounds of Tula 7.62x39 and .223 without any issues out of SKS, AK and AR's. Quite a bit of handgun ammo as well, mostly 9mm, and I don't recall any issues. I don't believe I have ever had any Tula in any of my bolts.

 

[jmr40]

Kimbers have an adjustment on the bolt to control how far the firing pin protrudes from the bolt face. First loosen the set screw on the bottom of the bolt. It may already be loose and the problem. Then use a small screwdriver to turn the screw in the rear of the bolt to get the firing pin to protrude farther from the bolt face. I used a handful or primed cases to experiment with until I got just the right adjustment.

If over time the set screw works loose the adjustment will work back off and you'll get inconsistent firing pin strikes.

 

[gbw]

Lloyd, I wasn't clear, I meant the case is steel. The bullet jacket looks to be copper or a gilding metal.

JMR, Thanks! I'll check the bolt/FP adjustment.

 

[HOOfan_1]

I bet they are steel jacketed bullets...just copper plated

 

[Casefull]

Kimbers have an adjustment on the bolt to control how far the firing pin protrudes from the bolt face. First loosen the set screw on the bottom of the bolt. It may already be loose and the problem. Then use a small screwdriver to turn the screw in the rear of the bolt to get the firing pin to protrude farther from the bolt face. I used a handful or primed cases to experiment with until I got just the right adjustment.

Correct. In addition I purchased a used Kimber montana and it started having light strikes on regular ammo. I pulled the bolt apart and found the firing pin bent and dragging on bolt. Someone had adjusted the pin too far forward and it became bent from being shoved into the cartridge. I straightened and backed out to a correct setting and it has been fine ever since. That was why rifle was for sale. ha

 

[MCMXI]

gbw, I don't agree that Kimbers are "overpriced for the quality" but as for your firing pin, you want about .050" firing pin protrusion but no more than .055". You can use LOCTITE 242 on the set screw threads when you reinstall it.

 

[gbw]

MCM - Thanks for the data, I'll check it soon.

I wrote a post, I think within the past year, with photo's, describing why I'm not impressed with Kimber quality in relation to their cost. It's based on my experience with this one rifle, could be a fluke of course.

ETA: Bullets are magnetic so Hoofan and Lloyd are almost certanly right - steel jacket.

 

[MCMXI]

A few years ago I had a nightmare experience with a Savage rifle that I bought, a Weather Warrior in 7mm-08 Rem. I still have the rifle and need to fix the receiver. I've worked on it from time to time and it's' a lot better but the whole experience really soured me to Savage products. I'll never buy another Savage rifle but I'm sure that my experience isn't the norm even though a neighbor's WW rifle had a similar problem. I own three Kimber rifles with plans to own more and consider the hunting rifles to be among the best available at that price point. When you consider that Kimber rifles are 100% US made, are made from quality steels, have hand checkered wood stocks, the best synthetic stock on the market (Montana/Mountain Ascent/Adirondack) and are among the most compact (minimalist) packages out there, they're outstanding values. Just my opinion based on owning/using many brands and extensive experience using Kimber rifles.

 

[jmr40]

Concerning Kimber quality. I've found them to be about the same, or maybe slightly better quality than any other of the common rifles from Winchester, Weatherby, Ruger etc. But you do pay a $300-$400 premium over the other brands. Some see that as overpriced for what you get. That extra money is paying for weight reduction, not better quality.

If you want a 7-8 lb rifle, then save a few hundred dollars and buy something else. If you are looking for a 5 lb rifle that will shoot MOA or less a Kimber is the best value in firearms. Anything else that would come close will cost you $3,000-$5,000. Kimbers can still be found for $1,000-$1,200.

 

[MCMXI]

Concerning Kimber quality. I've found them to be about the same, or maybe slightly better quality than any other of the common rifles from Winchester, Weatherby, Ruger etc. But you do pay a $300-$400 premium over the other brands. Some see that as overpriced for what you get. That extra money is paying for weight reduction, not better quality.

Obviously this is my personal opinion based on my experience but I've sold two US made Winchester M70 Extreme Weather rifles recently that were nowhere near the quality of any of my Kimbers. The machining inside the receivers was disappointing (I made a number of posts on this) and the rifles were heavy and neither of them shot any factory ammunition well (three brands). I never got around to load development for them but would most likely have found good loads given enough time. I bought the Winchester in .300 Win Mag the same day I bought the Kimber Montana in 300 WSM. The Winchester was $850, the Kimber was $1,050 and yet the Kimber was perfectly machined and significantly lighter for a mere $200 more. Show me a Winchester with hand checkering! Then consider that every Kimber I've owned or shot has produced sub moa groups with at least two different factory loads and 1/2 moa or better with reloads. I have no experience with Ruger bolt action rifles or Weatherby for that matter and most likely won't since I'm basically done buying hunting rifles after I purchase a Caprivi and Mountain Ascent. I stand by my comment that Kimber rifles are outstanding value for the money with better machining, fit, finish, wood stocks and synthetic stocks than offerings from many other manufacturers who offer rifles in the $600 to $2,000 price range.

 

[Casefull]

I have 3 Kimber rifles. Montana in 308 (used had firing pin issue, probably owner caused, has been flawless since) Montana in 300wsm (used, feed ramp needed a little tlc, otherwise very accurate, also used) Mountain ascent in 308 ( purchased new, no issues) I gave up on custom rifles since owning Remington custom shop and Kimber rifles. The light wt and functioning of the Kimber rifles are easily worth the few hundred dollars over the competition for my wants. Just putting a good stock on a cheaper rifle puts you up to the cost of a Kimber. They have great adjustable triggers and good barrels. Great hunting rifles. I probably would stick to something else for a bench rifle.

 

[HexHead]

Concerning Kimber quality. I've found them to be about the same, or maybe slightly better quality than any other of the common rifles from Winchester, Weatherby, Ruger etc. But you do pay a $300-$400 premium over the other brands. Some see that as overpriced for what you get. That extra money is paying for weight reduction, not better quality.

If you want a 7-8 lb rifle, then save a few hundred dollars and buy something else. If you are looking for a 5 lb rifle that will shoot MOA or less a Kimber is the best value in firearms. Anything else that would come close will cost you $3,000-$5,000. Kimbers can still be found for $1,000-$1,200.

It's so refreshing to see someone around here that actually gets it, and doesn't think the answer to every rifle question is "just get a Savage".

 

[Swampman]

IIRC, all of the .308 Tulammo cases I've examined had the big .254" Berdan primers used for 7.62x54R production in most of the former Eastern Bloc countries.

Being as how their original primer production methods were more than likely aimed at feeding Mosin Nagants, PKM's and Dragunovs those primers may be a bit harder than what most American sporting rifles were designed to operate with.