Making my own "fighting revolver"

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I Love 3 inch N Frames for carry. I just Picked up a M25-14 Lew Horton in 45 acp. Its going to get a set of Decelarator grips. If you want more power in the M25/625 you can always load it wit 45 Super.

I have a 629-4 Trail Boss with a factory Magnaport. It is not my night stand gun becase of the porting but It is very resonable in the recoil department. I added a set of S&W 500 monogrips to it (as well as a set of decelerators for when i want to carry it) I am a hefty guy at 6 feet 225 pounds of GYM and Burgers.
 
If you are looking for 45 ACP preformance, rather than cut the cylinder for moonclip and 44 mag, why not just get a 45ACP revolver and shorten the barrel?

Because I wish to retain the capability to push a 300 grain bullet at a thousand fps or more if I choose. This gun is to be a fighting revolver, made to go anywhere I do, and take anything that I may encounter, including hooved and clawed animals. Besides, if I wanted a .45ACP, I'd carry one of the 3 .45s I already own. :D That would be too easy.
 
Well then I guess you can pick a fight with a bigger hombre then. :D

I'd be worried about creating bowed or blown out brass with a moon clip conversion and nuclear handloads.
 
Ruger SP101 anyone?

Or.......

How 'bout some of a flavor of the newer S&W Thunder Ranch models?
 
HiWayMan,

First, that 200gr Blazer GDHP, and the GA Arms brass loaded equivalent and my homebrew with that same Speer #4427 bullet over 5.7gr Titegroup, are all nearly identical in their ballistics. I've chrono-ed them from 805 fps from my 2.5" 296 to 882 fps from my now gone 6.5" 24. I did measure a 947 fps with them - from my now gone Henry 'Big Boy' levergun (20" barrel). The bullet was designed to open by 800 fps - and is best below 1,000 fps. The work you mention would cost a fortune... maybe a 296 would be a better choice? I've had one for over four years... and, while pocketable in a big pocket, with it's standard boot grips and those Blazers, it'll say 'Howdy!' to your wrist when you shoot it.

v.g.,

I concur - my home/personal defense ammo is the only commercial c.f. ammo I keep on hand. I keep 158gr LHPSWC +P's for .38/.357M; 200gr Blazer GDHP's in .44 Special for .44 Spec/Magnum; and .45 Colt 250gr Speer GDHP for my 625MG (That #4484 250gr GDHP is available in .45 Colt brass from Speer.).

I highly recommend the Hogue .500 Magnum grip, a $35 accessory available only from S&W Accessories (Check website - or 800#). One size fits all - K/L, N, & X-frames, and the padded backstrap makes my 4" 629, like yours pictured, a real .44 Magnum, taming the recoil nicely. It does nothing for muzzle rise, of course, but I can live with that. Besides, I shoot very few real .44M's. Check the feel of any .460/.500 Magnum's grip at a dealer's - they all use that grip. My 6"-er, which looks just like the 4" - except the additional 2" barrel - also sports them, while everything else sports wood. Oops... the 4" .32 H&RM SP101 I just got has Hogue rubber on it... can't quite rationalize another $76 for wood there - yet. Probably not a great 'combat' revolver choice, anyway!

Stainz
 
... meaning zombie bears, were-rhinos etc.

300 gr Hornady XTP + 21.5 gr H110 and a crimp that won't allow setback.
 

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SniperX is that a 3" 629, or the elusive 3" 66? I can't tell from the picture. It's my eyes though, not your photo. Thanks.
 
Do parts interchange?

Does anyone know if the cylinder, barrel interchange between the 325 and 625 family of N frames?
I handled a 325 the other week and it was to light for my taste.
To continue with the fighting revolver idea I'd like to have A volver with the weight of about 26 ounces. Same as a Colt Commander.
I'm thinking a steel frame, light weight cylinder, and a four inch barrel.
I'd heard talk that the light weight cylinder holds up better then steel when lots of DA shooting is done, due to the light weight puts less stress on the bolt recess cuts on th cylinder. Anyone else here this rumour?
I know my old M-27 and M-29 both developed A burr on the bolt notches when lots of DA firing was done. Rotational weight is pretty high in N frames.
 
(I've posted a version of this elsewhere, but what the heck, it's my content)

I love the idea of the combat revolver. And I agree with the choice of the .44 since it allows for a broad spectrum of power options. Use the light loads in an urban setting where quick recovery is more important. Pick the heavy hitting monster loads when your travels take you to the land of large carnivores.

Ultimately, I blame Hal Swiggett for my love of this style revolver.

The reason for this is an otherwise unremarkable review he wrote for the Rossi .44 Special revolver in the November, 1992 issue of “Gun World”. While Hal liked the little snub, that wasn’t what really affected me. He compared the new gun with several custom pieces he owned, including a “Fitzed” 1917 S&W and a Jovino-modified Astra .44 Magnum that he called “The Terminator” (no doubt sending Mas Ayoob into a swoon of liability panic). I REALLY liked those custom bulldogs.

As he was summing up his feelings, he wrote:

“Sooner or later, all thinking people get back to basics. Basic handguns were revolvers.”

Except for the past-tense of that last sentence, I think he really hit the mark. Of course, in those pre-Brady days, revolvers were playing a sad second-fiddle to the Wundernine Wars as all the big manufacturers tried to market their latest and greatest autos to the police and general buying public. I doubt many people paid much attention to the idle musings of Hal.

I did. And I conceived of the two revolvers you see here. It has taken many years and much work to get to this point, but I am pretty happy with the results.

First: The Nightstand Gun

This one started as a Model 29-4. This was one of those “Gun of the Week” specials that S&W was running off during the early 90’s. 3” barrel with full underlug and an unfluted cylinder give this piece both visual and actual heft. I actually have two, only a few serial numbers apart. One remains unmolested; the other was modified as follows:

* From Weigand Combat
o “Tame the Beast” barrel porting
o Double action only conversion
o Bobbed hammer
o Smoothed and polished the wide target trigger
o Action job (smooooooth!)

* From Tarnhelm Supply Company
o Magna-Trigger Conversion

* From Accurate Plating & Weaponry
o Matte Hard Chome


I had this work done over the period of several years. The Weigand mods were the first and really changed the nature of the piece. Recoil, while still stout, seems much reduced, no doubt attributable to the almost complete elimination of muzzle flip. Unfortunately, this is paid for by significant muzzle blast and flash. In a close encounter, the blast will be formidable.

The Magna-Trigger was added after my children were born. I wanted to make it as difficult as possible for there to be a tragedy involving unauthorized use with this gun. During the day, the revolver and ring are locked in the safe. At bedtime, they come out. There is only one ring, and it resides on my hand. Besides protecting my children from themselves, it effectively renders the gun inoperable for any intruder. That just might give me a momentary advantage in a confrontation. As a side note, my children don't require this level of protection now, but at the time, it seemed prudent.

I lived in South Carolina, so hard chrome was a desirable choice. I wish I had opted for the brushed finish rather than the matte. I had a 1911 pattern pistol done in brushed at the same time and I find it much more attractive. Your preferences may vary. I like the Hogue monogrips. I got these from a sale bin at a Pittsburgh gun shop. I’m not sure what the wood is. The night sights are from Meprolight.


Seen here with its unmodified sibling:


44projectgenesis.jpg



From the front:


44weigandfrontright.jpg





From the rear:


44weigandrearright.jpg





Second: The Trail Gun

Around 1994, S&W issued a 3” Model 629-4 they called the Backpacker. I found a gently used (the apocryphal “less than a box through it” sale) one for sale at a Virginia Beach gun show and salted it away for future use. Fast forward a dozen years, and I now live in Idaho and have a need for an easily carried and powerful revolver for my hunting and fishing trips into bear country. I could have chosen to modify the other Model 29, but I decided the 629 was a better candidate for what I had in mind.

I decided to place an order with the folks at Cylinder & Slide, over in Nebraska. After spending an inordinate amount of time looking at the wide array of options offered for S&W revolvers, I chose the following modifications:

* Recrown Barrel
* Ball Detent for Crane
* Chamfer/Polish cylinder
* Action Job (2.75# single / 9# double)
* Smooth/Radius/Polish trigger
* Radius/Bevel exterior sufaces
* Bead blast
* Install and regulate Extreme Duty Fixed Sights (the principal reason I chose C&S for this work)

Chamferred cylinders:


44candscylinder.jpg





Ball detent on the crane:


44candsballdetent.jpg





The competed gun, with Ahrends grips in Cocobolo (not the best fit, unfortunately):


44cands.jpg




Here's a shot of the two from the working end:


44muzzles.jpg




And here from the operator's perspective:


44projectsrear.jpg


I have a Milt Sparks PMK for the 629 and it really makes carrying a breeze. It is a very comfortable holster.

Rick
 
For me at least N frames are out because they require a bigger paw than I have.

The K frame S&Ws or the old Ruger "Sixes" in the flavor of your choice do the job very, very nicely. The Smiths are more elegant and sophisticated, but the Rugers are invulnerable to just about anything short of a meteor strike. One of my favorites is a smooth 4" stainless Service Six .357 polished to a high gloss and Hogue pebble finish nylon stocks.

Everything you need and nothing you don't. (What a concept...)
 
I posted a month or so ago a poll asking for suggestions on which 2 gun rig to take to a Jim Cirullo course to get some 'retro' revolver training. My thoughts were either my much modified Cylinder and slide 1917 Colt .45acp right and a Colt Detective Special left in a Saguaro Leather custom floral tooled rig or a Python 6 right and a Python 2.5" left were also considered. I also threw out a couple K frame S&Ws as I know they will hold up to the 3 months of pre training I am doing, which probably would batter the Colts.
I was very surprised to see overwhelmingly the S&W K frames were recommended. To that end I will be using 2 4" K frame .38s , both 5 screws. A model 15 Combat Masterpiece right and a 4" pencil barrel Model 10 left. Not wanting to spend money on a lark, I found on e bay a like new police duty Milt Sparks belt and a left and right like new black basket weave Milt Sparks Police holsters from some dept in Ga. . I didn't know Milt Sparks made a Police Duty line for dept.s. I paid $15 per holster and $8 for the belt , all which match.:D
I bought for $18 apiece two new/old stock double HKS speed loader pouches with 4 10A speed loaders. I got an old black police Mini Mag flashlight belt holder for my Surefire Executive defender (no vintage Mini Mag light-sorry) . I bought 12 A-Zoom .38 spl dummy rounds and every night am making 50 draws from each holster with a simulated speed load on the right side. I really don't know how to use the sppedloader one handed on the left side- Jim will have to show me!:cool: I am having to put service grips on the Model 15 as the speedloader won't clear the old Target grips, I am using Tyler grip adapters on both guns. I am taking both guns to the range this weekend. I hope the UMC Ball 130 grain ammo (works slick in speed loaders!)I bought 2000 rounds of cheap, will hit close on the pencil barrel. I can move the Model 15 sights.
When I get a chance I'll take a picture of my "fighting revolvers" ;)
 
Fighting Pistol

Jim Cirullo, Knows what he's about if he's reccomending the K-Frame Smiths. They were the finest fighting gun's ever made. Change the grips and you have the equlivant of any "today's" revolvers with several hundred dollars custom work. And you'll still end up with a lesser product. I know I've owned well over 50 handguns and that might be a hundred or more. I've always got 3-4 around and trade quite a bit. Nothing that's ever passed through my hands beats the total package of the K-frames for actual carry, and use. The Model 19, 2 1/2 or 3" barrel, early model pinned and recessed are incredibly accurate, versatile, reliable, perfect in balance, and precision made. True pisteleros input made that gun. Just my opinion but it's real, it's not read from a gun rag. It comes from actually owning and shooting the guns.
 
Couple guys have mentioned HKS speedlaoders. I'm surprised nobdy has so far mentioned that Safariland speedloaders are quicker to use. I used to use the HKS, but after trying the Safariland, switched over and never looked back.

Had several HKS wear, and lock up.


"I am having to put service grips on the Model 15 as the speedloader won't clear the old Target grips,..."

If your grips don't clear the loaders, why not modify the grips?




A 4" 29 or 629 is an excellent general purpose gun, as our original poster indicated. Much more flexible for out in the hills and all around use than smaller calibers. Load options cover a lot of ground. The mountain gun with the skinny barrel helps with the weight, at the expense of some recoil. I believe I'd rather have the 4" barrel in standard or MG weight than a shorter barrel. In a good holster the 4" guns are easy to carry all day.
 
rbmcmjr, i really like that 629 backpacker you got there. i almost bought a backpacker at the last gunshow but found a deal on a no dash 696 i couldnt pass up. i am considering having my 696 customized similarly.

btw, where in idaho are you? (you can prolly guess where i live)

to the original poster, the 696 does a good job fulfilling my personal concept of a big bore 'fighting' revolver. i find N frames too large for cc but the L frames are easy to cc under many conditions (but not all). i intend to use the 696 as my cc piece occasionally but i think it will mostly be a range/field piece. i cc my 3" m60 most of the time.

steve
 
Well, the decision has been made regarding the base gun for this work, minor though it may be. I went to the local fun show today looking for a 4 inch 629 classic the begin work on, but somehow found myself walking out with a S&W 28-2 instead. It appears work will go forward with my 629-6.

Regarding the speedloaders, I'm still convinced that the Safariland is better than my HKS, but moonclips beat them both. We shall soon (I hope!) see what is in store for this work in progress.
 
What I wouldn't have given for the wealth of choices in a starting point for this kind of project forty years ago!

My personal solution ended up as having a nice old S&W 1917's barrel cut down to 2 1/2", a new front sight fabricated and regulated for 230 gr. HB, and custom Herrett's stocks. Went to Armolloy for refinishing, and that was that. It's worked out just dandy.

What I really wanted was a CCW along the lines of a somewhat updated "Fitz Special", but couldn't get a comparable New Service or Colt 1917 and do the mods for anywhere near enough the same money.

It would've been a lot cheaper in today's dollars to just get a new 22-4, pick a load, regulate the sights and send it to Robar for NP3.
 
Some good info here. Jim Cirillo is the real deal; did some very heavy duty stuff with just an old-shoe Model 10 S&W which ought to mean something. Met the man down at Glynco in 1981 and spent a very profitable couple of hours with him.

The Safariland Comp II speedloaders are far superior to the HKS; quicker, easier to use, reliable, tough. I have a couple coming up on 20 years old that have been thrown around a lot as practice units and they still work just fine. HKS's are usually on sale; Safarilands are not.
 
Safariland speedloaders are great. Assuming, of course, you have a six-shot medium framed .357. While this covers the bulk of revolvers out there I think, those with .44s, .45s, seven shooters, etc. are kind of left in the cold. At least HKS makes loaders for nearly every conceivable type of gun.

I've been emailing S&W trying to get them to make their own speedloaders that are better than HKS. Why not? They make everything else, including handcuffs and bicycles...
 
I sold my 2 double HKS speed loader pouchs with 10a HKS loaders this afternoon at the range for $25 each ($50) I ordered a Safariland 333 with 3 comp III loaders for $90 shipped. I did NOT like twisting the HKS button that much, and my Python comp 1 speedloaders reguire the gun to be tilted down whereas the comp III shove them in, a better deal under pressure and I don't want to hold up the line!:) This with a pocket full of loose rounds to 'top off' ought to do it. BTW the Model 15 was easily adjusted to shoot thise 130 grain ball rounds into little bitty 15 yard groups in a 1/2 scale silo's head, DA of course. It only has a Power Custom tapered mainspring to get that nice 6lb. DA!;) what a joy to use my old retired safe queen! The Model 10-2, however hits 2" low and left at 15 yards with the load. I have to decide to monkey with the rear notch ( it's a little tight anyway)or use my Model 19 2.5" in the left holster , which is a 4" holster but would work (I'm anal!:eek: ). Reloading is gonna be a trip for this course. I am gonna switch back to a .45 Auto -Hi Cap, with Awerbuck after I go with the Cirullo portion. Louis would have some choice comments with me fumbling to stay 'topped up' and I don't want to drop dozens and dozens of unexpended rounds to do so with speed loaders :rolleyes:
 
Smith & Wesson performance center offers a ported 3" 629 in .44mag. Sounds exactly like what you want, sans moonclips.
 
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