Lightest weight fixed 8x or 10x scope? Might return Trijicon LPVO...

[Bamper]

I have a Trijicon CredoHX264 1x6 LPVO that is a week over 30 days purchased from optics planet. I asked them about a return and they said yes its okay.

I have never been quite fond of it but I could just be too picky. But for Japanese glass made at Light Optical Works and a almost 1k optic maybe I'm not?

Heres the scoop. I felt it has always had a fishbowl effect around outer edge at 1x, 6x it doesnt.
For clarity trying to tune the diopter is a give and take relationship. I tune 1x looking at lettering 7 yards away and get it PERFECT. The 6x now suffers clarity, I tune 6x and now 1x has a bit of double vision again as well as prob the outer 40% of the ring tad blurry. Also even when 1x or 6x is perfect clarity if you shift your head AT ALL it suffers immediately. No scope shadow but the blur...

I have not seen a Credo on anyones builds online, only the Vcog or old Acogs. I thought I was picky maybe but I seen a 1x4 credo review yesterday that was not favorable and got me thinking. To be fair I dont have tons of exp with LPVO's. My memory tells me the Vortex viper ($600 one) was better but I could go look at some locally.

I have thought about having a red dot at 45 anyway so maybe this is a good way to save a tad bit of weight or break even adding a 45 red dot.

 

[jmr40]

It's a 1-6X and 1-4X, not 1X6 or 1X4.

There is a minimum distance that any scope can be focused. And the more magnification, the farther that distance is. You aren't going to get a scope set on 4X to focus on anything very close. A fixed 8X or 10X scope would be even worse at close range. Plus, you'd have much less field of view.

To be fair, I have no idea about that specific scope. But I've used a fair number of other 1-4X and 1-6X scopes over the years and find that magnification range very useful. 1X is incredibly fast to use with both eyes open up close. And 4X is enough magnification for shots out to at least 200 yards.

Not being perfectly clear out to the edges is annoying but doesn't really hurt anything. You only look through the center of the scope. But on a scope approaching 4 digits I'd expect better. I'd have to see it in person before I could decide to live with it or let it go.

But if it were me I'd stay on that magnification range even if I tried another brand. I'm not a fan of dot sights.

 

[Hookeye]

Running a big game scope, w parallax fixed at 100 or 150 yards......

I find that 4X is usable at 25 yards and up to 6X at 50 yards.
Inside of 25 yards you gotta drop the mag. Non Adj Obj and you just gotta live with what ya get.

Had a Trijicon Accupoint and the reticle (gold triangle) and illumination was cool. But it had distortion at outer edge.
I expected better considering the price (older model so maybe better now or good then, mine just had an issue?).
It held zero and adjusted fine.

Thread title says lightest 10X?
My fixed 10 X adjusts parallax to 25 yards and could go to 50 ft with an adapter they used to sell
( is old Leupold M8, w friction adjust ). Adapter was 50 bucks back in the day. I shudder to think what folks are asking for em now.

Proly not what the OP is asking for, but they did make stuff in 6, 8 and 10X fixed power w adj obj.
IIRC the Vari X and M8 AO stuff went to 25 yards, and closer in the EFR series. The EFR might have only been on some variables.

I dunno if the Leupold fixed 12X later runs were available in EFR (extended focal range).
That was marketed to rimfire guys but they still adjusted for farther out like other AO.

FWIW My new SWFA 12X fixed has parallax to 10 meters. It aint light weight.

I had one of the newer 3-9X EFR Freedom scopes and it had a shady band around outer edge. Dunno if a less than perfect one or obj
recess so great that was causing it. The rear eyepiece being more tubular than bell really killed the aesthetic so wouldn't look right on a nice .22 or other.

Slap one on an AR for yotes might be OK LOL

 

[Hookeye]

Dot sights may take getting used to.
Astigmatism may make it less than fun.
I run a reflex clocked on a rifle, 3 moa and its wicked fast.
Can shoot accurately too. But I learned long ago to trust the dot, not peek, and view things in relationship rather than fine intersect (like when using a scope).
Do like scopes better than dots, but like dots just fine (RDS- actually don't care for a dot in a scope reticle).

Didn't take me but a few range sessions to accept the RDS stuff.
Have buds that tried and tried and still don't like em.

My ol lady has astigmatism, coke bottle glasses.........and runs a TRS on her 1022 and loves it. Ive asked aboout starburst and other and she says its fine.
Likes the reflex sights too.

But then I let her look at a PA Cyclops Gen 2 prism. Now she wants me to buy her one!
They are neat but at 1X.........ya use em like a reg RDS.
Id like to try a 2x or 3X model.
One of those might be a dandy woods rifle deer optic.

 

[Hookeye]

Do some/all 1-6x or 1-8x scopes have image issues due to design or component quality demands?

All my stuff is fixed or max of multiplying four times. Majority three times.

Ive not looked through the new stuff of greater.

Just wondering.....if they (scopes w higher multipliers) do it at lower end or if that maybe an issue w trying to have a 1x ar bottom?

Zeiss or Swaro have anytjing 1-6x or 1-8x and how do they look?

Ive seen fish eye in Burris compacts abd other brand/ models and they just 3 times range Honestly not been impressed w a lot of stuff over the years.
Mid tier.

Any Leica, Swaro and Zeiss ive looked through did not have a low end of 1x.
So I have no idea

 

[Hookeye]

Lots of people like a fixed 6x for hunting
Thats too much for me. Just at the point where offhand is kinda tough.
Fixed 4x or a variable is more to my liking.
Varminting i can go w a fixed of higher. Shot a few chucks kinda close offhand w a fixed 10x on a BDL .243 decades ago.
It worked but wasnt exactly ideal LOL

4-12x AO is on my sporter varmint rig now. Been running one for over a decade.

Deer hunting Ive run fixed and variables and for under 300 really like a 2-7x. But in the woods on movers 1x is easier. For non sporting use a 1x on the low end proly mandatory ( if not clocking an RDS with optic ). But then youre just adding weight.
And more stuff to snag depending on how/ where mounted.

Guess its all what one gets used to, but I like my stuff, across the board, to be trim and light.

Leupold 2-7x in Burris PEPR mount was just too chunky on a yote semi. Not a fan of MSR ergos really and that just made things worse.

Have come to the conclusion that NOTHIiNG does it all or is perfect.
Based on my limited exp of course.

Maybe its out there and I havent found it yet?

 

[Bamper]

It's a 1-6X and 1-4X, not 1X6 or 1X4.

There is a minimum distance that any scope can be focused. And the more magnification, the farther that distance is. You aren't going to get a scope set on 4X to focus on anything very close. A fixed 8X or 10X scope would be even worse at close range. Plus, you'd have much less field of view.

To be fair, I have no idea about that specific scope. But I've used a fair number of other 1-4X and 1-6X scopes over the years and find that magnification range very useful. 1X is incredibly fast to use with both eyes open up close. And 4X is enough magnification for shots out to at least 200 yards.

Not being perfectly clear out to the edges is annoying but doesn't really hurt anything. You only look through the center of the scope. But on a scope approaching 4 digits I'd expect better. I'd have to see it in person before I could decide to live with it or let it go.

But if it were me I'd stay on that magnification range even if I tried another brand. I'm not a fan of dot sights.

If I ran a fixed power, rather could find a decent one that is lightweight option and Im not sure there is, I would run a red dot on a 45 degree angle. An LPVO left at max magnification all the time and a 45 red dot is becoming the preferred setup among many SF guys.

On second point I can use this at close range yes. And the reticle having a single 2moa red dot in center allows for that and a big reason I got it. I have an Aimpoint micro t2 on a daniel defense that is ultra fast and this trijicon red dot is nearly identical. But an LPVO has some 'irritations'. A no magnification red dot you shoulder the rifle and red dot is super imposed within your vision. I can do the same technically yes. But the image through the scope still is slightly magnified and the image in the scope sits a tad lower than say to the left and right outside of scope. Here is best way to explain, if you had a 20ft horizontal line on a building and stood 20 ft away looking through scope. Here is how the line would look from left side of scope to inside of scope to right side of scope: ----------________------------. Everything in the scope sits about 10% lower than outside of it. Combine that with the fact it has a tad bit of magnification where I need the diopter set and the edge blur all this at 1x gives you a sense of vertigo trying to use as a 1x red dot. Now I can treat it differently and close one eye and then its better but I lose situational awareness. I feel I could train with it very effectively even with those limitations because I can still locate the red dot very fast. BUT if I could get a lightweight fixed power and run a 45 red dot IMHO that would be better setup.

Thanks for your reply!

 

[Bamper]

Running a big game scope, w parallax fixed at 100 or 150 yards......

I find that 4X is usable at 25 yards and up to 6X at 50 yards.
Inside of 25 yards you gotta drop the mag. Non Adj Obj and you just gotta live with what ya get.

Had a Trijicon Accupoint and the reticle (gold triangle) and illumination was cool. But it had distortion at outer edge.
I expected better considering the price (older model so maybe better now or good then, mine just had an issue?).
It held zero and adjusted fine.

Thread title says lightest 10X?
My fixed 10 X adjusts parallax to 25 yards and could go to 50 ft with an adapter they used to sell
( is old Leupold M8, w friction adjust ). Adapter was 50 bucks back in the day. I shudder to think what folks are asking for em now.

Proly not what the OP is asking for, but they did make stuff in 6, 8 and 10X fixed power w adj obj.
IIRC the Vari X and M8 AO stuff went to 25 yards, and closer in the EFR series. The EFR might have only been on some variables.

I dunno if the Leupold fixed 12X later runs were available in EFR (extended focal range).
That was marketed to rimfire guys but they still adjusted for farther out like other AO.

FWIW My new SWFA 12X fixed has parallax to 10 meters. It aint light weight.

I had one of the newer 3-9X EFR Freedom scopes and it had a shady band around outer edge. Dunno if a less than perfect one or obj
recess so great that was causing it. The rear eyepiece being more tubular than bell really killed the aesthetic so wouldn't look right on a nice .22 or other.

Slap one on an AR for yotes might be OK LOL

Yea as explained in my response to JMR40 if I could find an option I would def consider it! I did some googling today and Luepold has a couple FX models but only to 6x and heavier than my 18oz Trijicon.

I have the same issue your accupoint had but from my research this is an LPVO tradeoff? I only have it at 1x, after about 2x its gone. but edge distortion is not my biggest quarrel as also explained to jmr40. Thanks for responding!

 

[Bamper]

Dot sights may take getting used to.
Astigmatism may make it less than fun.
I run a reflex clocked on a rifle, 3 moa and its wicked fast.
Can shoot accurately too. But I learned long ago to trust the dot, not peek, and view things in relationship rather than fine intersect (like when using a scope).
Do like scopes better than dots, but like dots just fine (RDS- actually don't care for a dot in a scope reticle).

Didn't take me but a few range sessions to accept the RDS stuff.
Have buds that tried and tried and still don't like em.

My ol lady has astigmatism, coke bottle glasses.........and runs a TRS on her 1022 and loves it. Ive asked aboout starburst and other and she says its fine.
Likes the reflex sights too.

But then I let her look at a PA Cyclops Gen 2 prism. Now she wants me to buy her one!
They are neat but at 1X.........ya use em like a reg RDS.
Id like to try a 2x or 3X model.
One of those might be a dandy woods rifle deer optic.

In reference to RD in scope reticle thats a big reason I got this scope. Building a 308 battle rifle setup and having a quick acquisition RD was huge for me. And I can simply turn it off AND IT GETS DAYTIME BRIGHT!

 

[Bamper]

Do some/all 1-6x or 1-8x scopes have image issues due to design or component quality demands?

All my stuff is fixed or max of multiplying four times. Majority three times.

Ive not looked through the new stuff of greater.

Just wondering.....if they (scopes w higher multipliers) do it at lower end or if that maybe an issue w trying to have a 1x ar bottom?

Zeiss or Swaro have anytjing 1-6x or 1-8x and how do they look?

Ive seen fish eye in Burris compacts abd other brand/ models and they just 3 times range Honestly not been impressed w a lot of stuff over the years.
Mid tier.

Any Leica, Swaro and Zeiss ive looked through did not have a low end of 1x.
So I have no idea

I think yes its by nature of design

 

[Hookeye]

I shoot both eyes open but have a condition where my dominant eye is super dominant.
So I don't "see" what others do (like shifted line in Bampers example).
Due to my wiring issue (born this way)............I also cannot use an Armson OEG. No worky.

Sitting behing a scope rifle I can look left w my right eye and it blurs so brain turns my left eye (outside the scope) to dominant.
Its like flicking back and forth (without closing an eye) and I did it all the time as a kid, heck I didn't know better. 20/10 vision too.

Those were the good old days.

Glasses now, and switching back and forth just a couple times brings on a dull headache and eye fatigue.

Anyway, my battle rig is a FrankenFAL. So am hosed on any dual purpose/sensible optics mount.
Changed to A2 style DSA rear and that makes it doable for close n fast.

May put a section of rail on a dustcover and try an open RDS. But it will screw up iron usage. BLAH!

 

[Hookeye]

What exit pupil are you wanting?

Maybe too heavy

https://www.kaps-optik.de/en/sport-optics/rifle-scopes/classic-line/classic-line-8-x-56.html?Line=

 

[Bamper]

2

What exit pupil are you wanting?

Maybe too heavy

https://www.kaps-optik.de/en/sport-optics/rifle-scopes/classic-line/classic-line-8-x-56.html?Line=

20.81 Oz not too bad. Not very picky on the exit pupil I think. I admit I am not super experienced with diff kinds. I should go to sportsmens and look around.

Kaps has a 2.5x10x50 thats even a hair lighter at 20.5oz

The Credo 2.5x15x42 is 22oz.

My Credo 1x6 is 18.9oz

There is a Luepold 6x42 FXII that is 15oz.

At 6x I can see a good maybe 600yards? There is a power pole I estimate 500yards and could tell you if a little sparrow was sitting on top of it. Def good detail far out. And both eyes open can focus on scope sight mainly.

I am going to prophesy the 6,8,10 fixed power ultra lightweight options will come out in next 4-6 years with the demand on scope with 45 red dot.

For me if I could get a fixed power around 12oz or Acog weight with a 45 degree red dot and be around 15-16oz OVERALL that would be love love love

 

[Bamper]

Oh wow Trijicon Accupoint TR-20 3-9x40 is 13.4oz! I could swap my 1x6 credo and get 830 credit and those TR-20 run about 680. Thats a start on a RDS too.

This is very intriguing!

tritium, still trijicon, 9x instead of 6x, 5.5oz lighter, $150 cheaper, 40mm exit pupil over 24mm.

Someone please critique if I'm off base. this is an Aero Precision M5 308 AR10 16" barrel build setup like battle rifle. so weight is paramount. cqb ability needed hence 45 RDS, its a 308 so a 13.4 oz Trijicon scope with 9x with 40mm lens gives that all day and its tritium! no battery worry. Cloud defensive light and CGS Hyperion k titanium suppressor....

 

[SharpDog]

I took a good look at the Credo but the weight put me off. I ended up getting a Vortex Razor Gen III for $2100 all in from Optics Planet. Runs around 4 oz lighter with higher power and better glass.

They put it on back order but they came through. One happy camper. You can google for OP coupons and guaranteed to find at least a 5% coupon. Looks like it went up considerably in price:

https://vortexoptics.com/vortex-razor-hd-gen-iii-1-10x24-riflescope.html

https://www.opticsplanet.com/vortex-razor-hd-gen-iii-1-10x24-riflescope.html

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1536852-REG/vortex_rzr_11001_1_10x24_razor_gen_iii.html/?c3api=4680,,Optics-Vortex,b&msclkid=b9dcdefadc68129d1406bc364baebcbd





Tip: You can save an extra couple of oz. with a ScalarWorks QD self-leveling mount and protect your expensive optics as well.

 

[Bamper]

I took a good look at the Credo but the weight put me off. I ended up getting a Vortex Razor Gen III for $2100 all in from Optics Planet. Runs around 4 oz lighter with higher power and better glass.

They put it on back order but they came through. One happy camper. You can google for OP coupons and guaranteed to find at least a 5% coupon. Looks like it went up considerably in price:

https://vortexoptics.com/vortex-razor-hd-gen-iii-1-10x24-riflescope.html

https://www.opticsplanet.com/vortex-razor-hd-gen-iii-1-10x24-riflescope.html

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1536852-REG/vortex_rzr_11001_1_10x24_razor_gen_iii.html/?c3api=4680,,Optics-Vortex,b&msclkid=b9dcdefadc68129d1406bc364baebcbd





Tip: You can save an extra couple of oz. with a ScalarWorks QD self-leveling mount and protect your expensive optics as well.

Thanks for all the info I'll take a look! You must have been looking at the Credo 1x8? That one is a beast if so lol. My 1x6 is 18.9oz but im just not sold on it and actually just started RMA via optics planet chat. I'm gonna take a HARD look at the 3x9x40 TR-20 I mentioned above at 13.4 oz she is a petite girl! add RDS on 45 I'll be around 18oz overall! can even QD mount the scope too for strictly cqb

 

[Bamper]

Here is MAIN issue. I could deal with some edge fuzz, fishbowl. But when the scope image at 1x is not aligned with my eyes seeing the real world its very disorienting. I could train to use it but why? There are better 1x6 or other LPVO's out there I hope, muy LPVO exp is very minimal. But I'm about set on the Trijicon TR-20 accupoint 3-9x40 with a Trijicon RMR on a arisaka or trex arms offset mount. Both of those mounts dont cant ALL THE WAY to a 45 degree. I just need to make sure the 40 mm objective on the tr-20 wont impede to red dot window. I doubt it, we are going from a 24mm to a 40mm. divide that in two we have a total of 8mm impeding one way over the 24mm. make sense lol?

 

[TonyAngel]

Based on your description of how you setup your diopter, you're not doing it right. I usually do my initial diopter setting at maximum magnification looking at the sky. Don't just sit there and stare through the scope while you do this. If you do, your eyes will try to compensate and will lead you to a bad setting. I'd say, look through the scope no longer than 3 seconds at a time. What you're focusing at this point is the reticle. Focus it so that your reticle is crystal clear. After doing that, then set it on 1X and do the same thing with something about 7 yards away. You'll find a happy medium.

Based on research I've done, and personal experience, it seems that the higher the upper magnification range, the worse 1X is. I saw your post on my thread and there I mentioned how good my Steiner P4xi is at 1X. It's far better than the Credo HX. Still, it's an optic. There is some fisheye, but not much at all. Honestly, I set my diopter as described above and I just shoot it. That pic you have above tells me that your diopter isn't set correctly. Even my Credo HX isn't that bad. How far are you from the fence? How is it if you go a little farther out?

 

[Bamper]

Based on your description of how you setup your diopter, you're not doing it right. I usually do my initial diopter setting at maximum magnification looking at the sky. Don't just sit there and stare through the scope while you do this. If you do, your eyes will try to compensate and will lead you to a bad setting. I'd say, look through the scope no longer than 3 seconds at a time. What you're focusing at this point is the reticle. Focus it so that your reticle is crystal clear. After doing that, then set it on 1X and do the same thing with something about 7 yards away. You'll find a happy medium.

Based on research I've done, and personal experience, it seems that the higher the upper magnification range, the worse 1X is. I saw your post on my thread and there I mentioned how good my Steiner P4xi is at 1X. It's far better than the Credo HX. Still, it's an optic. There is some fisheye, but not much at all. Honestly, I set my diopter as described above and I just shoot it. That pic you have above tells me that your diopter isn't set correctly. Even my Credo HX isn't that bad. How far are you from the fence? How is it if you go a little farther out?

Thanks for the post

I actually dropped it to UPS last night for return to Optics Planet. I cannot justify the 1x as useful IMHO. The diopter setting I followed supersetCA Youtube channels instructions. focus on 7 yard target, adjust best possible, go 6x do the same, go back to 1x and slightly tweak if needed. But I also found 5-6 other techniques online and played with it for a MONTH lol. I found the best setting but as pictured above the in scope view is lower than out of scope view. That IS NOT MAGNIFICATION or anything else. I even contacted Trijicon and they said this is the nature of an LPVO. It's funny though because reviews online have the in scope view a tad higher and not lower like mine. I think tad higher would be better but still how can you use a 1x optic if its distorted? Now yes I could train with it and locate the red dot super imposed on my vision but why compromise if I can toss a RDS on an offset and have a real RD?

That pic was about 12 yards from the fence. And yes its EXACTLY the same no matter the diopter setting. Seriously the in scope vision was always lower about 10-12% than peripheral vision. That is not a diopter setting I promise. I could have taken more pics to show this. But no matter the many times I tweaked the diopter setting in scope view was always 10-12% lower.

That pic was one full rotation and a half. The +- was facing to 3pm after one full rotation.