LED lights

[bdjansen]

I bought a LED light. One of the mag light AA ones. I'm kinda disappointed. The batteries don't last as long as I thought they would. I thought they would last a bit longer with a LED.

The worst part though is when the batteries die you have no warning. Just sudden darkness. This I think, is unexceptable. Normal lights die slowly, you know it's time to get your new batteries out. No warning with the LEDs.

So I'm sticking with the classics. I know a lot of you guys really love your Surefire lights, how do you work around the problem I mentioned above?

 

[rcmodel]

Actually, it's just the opposite with Surefire lights.

The incandescent lights go out with no warning whatsoever when the batteries run down.

The LED's just get dimmer, and dimmer, and dimmer.
You have plenty of warning before you have no light at all.

As for the MagLight, I don't know what to tell you.

I converted two D-cell maglights several months ago when the real MagLight LED conversions came to Wal-Mart.

I am very Happy with them, except they don't have as wide a range of focus as the old bulbs.

But talk about bright!
And I still have the same batteries in the one I use everyday after several months.

So, I can't say what they will do when they run down, because I'm starting to think they aren't going to ever run down!

rcmodel

 

[hso]

That's odd to me also. I have converted a couple of the AA Maglights to LED and haven't experienced this. Of course I didn't use the Maglight conversion, but a NiteEyz instead.

 

[fletcher]

No warning with the LEDs.

I understand this is dependent on how the particular manufacturer decides to regulate the power. If it regulates the voltage to maintain a consistent brightness during use, it will be more likely to cut off as described, as opposed to those that are less regulated and will gradually dim (I may have this backwards).

I've had a Dorcy 3W LED light (3x AAA) for a couple years and I've been very happy with it - a lot of bang for your buck seeing as it's only ~$20.

 

[rcmodel]

LED = 3 hours 22 minutes to 50% output & failure.
http://www.flashlightreviews.com/reviews/maglite_minimagled.htm

INCANDESCENT = 41 minutes to 50% output.
5:31 to failure.
http://www.flashlightreviews.com/reviews/maglight_minimag.htm

rcmodel

 

[Carl Levitian]

A couple years ago I converted my three AA minimags to LED with the Nite-eze conversion. They are apparently un-regulated, because they get a little dimmer as time goes on. Very long battery run time. It takes some months of nightly use for one to get dim enough to be having trouble seeing a painting on the far wall of the living room at night, with the lights out.

In general, LED lights will give you longer run times on the same batteries.

 

[Upriver]

My experiences echos that of rcmodel - with the advances in LED technology the last few years, I rarely find myself reaching for an incandescent. I've had the same Fenix L1P going on three years or so, and an L2T that makes it look like a penlight brightness-wise. None of my LED's has ever taken a dive without warning (which I can't say for my CR123 incandescents).

I even switched a 4D mag-light over too with a conversion kit - (can't remember which one, but it wasn't a mag product) and it kicks butt. About 25 hours of battery life. I had previously picked up a mag-branded lLED conversion bulb, and it was, well, less than spectacular.

Regards,

U

 

[ZeSpectre]

I have regulated rechargeable lights (Inova T-4) that cut off below a certain voltage to protect the rechargeable cell from overdischarge damage. (no warning, just off)

I also have regulated lights that switch over to a "moonlight mode" which is much dimmer but would give you at least some light for a number of hours (20+ in some cases) that will get you through 80% of the usual situations.

Mag has been EXTREMELY slow to get into the game where LED lights are concenred and they've been really conservative in the application. If you want a good, moderate priced, LED light I strongly recommend this 3 watt Ray-o-vac. (usually found at Target).

Well constructed, stunningly bright, runs on 2xAA batteries (I use rechargable NiMH batteries).
A review of this light here.

 

[ArfinGreebly]

Ray-O-Vac Xtreme 3C

I picked up a 4-watt Ray-o-Vac 3C. Bright as the dickens and 100 hours on a fresh set of batteries. Liked it so much I picked up another couple.

I looked at the 1AA and 2AA (and 2C, for that matter) lights, but the run times were all under 20 hours, some as short as 2 hours.

I'm sure there are applications where a high lumen count is more important than run time, but I don't have those applications on my list.

One of my 4-watt R-o-V 3C units rides in the truck. I need that sucker to be bright and run a long time, and that's what I get from it. (I wound up using a piece of paper rolled around the batteries to eliminate rattle, and now they're fine.)

For personal carry, I use the Streamlignt 1AA Task light. Small, rides in pocket (see the "what's in your pocket" thread), bright enough for all my needs, and has a run time from 20 to 50 hours or more, depending on mode.

I'll be ordering more of those, 'cuz if I don't, someone will figure out that I like them and they'll be pulled off the market.

 

[bdjansen]

Well, it seems that LED lights are created far from equal. I bought a maglight because I expected the quality to be there. But I guess not. 3 and a half hours to failure is not very good. I assumed then that the sudden failure was something that happens to all LEDs but I guess that's not true. I just need to find a better light.

After reading this thread I bought a couple of Eveready LED flashlights at Fred Meyers. A 2 AA battery one for 6 dollars, one LED and it says it runs for 50 hours on Alkalines. Another for $11 that says 100 hours on its 3 LEDs and 2 D Alkaline batteries.

The light output is good, not anything amazing but as good as the LED maglight for the AA Eveready. Better on the other one. Hope they last as long as they say.

 

[Gunsby_Blazen]

Every LED light that I have ever owned has been a POS. I have yet to even come across a surefire but they better be good for that price tag!

I just never cared for the type of light it puts out. To me, its more blinding and less functional than the traditional lights. The old style bulbs seem to make seeing in the dark easier. Maybe I am used to the yellow and white of the traditional bulbs and not so much the cool and almost blue of the LED lights...
Anyway, someone tell me where I am wrong here. Maybe I just have had crap lights.

 

[JohnKSa]

I've got a few Fenix lights that have been very good lights. I carry my L1T V2.0 everywhere. About 100 lumens and a run time of 1.5hrs with a high-output rechargeable AA. Or, if you don't need blinding light you can twist the head and it will run for 15 hours at 15 lumens. And it's only 3.7" long.

The switch on this light operates like an endcap switch should. Push a little for intermittant on, push harder to click the light on. Some of the other Fenix lights have endcap switches that are backwards. The light doesn't come on until you have clicked the switch and are releasing the button.

Anyway, if there's something closer to the perfect flashlight, I haven't found it. Small enough to always have on you and bright enough to embarass a Surefire that's equipped with the standard bulb. And best of all you get that without the expense of the lithium batteries...

 

[riceboy72]

MagLite, back when they were introduced, did what they did and they did it well - very well. They put a high volume of light out for a reasonable amount of time, and they captured the flashlight market for many, many years.

They've since fallen behind to other companies that produce powerhouse lights at a fraction of the size. Even in incandescent form, smaller lights can be had that put a MagLite 3D to shame, both in output and runtime.

LED is now the mainstay of the flashlight market, and they seemingly improve as the months go by. The light quality keeps getting better, the output keeps getting brighter, and the runtime keeps nudging ahead. I now own drop in modules for two of my Surefires and the output - 140 and 235 lumens - is plenty to go check out the bump in the night. The 235 lumens is a monster and way too strong to use in the house, but man, it lights up the backyard like no other.

If you really want to dive into the world of flashlights, check out www.candlepowerforums.com. It is literally the mecca of flashlights, with way more knowledge than I could ever consume.

MagLite redefined the flashlight industry, but much like the VCR and the shoulder mounted camcorder, new technology has emerged and literally left the MagLite in the dark. For the non discerning user, the MagLite is more than adequate; for the ultimate aficionado, there are better and brigher lights out there, especially in the LED realm. There are upgrades available for the 3D that will revitalize it and give it some serious oompf; most notably the one made by Gene Malkoff.

For the record, I am certainly sold on Surefire as I own quite a few. However, the Tiablo A9 is very impressive as a throw monster, and I have a Nitecore D10 on the way. Can't wait to check it out and see if it's worth the hype it's been receiving.

 

[ugaarguy]

About 100 lumens and a run time of 1.5hrs with a high-output rechargeable AA. Or, if you don't need blinding light you can twist the head and it will run for 15 hours at 15 lumens. And it's only 3.7" long.

That's impressive for AA light.

Small enough to always have on you and bright enough to embarass a Surefire that's equipped with the standard bulb.

Nothing like an apples to oranges comparison. Surefire updated their LED heads this year. I converted my E1e to an E1L with the new KX1 head earlier this year. A single CR 123 lithium battery gets me 45 lumens for 8.5 hours or 3 lumens for 48 hours. The new E1B Backup gets 5 lumens for 37 hours or 80 lumens for 1.3 hours. If I didn't already have the E1e to convert at half the price with the KX1 head, I would have bought the E1B.

And best of all you get that without the expense of the lithium batteries...

$21 for 12 SF 123A batteries direct from Surefire isn't expensive. Plus you get a ten year shelf life and MUCH wider temperature range than AA alkaline - only much expensive lithium batteries can touch that in AA cells.

How do Surefire lights hold up? My E1e with original incandescent head reinstalled, and approx 6 month old KX1 LED head is pictured below. The body is one month short of 2 years of constant pocket carry banging against my keys. A little over 4 months of that was in Iraq with the incan head in constant use as a night shift USAF comm-electronics technician. The rubber tailcap switch was worn smooth (but still fully functional) so the tailcap was recently replaced under warranty by a Surefire rep.

 

[rcmodel]

One very positive thing about LED's that hasn't been mentioned.

They never, or at least, vary rarely burn out or stop working.
Even if you drop them on concrete!
Even if you drop them off a step-ladder.
Even if you hit a BG over the head!

I've blown IC bulbs on Maglights too many times to mention over the years.
And twice with a Surefire.

According to Mr. Murphy, the only time an incandescent flashlight bulb will ever burn out is when you need light the absolute very worst!

With LED bulb's, it is no longer a worry at all.

rcmodel

 

[Guns and more]

I got tired of having the tiny bulbs on the mini-mag light burn out at the worst time. I bought an LED light (similar in size to the mini-mag) at Lowes for $20. One AA, I've never replaced the battery, bright as can be. I like it so well I bought a second one that I leave in the safe. I bought a third one and mounted it on the HD shotgun. I got a Nite-Ize conversion for the mini-mag but I can't find the flashlight, maybe I gave it away. I won't miss it.

 

[acmax95]

I have 3 AA minimags and 2 4D Mags. One of my AA and one 4D have Niteyze conversions in them and they are okay. The rest have Terralux conversions from in them and they are much better. They have better light and seem to last longer.

However, my Streamlight Scorpion and Inova T5 get more use because they are much better than any of my maglites. The streamlight goes hunting with me and the inova stays in the truck. The maglites are used around the house for odd jobs.

 

[conw]

I'd encourage anyone interested "trying" a good LED to head over to DealExtreme and get a Romisen. They have a nice variety. I bought a friend a 1xAA that's right at 100 lumens I'm guessing, the RC-G2. It matches my Olight T10 Q5 (similar to a Fenix P2D) on the 3rd or middle setting. The difference is my Olight was $50 (retail $65) and this one was $12!! You can even "mod" the Romisen to spit out 150+ lumens for another $5-10. With free shipping.

I also ordered my dad a neat Romisen, can't remember the name of it, that can easily convert from CR123a to 1xAA OR 2xAA (with tube extension).

Frankly, brightness is slightly overrated in flashlights. The "blind the bad guy and make your escape" myth Surefire puts out is only marginally true unless you have a 1000 lumen monster. I carry my 180 lumen single batt pocket light in my hand walking through a dark parking lot, the reasoning being that if I need to draw it might buy me half a second or so, but I don't think it's going to "stop" anyone.

Thus, things like "throw" (not directly related to brightness, although all things being equal more brightness means more throw) and runtime matter more to me than brightness now. I rarely even use the highest setting unless I want to spotlight something far away in the woods at night. The 3rd-highest setting, which is the equivalent of the one-mode RC-G2, suits me fine for hiking or whatever. The lowest setting (40 lumens?) is more than enough for reading a book or map or finding something in the car.

 

[JohnKSa]

A single CR 123 lithium battery gets me 45 lumens for 8.5 hours or 3 lumens for 48 hours. The new E1B Backup gets 5 lumens for 37 hours or 80 lumens for 1.3 hours.

Comparing runtime and brightness numbers is about as apples-to-apples as you can get.

The L1T V2.0 will give you 98 lumens at 1.5 hours. That beats either light you listed for brightness and still gives you longer run time than the brightest light you listed.

$21 for 12 SF 123A batteries direct from Surefire isn't expensive. Plus you get a ten year shelf life and MUCH wider temperature range than AA alkaline - only much expensive lithium batteries can touch that in AA cells.

To be fair, my post only addressed the expense issue. Yes, if extreme temperature ranges are an issue then perhaps the lithiums are a better choice.

Ok, as far as the shelf life issue you can keep a couple of the AA lithium batteries on hand for the cases where you want to have an emergency battery available that can be stored for a long time. For the rest of the time, you can run the light off a couple of AA rechargeables that you rotate out as needed--less than $5 worth of batteries that should last you many years if you have a decent charger.

The Surefires do seem to be sturdier lights--they should be. If my Fenix breaks, I can buy a replacement and still be ahead in terms of out-of-pocket expense, especially when one factors in the savings in batteries. So far it's holding up very well.

The rubber tailcap switch was worn smooth (but still fully functional) so the tailcap was recently replaced under warranty by a Surefire rep.

The Fenix lights come with a spare rubber switchcover, but I've not had to replace one yet.

...the reasoning being that if I need to draw it might buy me half a second or so, but I don't think it's going to "stop" anyone.

I agree, it's not going to stop, but it's a very good way to distract someone for awhile.

 

[Aka Zero]

I just bought a coleman led light at walmart. Been looking at tac-lights for awhile and this one was cheap. $18.

Rated at 75 lumens for 6 hours. all aluminum, o-ring seals. Cree led, runs on 3 AAA batteries. Nice sized for EDC, scalloped bezel, for scaring the sheeple.

Don't have a surefire or anything to compare it to, but this thing is bright. no idea on actual run time, but AAA is cheap, and the light is solid. Will have to buy a few of those lights I was looking at..... to compare....

 

[tacweapon]

I have a Fenix P3D and love it I plan to order a couple more. I bought it on Ebay for 30 dollars I think and so far I have not had to replace the batterys yet and it has gone camping mulitple time it has even been mounted on my XCR some I think I have run it about 20-25 hours on all the different light settings and it is still going strong

 

[conw]

A nice little side-note for CR123a batt users, get one of the stainless steel keychain pill holders with an O ring...happy fit for the CR batt and you always have a spare with you.

I think once you put the myth of "blinding" an attacker aside, and take an objective look at runtime, throw, spill, and practical (edc) uses, the cheaper lights start to look better and better.

Yeah, I might use (as someone above echoed me saying originally) the light to slow someone down...in certain situations...but I guarantee it's getting a LOT more use for other things that are equally important.

SureFire really spreads a lot of misinfo about the effectiveness or tactical soundness, IMO, of using a light during an armed encounter. If you can see someone else is armed you are probably much better off devoting all your energy to responding with force. On the other hand if you're being approached by an indigent/derelict/panhandler or disheveled youth in the parking lot, it could add a lot of authority to your inquiry "What are you doing? Step back" while staying on the legal, non-brandishing side of things.

 

[JohnKSa]

...could add a lot of authority to your inquiry...

That's true, but it's also a pretty significant distraction/irritation. The little 90+ lumen light I carry is bright enough that people find it very irritating to have it shone in their eyes even in bright light. In low light it leaves a severe afterimage for a minute or more. Not enough to incapacitate, but it's certainly enough to reduce one's visual acuity significantly for a good many seconds.

Still, I don't carry a flashlight because of the detrimental effect it will have on an attacker's vision, I carry it because of the beneficial effect it has on mine.

 

[conw]

John, I think we're on the same page.

I just cringe at the advertising being put out there in the name of advice when it comes to SureFires et al.

I think tac lights etc are AWESOME for cop work, looking for suspects etc...

I think tac lights are perfect for a SWAT team clearing a dark house...

I think they work great as a very early, non-weapon option to de-escalate certain uncomfortable situations, or even to disrupt the so-called OODA loop of a questionable person.

But...

James Williams has been training in and teaching self defense and martial arts for 46 years. He is recognized world wide for his knowledge and skill in teaching personal defense. James is actively involved in teaching Military special operations, SWAT, and government security professionals. James considers the small, powerful, SureFire tactical flashlight to be the single best self defense and personal safety tool for daily carry.

True Story
I recently purchased a SureFire 6P® Original. My brother and I were in Center City, near West Philly, a few nights later. It usually isn't that bad of an area, but we were pretty vulnerable. Anyhow, I had my 6P at hand, and my brother had a rainbow knife in his pocket. We were on a main street and didn't think much of a man asking us for directions—until he calmly told us to shell out our cash.

I reached for my SureFire and gave him a blast of 65 lumens to the eyes. He started swearing at us, and I hit him over the head with the front of my flashlight, even though I only have a 6P, not a 6P® Defender® with a Strike Bezel™. I dropped it on the cement after striking him because he almost fell on me.

With a bit of blood and scratches, the 6P kept the guy on the ground until the cops arrived. Durable and helpful. Now I keep my 6P Original with me wherever I go.

I reached into my pocket, looking for my keys to use as a makeshift defense tool, but I discovered my SureFire E2E instead. The guy menacingly announced that we should give him our money, but by the time he'd said "money," I'd already spotlighted him in his eyes. He flung his hands up to block the light, then turned and ran back into the darkness.

I will NEVER leave home without my SureFire E2E again!

 

[SniperStraz]

I use a SureFire G2 LED and it dims before it goes out. Great light by the way. Best I've ever had. Highly recomended.