M1 Carbine Reloading

[YellowLab]

Every (and I mean EVERY) reference has 1.680 as the COAL for .30 Carbine with 14Gr H110.

Thats nice, but my chamber is more like 1.350. When I set the bullets I am for 1.300.

Since I am WWWAAAAYYYY shorter than published numbers who can I believe? The gun shoot the 'small OAL' fine... only when I load to published OAL do I get jammed bullets (bolt won't close).

Primers look good, fired cases look good. Just wondering why such a large disparity.

 

[Roadkill]

I don't know. I've encountered several OAL discrepancies reloading for milsurps. I have located through the years original milsurp ammo and set the oal to what they were cranking out when the guns were made. I use a 1944 steel cased for my M1 carbine, a 1944 Rock Island Armory for 30.06s, 1941 9mm for those, and a 1944 Winchester for .45s. Since then they all have functioned flawlessly.

rk

 

[YellowLab]

Wonder is its a MilSpec vs SAAMI thing like .223/5.56 and .308/NATO 7.62

 

[Grump]

Wonder is its a MilSpec vs SAAMI thing like .223/5.56 and .308/NATO 7.62

Doubt it. That round was out in the military for YEARS before anyone loaded commercial rounds. .308/7.62 was Winchester wanting to be first and coming out with theirs BEFORE the military did their thing. The only difference in .223 vs. 5.56 is the length of the throat for M193 bullets (no one has ever shown me anything definitive on M855 throats!), and I have no idea how that one came about.

 

[Draven32]

Isn't a third of an inch a very significant difference???

 

[superhornet]

Yellowlab---what kind of carbine are you shooting. Is it an aftermarket ?? The data you give is way out of line with establish chambers for the M1 carbine...the cartridge case itself is 1.290 inches long. You say your OAL is 1.300 ?? The minimum OAL for this cartridge is set at 1.625 inches. Thus, you must be seating the bullet very deep to get the rifle to function. Bear with me----what is the actual OAL of the loaded round you reload....???

 

[YellowLab]

I originally set the OAL for 1.680. But the bolt would not close. After I opened the bolt the bullet was pulled from the cartridge, stuck in the barrel. These bullets were also crimped with a lee FCD.

I made a cartridge with no taper crimp or FCD crimp, at 1.680 and closed the bolt, extracted the round and measured the OAL.

Is that not the proper way to get a rough OAL? I am not gonna buy a tool.

The barrel is a 1943 dated and stamped Carbine barrel. Throughly cleaned.

The RCBS bullet seater I use does bounce around... I get .005 variences that do not show up in any other die. I get reliable bolt lock up with 1.350. At 1.40 or greater the bolt will not lock up and I have to slap the bolt closed.

I am using 110gr RN .30cal bullets FMJ, once shot brass.

 

[superhornet]

The way I see it is that you must be seating the bullet very deeply....The case is only 32.7mm long. You say your OAL is 1.350" which is only 34.2mm..bullet must really be deep.
How or is there any indications of high pressure. ?? SAMMI OAL for the 30M1 is 1.680 or 42mm. Minimum is 1.625 or 41mm with 110 gr bullet. I will run some tests tonight on these numbers...Have loaded thousands of rounds of carbine and never had trouble...will check OAL on the loads and on factory...Maybe that pee shooter you got is short chambered....???? Are you using a carbide die and a taper crimp???

 

[YellowLab]

I've been making a HUGE typo... this may have been some of the problem with my posts not making sense.

OAL is 1.635 not 1.350 my notes were not clear.

So I have to set back to 1.635 vs 1.680.

One cart I pulled at randon that chambers OK:

OAL 1.637
Brass 1.284
Diameter .329

I double checked these numbers to make sure I was not messing them up again.

If I measure a cartridge that sticks, after I get it out of the chamber it will measure in excess of 1.640. Cannot be sure of start length because I don;t measure before chambered. Thats why I have been setting back to 1.635

 

[Grump]

Well, I'd just load 'em and enjoy. .045 is no big deal in OAL, IME. Your carbine may have been chambered a bit short in the wartime production rush.

Numbers DO make a difference now, don't they?

 

[superhornet]

Yellowlab-----hate to say it, but yes numbers don't lie...you are loading proper OAL with the 1.635 or 41mm being the Min OAL. So the bottom line ?? You really do not have a problem....

 

[YellowLab]

But the manuals say that for H110 OAL is 1.680

Not till I get into slower powders do they go as low a 1.620.

I may be compressing the load, but my main concern is the bolt not locking up.

 

[superhornet]

1.680 or 42.67mm is the max. Minimum recommended is 1.625 or 41.275 mm. If you are getting good results at 1.625 I do not see a problem ??? If this min OAL not working, then only thing I can think of is chamber parameter not within specs . I have loaded thousands of rounds of carbine at 41.2 mm and never a problem.

 

[YellowLab]

Thanks for double checking my work.

 

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Have you had this rifle headspaced? New barrels when installed need to be chambered. I'd recommend you have the headspace checked and the rifle headspaced before you shoot it.

Dave

 

[Sunray]

OAL has nothing to do with the powder. OAL is the loaded round with the bullet. The powder doesn't matter. The bullet wrong can. A compressed load means that the bullet pushes the powder down, compressing the powder. It's not bad if the manual says it's compressed.
Loading .30 carbine is no big deal. Case lengths must be equal as it headspaces on the case mouth. Check that. Minimum length is 1.290". Trim to 1.286", if required. Carbide sizing die set.
Prime with regular small rifle primers. Measure the powder charge with a scale and charge the cases, carefully. Assuming the cases have been belled a wee bit. (Just enough to get the bullet into the case mouth.) put the bullet in and seat it. The seating plug can and must be adjusted for the proper bullet seating depth too.
All this assumes you've set up the dies properly. The shell holder should just kiss the bottom of the die when the ram is up all the way.

 

[YellowLab]

The powder has everything to do with the bullet if the case is to full and you are compressing a load to get OAL when not rated for compressed loads.

I've looked at manufacturers web sites and loading manuals and I am in spec wrt case length, powder, bullet.

Barrel is not new (1943 dated and previous owner put a few 100 through it before he sold it). He did not mention any issues with chambering/bolt locking up.

My cases appear to be .005 shorter than trim to, but they are also once fired factory brass. And the bolt is farther than .005 from lockup.

 

[YellowLab]

Frontier bullets suck?

Seems that someone started another thread about thier reloads not chambering. They also use Frontier bullets.

Do Frontier bullets just suck?

Anyone else have issues with them?