Man wants his $400K back from the FBI

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Funny you should mention "1968". Firearms wise, that year was the "big" start of the downward slide. Funny how the Gun Control ACT of 68 was almost verbatim of the German Gun Control Act of 38, since we're talking about the scary "Geeerrrrmans" Tommy. :)

How much better off are we now (police state wise) then we were then?
 
Jim said:

I did note the comment that few who talk about a police state have actually lived in one.
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I have lived under a military dictatorship...Chile. I was pretty ugly. God bless these united states, even inspite of their imperfections.

Doc2005
 
Brigandage

Oh my God, how the times have changed...
Or have they,, the Government is just more up front on their stealing now.
I have a friend who got caught with a duffel bag full of cash and a handgun.They impounded his car, confiscated his weapon, and locked him up. Well they ran wants and warrants on him, and had to let him go.
He got his car back, He got his weapon back, They kept his loot. and got away with it.

Yes with a badge and the government behind you, you too can have an exciting career in piracy.
 
sounds like if you have a life savings like that it should be buried in the yard, or atleast hid better. Money in a safe is a bad idea, might as well have a sign on it saying "full of Money". I would rather have burned it all then let them get it, if it was me.

I am more worried about the police stealing my stuff than anyone else. If someone else steals your stuff at least you can call the police. Who do you call when the police are the ones doing the stealing?

A lesson learned is it is illegal to have large amounts of cash.
 
I don't care if this guy IS a drug dealer that made every dime of the $400k selling poison laced crack and kiddie porn to school children. If they can't prove him guilty in a court of law (and apparently they aren't even going to try) they need to give the money back.

Our criminal justice system was built on the idea of Innocent until proven guilty. If they prove he's guilty of drug dealing than fine, take every penny and throw the guy in jail, but until then keeping his money is theft ... the kind of theft that we killed redcoats to stop.

Its a doubly bad trick since in order to fight the system to get his money back he needs money upfront to hire a lawyer.


King George is looking up from hell and laughing his backside off.
 
Yes with a badge and the government behind you, you too can have an exciting career in piracy.
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But it is for the people. That money and property will be used to pay police officers and entrap more people making our world a better place! It is not like that stolen money won't go to a cause that is better than taking care of some old man in retirement. :rolleyes:

This is done all the time. Many agencies view it as a prime source of extra income and seek it out accordingly.
 
Drug War

The Drug War isn't any better than prohibition was, except that it's made the government as corrupt as the dope dealers. If you consider yourself a conservative sort, but you support the "drug war" it might be time to give it a little more thinking.

The LEOs and government decided that it was worth burning their reputation to do this kind of thing. I don't think its worth it, but they do. This WASN'T a law lobbied for by some citizens group- this was driven by law enforcement from the get-go and they got it.
 
Points are granted about the liberal use of confiscation laws, however some really stupid things were done on the homeowner's part.

1. Marijuana is illegal. Pain management my rear end. There are a number of natural and synthetic cannabis drugs that are legal by prescription as well as other drugs available for pain relief.

2. Keeping $400K cash in a safe at home is monumentally stupid. Even the more conservative retirement funds are paying nearly 10 percent annual interest or better and far better secured than in a safe gathering dust.

Add keeping this much cash laying around with marijuana, knowing how forfeit hungry the government is? STUPID STUPID STUPID

3. HD is good, but understand that when this happens the police will be involved and in your home gathering evidence.

Having Ganja in your house? STUPID. Leaving Ganja laying around where the cops can see it? STUPID STUPID. Killing a guy in your home (justifiably) with weed in plain sight AND $400K in cash? There aren't enough words to describe the stupidity.

Some of you crying police state and rallying for revolution have no clue what a police state and revolution really are.
 
jaholder,

I agree with you on the STUPID factor. And something smells. Doesn't mean we have to be happy about the lack of due process around forfeiture.
 
lachoochee:

Noooo!!!! :banghead: It's happened, I actually agree with Tecum###!! :uhoh:
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Get a grip on yourself, man! Don't you realize what you are saying? You are having a meltdown.

Call a friend to help you through this episode instead of embarrassing yourself in public. It is not a pretty sight and the rest of us should not be forced to watch.
 
I have lived under a military dictatorship...Chile. I was pretty ugly. God bless these united states, even inspite of their imperfections.

Doc2005
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+1.

1980 - 1997. Poland. First 10 years of my life behind the iron courtain. Martial Law. Etc.

God Bless The USA !!!
 
"Stupidity" is not a crime.

And, for those who asked, the way this "civil forfeiture" BS passes muster is that the gooberment charges the property with a crime. Yes, I'm serious--there are actually cases along the lines of "State of Oklahoma vs. $439,331 in US Currency," "State of Florida vs. 2007 Mercedes-Benz SL600," etc. It's pretty disturbing.
 
Actually those German gun laws of '38 look pretty good. Certainly more liberal than the German gun laws of ten years earlier. They even lowered the age limit from 20 to 18 and increased the length of the carry permits. John

Gun restricton laws only applied to handguns, not to long guns or ammunition.

Writes Prof. Bernard Harcourt of the University of Chicago, "The 1938 revisions completely deregulated the acquisition and transfer of rifles and shotguns, as well as ammunition."[4]

The groups of people who were exempt from the acquisition permit requirement expanded. Holders of annual hunting permits, government workers, and Nazi party members were no longer subject to gun ownership restrictions. Prior to the 1938 law, only officials of the central government, the states, and employees of the German Reichsbahn Railways were exempted.[5]

The age at which persons could own guns was lowered from 20 to 18.[6]

The firearms carry permit was valid for three years instead of one year.[7]
___________

I carry cash frequently, just not that much. The odds are good that somebody will steal it, so I don't put all my eggs in one basket - or pocket.
 
If you are even suspected of selling drugs the Police usually seize ALL your assets, not just your cash. If he is only suspected of using (not selling) then he should get his money back.

I think there are two lessons to be learned. Hide the pot before you invite the cops over AND don't leave half million dollars in the safe. That kind of cash needs to be in a zip lock bag and buried in the yard or under the house.

If the cops were invited over because the man was burglarized, why would they be searching his house. The guy must of left the pot out or lit up a big doobie right in front of them. If the cops don't have a search warrant and you don't want them searching your house... tell them to leave. They can come back when they have a search warrant.

Sounds very fishy to me.
 
If the cops were invited over because the man was burglarized, why would they be searching his house. The guy must of left the pot out or lit up a big doobie right in front of them. If the cops don't have a search warrant and you don't want them searching your house... tell them to leave. They can come back when they have a search warrant.

Sounds very fishy to me.
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When you shoot a burglar in your house you don't really have much of an option. They are going to come and investigate. We don't know how hidden this cash was.
 
1. Marijuana is illegal. Pain management my rear end. There are a number of natural and synthetic cannabis drugs that are legal by prescription as well as other drugs available for pain relief.
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You hear about oxycotin? Good pain reliever, but can be addictive. If the DEA catches wind of you prescribing too much of it, they'll throw you in jail. So yes, it's possible that even supposedly legal means of relief would have been beyond his reach, since few doctors would dare risk the DEA's wrath to prescribe him.

The groups of people who were exempt from the acquisition permit requirement expanded. Holders of annual hunting permits, government workers, and Nazi party members were no longer subject to gun ownership restrictions. Prior to the 1938 law, only officials of the central government, the states, and employees of the German Reichsbahn Railways were exempted.[5]
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I'll bet that Jews(or at least most of them) still had to run the hoops, eh? I'm also curious as to how this timeline compares to the establishment of the ghettos, and the rounding up. It doesn't help much of the policies were relaxed after they were in the ghettos and camps.
 
That's old news the various agencys, set up profiling, or used to before 911, at all airports bus ststions train stations interstates, etc. athey will stop you and confiscate the cash, and it is then up to you to prove it is your money and show how you earned it, and "i sold my moms house", dosen't work. It becomes a battle between your attorney and thiers.They know what towns the drugs and guns come in and out of, and these meatheads, still walk around in a fog with long hair on a regular schedule. There is a lot of cash that gets siezed and no one even asks for it back. Most of them just consider it the price of doing business.
 
Why would anyone not put that kind of money in the bank? Don't say taxes, because interest earned would more than pay for taxes. I understand many people keep emergency cash on hand but 400K is just plain crazy.

Would you leave your life savings in your house? Expecially if you have to deal with some lowlife to get "medical mj". Still I'm curious about how much weed he had. Did he grow his own? Was there more than an ounce but less than a pound?
 
1. Marijuana is illegal. Pain management my rear end. There are a number of natural and synthetic cannabis drugs that are legal by prescription as well as other drugs available for pain relief.
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A short time spent on Google running searches pretty well shows that the synthetic canabis-derived drugs are not nearly as effective as the actual thing, and I would presume that they cost far more, too.

2. Keeping $400K cash in a safe at home is monumentally stupid. Even the more conservative retirement funds are paying nearly 10 percent annual interest or better and far better secured than in a safe gathering dust.
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I agree that keeping cash as your savings isn't the brightest thing in the world, but only a hateful statist would bring that up as even a tangential justification for confiscating it all.

Add keeping this much cash laying around with marijuana, knowing how forfeit hungry the government is? STUPID STUPID STUPID
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Again, even if the man was a dealer with tremendous amounts of weed in his possession, which he wasn't, as every story I can find on this topic makes reference to "a small amount" of marijuana, is that really justification for destroying his life? I mean, really?

3. HD is good, but understand that when this happens the police will be involved and in your home gathering evidence.

Having Ganja in your house? STUPID. Leaving Ganja laying around where the cops can see it? STUPID STUPID. Killing a guy in your home (justifiably) with weed in plain sight AND $400K in cash? There aren't enough words to describe the stupidity.
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The amount of pot in Ricks' possession was so minute, evidently, that they didn't even see fit to charge him with possession. Yet despite the fact that he wasn't charged with a crime, they still decided to confiscate the life savings of he and his wife.

You're free to argue that Ricks made some stupid decisions. You may even be right. But that doesn't change the fact that every member of law enforcement who engaged in the confiscation of his money is nothing more than a vindictive bully.

Some of you crying police state and rallying for revolution have no clue what a police state and revolution really are.
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Not one word about a police state out of me. Just repitition of the facts of the case, and my commentary on the blatantly reprehensible actions of those in the justice system.
 
2. Keeping $400K cash in a safe at home is monumentally stupid. Even the more conservative retirement funds are paying nearly 10 percent annual interest or better and far better secured than in a safe gathering dust.
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Stupid, in your opinion.

People who have studied their history may well have good reason to distrust banks. Last I'd checked, the reserve requirements, the amount of actual assets banks need to keep on-hand in case depositors want some back, amounts to ONE PERCENT (10% reserve at the Fed, 10% reserve at the bank, equals effectively 1%). For every 100 people who deposited a dollar at a bank, should they all want their money back at once, only ONE would get his dollar.

Then consider that retirement funds are by NO means a place to keep assets you want liquid, and that interest on savings is a pathetic ~3%; "a bird in-hand is worth two in the bank".

On top of all that, it's HIS property. Or was. Thanks, government!
 
I haven't lived in a police state yet but give it a decade or so and we'll see if that comment can truthfully be made again.

Don't kid yourself.
Runaway government with unlimited power is a bad thing and it can only lead to one place.
And it's a place none of us want to go.
 
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