Length of 9mm 115gr Gold Dot

[Friar Whently]

Hey guys. I've been reloading for several months now (.38) and just got into 9mm. I'm currently trying to work up a load with 231 and I'm looking at the Winchester website for load data. It gives the min and max loads as 4.7 and 5.1 for the 115gr Gold Dot with a OAL of 1.125. I'm currently using Zero FMJ bullets and I'm trying to figure out my loads based on the website data, but I have a feeling that the flat-nosed Gold Dots may be a different length than my FMJs, and therefore I would need to adjust my OAL accordingly. I realize that this level of precision probably isn't needed for standard handgun loads, but I'm just a little anal about this sort of thing .

All that being said, can anyone tell me the length of the 9mm 115gr Gold Dot bullet? Any help would be most appreciated. Thanks!

 

[john16443]

Are you loading the Zero JHP's or JRN's? It will make a difference in the final COL that you should use.

You didn't say, but I trust you have an actual reloading manual. If so, it should have information on COL for a 115gr RN style bullet. For example, my older Speer information indicates that the gold dots should be loaded to 1.125" COL as you indicate. The Speer RN jacketed bullets should be loaded to 1.135" COL.

Regardless of all that, I have contacted Speer in the past and they told me the engineering drawings for the 115 gr gold dots show them to be 0.560" long.

 

[Friar Whently]

Thanks for the info.

I'm not using the Zero JHPs, so I guess that would mean I'm using their JRN (although they call them FMJ). Well, now I'm confused on what OAL to use. I was assuming that due to the flat profile of the Gold Dots, they would be shorter than my FMJs, thus accounting for the .01 difference in published OALs (Speer manual says 1.125 for Gold Dots and 1.135 for FMJ).

However my bullets range anywhere from 0.550" to 0.553". So I guess in order to have the same volume in the case as a Gold Dot (and thus be able to accurately follow their load data), I would have to seat my bullet about .010 deeper than the Gold Dot...

I'm only obsessing over this because the minimum charge for a given powder in one manual may be higher than the max charge of the same powder in a different manual, and the only difference is in OAL. This is the case for Unique with FMJ in the Lee vs. the Speer manuals...Lee = 5.1 min, 5.5 max at 1.125 OAL; Speer = 5.6 min, 6.3 max at 1.135 OAL.

It seems if minimums and maximums can vary that much with the only variable being OAL, I'd better get the OAL right. Is anyone else as conflicted about this as me?

 

[LiveLife]

Since pistols are different from the test barrel fixtures used to measure max average chamber pressures to publish load data, reloaders should always determine the working OAL that will work with their pistols/barrels/magazines.

Using the published OAL will not ensure it will work in your pistol or give you optimal accuracy.

First determine the Max OAL by using the barrel drop test then determine the Ideal OAL by feeding/chambering from the magazine. Once you determined the Ideal OAL, then conduct a full powder work up to determine the charges that will reliably cycle the slide and produce accurate shot groups.

I usually load 115/124 gr FMJ bullets to 1.135" OAL to work in multiple pistols. JHP OAL depends on pistol/barrel.

 

[1SOW]

It gives the min and max loads as 4.7 and 5.1 for the 115gr Gold Dot with a OAL of 1.125. I'm currently using Zero FMJ bullets and I'm trying to figure out my loads based on the website data, but I have a feeling that the flat-nosed Gold Dots may be a different length than my FMJs, and therefore I would need to adjust my OAL accordingly.

I often do the same for new bullets. If you seat a same weight bullet to the same seating depth as another that runs well, it'll work as an oal starting point for your new load data. Just be sure it'll feed in that gun with the new nose-shape like bds said---do the push test or drop test. I prefer the push test. (You can do a search for Push test by Wobbly)
Some 9mm are picky about how long a conical nose/HP/FP bullet can be loaded.

I load 124gr Gold Dots, so I can't give you the 115gr length. THE 124 GR GDs are .561" so the 115gr will be some amount shorter than that. ALL Gold Dots are HOLLOW POINT BULLETS that have a nice conventional ogive (curve from the sidewall to the nose), so it'll likely let you load at your oal easily. Always start at the low end of the loading data and work up.

Someone here should show up with a 115gr G.D Bullet length. Expensive bullets though.

 

[4895]

I would load them at 1.125" and call them good with 4.7 grains of 231 being on the upper end of charge. Personally, I wouldn't waste Gold Dot bullets on W231. I like the extra velocity of Power Pistol. I load them at 6.5 grains and 1.115" with no problems.

The ogive of the bullet is further out towards the meplat than a FMJ so plan on backing your seating die out quite a bit to give proper oal compared to FMJ.

 

[1SOW]

The ogive of the bullet is further out towards the meplat than a FMJ so plan on backing your seating die out quite a bit to give proper oal compared to FMJ.

That's not what I've found. The 124gr GDs don't hit the rifling on my Sig at over 1.20" OAL.
I load them at 1.142"@1200'/sec, Vit n340 (no flash) and they shoot well for my S.D. loads. The 115gr will have the same nose shape with a shorter body.

22 cents/bullet is an expensive range hole.

 

[918v]

I think he meant to say that in order for the ogjives of both bullets to be the same distance to the rifling, the FMJ would have to be seated to a longer OAL. But that all depends on the profile.

I would use an OAL where 80-90% of the bullet shank is in the case.

 

[4895]

No, the OAL is the same for both bullet profiles. I guess you could set your OAL to your chamber and work up a load like the pros do only keeping under SAAMI specs for max OAL.

There is more meat on a HP bullet because it is missing the interior mass of a FMJ. In order for it to have the same weight, there is more mass near the tip (meplat) and this causes a typical round nose (fmj) profile seating die to contact the bullet ogive sooner while seating than a FMJ.

I'm only trying to save a 9mm case. Futile isn't it.

 

[1SOW]

4895, I think my misunderstanding your meaning was "my problem". I apologize.

I'm so used to having to load JHPs "short--some real Short"- in my CZ, I'm springloaded to brag on the Gold Dot's graceful ogive that allows loading fairly long oals compared to most JHPs with conical noses or abrupt ogives. Zero, MG, XTP, Berry's and more. After loading the 124HBRN bullet, I do have to "back off" on the seating die to load the Zero 125gr JHP at a much shorter oal.

918, you're right.

4895 thanks for trying to keep me on track. "Engage brain before driving fingers".