RugerGuy
Member
Anyone here see those replica BP flintlocks and percussion rifles made in India ?? I guess alot of reenactors use them. Another forum I'm on is doing a group buy and I was just wondering about the quality. Thanks.
Modern Muskets Made in India
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Macmac
Member
The ones I have held Most Frencies and Besses have had just about the right feel, and work well. Maybe the tech in India has been sort of consistant ever since.... I assisted in "proofing" a few here in NH.
I would like to know more, as to the buy, the gun the link, and what group, since I have shot with groups in New England
I would like to know more, as to the buy, the gun the link, and what group, since I have shot with groups in New England
RugerGuy
Member
http://www.middlesexvillagetrading.com/ Here's the place they are ordering from. Northeastshooters.com is the forum the group buy is originated from. I'd send you a link to the "group buy" but you have to be a member to read that section of the forum. I've heard nothing but good things about the gun shop just know nothing about the quality of the rifles themselves. I've always wanted a older shooter just for the shear fun of just shooting them. So far the group buy has 8 or 10 people ordering and it's only been going since yesterday.
scrat
Member
wow that is an excellent link. when im ready to purchase a bp rifle i think i will look there. right now im too focused on building my civil war era handguns.
GENTLEMAN OF THE CHARCOAL
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Ruger Guy, good morning. I'd sat here and listened to Fox News and drank 3 cups of coffee while I'd stared at your thread trying to decide whether or not to bother answering it.
Ruger Guy, the general rule of thumb is--if you want some good wine or cheese get it from France. If you want some good beer get it from Germany. If you want a good cigarette and Bourbon whiskey get it from the United States.
I'm a CaseXX, Kabar and Buck man for my knife steel. (although I do own a couple of Leatherman Supertools and one Hen and Rooster) BUT, it is an indisputable fact that is well documented--India, when they put their mind to it, produces some of the absolute finest knife and sword steel in the world, period. (and Pakistan isn't too far behind them) That's just a fact that cannot be argued with by anyone who has any damn sense at all.
India has produced along those lines for at least hundred's of years and maybe longer. Spain almost caught up with them one time but couldn't quite make the cut. (pardon the pun)
If India put's the care into the steel and workmanship of their muzzle loaders that they put into some of their knife and sword making, I myself can think of no legitmate reason on the face of this earth for your not purchasing one...This is just my feeling about your question but it's a feeling based on at least some knowledge...Okay...
Ruger Guy, the general rule of thumb is--if you want some good wine or cheese get it from France. If you want some good beer get it from Germany. If you want a good cigarette and Bourbon whiskey get it from the United States.
I'm a CaseXX, Kabar and Buck man for my knife steel. (although I do own a couple of Leatherman Supertools and one Hen and Rooster) BUT, it is an indisputable fact that is well documented--India, when they put their mind to it, produces some of the absolute finest knife and sword steel in the world, period. (and Pakistan isn't too far behind them) That's just a fact that cannot be argued with by anyone who has any damn sense at all.
India has produced along those lines for at least hundred's of years and maybe longer. Spain almost caught up with them one time but couldn't quite make the cut. (pardon the pun)
If India put's the care into the steel and workmanship of their muzzle loaders that they put into some of their knife and sword making, I myself can think of no legitmate reason on the face of this earth for your not purchasing one...This is just my feeling about your question but it's a feeling based on at least some knowledge...Okay...
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RugerGuy
Member
One of the members of the forum putting on the group buy posted a couple links regarding history of some of these muskets. India DID indeed make some of them way back when they were new. One of the posters in the thread wouldn't order one when he found out they were made in India because he was worried about the quality. I ordered a 1853 Pattern 3- band Enfield .58 percussion Musket for cheap money. I figured I'd stay away from the flintlocks for now and it should be easier for me to find .58 balls compared to .69 or .75 ones. I bet a .75 is pretty impressive when you touch one off though !! The Brown Bess rifles were only another $125 but I couldn't really couldn't afford it right now. I think they will place the order next week and we should take delivery the week after. I won't have time to shoot it but I'll try posting pictures of it when I get it.
The Brown Bess rifles were only another $125 but I couldn't really couldn't afford it right now. I think they will place the order next week and we should take delivery the week after. I won't have time to shoot it but I'll try posting pictures of it when I get it.Joe Demko
Member
I guess you must be talking about wootz steel, sometimes referred to as damascus steel. While this form of steel was produced in that region, and probably still is in tiny quantities, it is extremely unlikely that anything you purchase from India or Pakistan is going to be made from wootz. It will almost certainly be made from modern factory-produced steel. Depending on who made the item you purchased, that steel might have been purchased as stock or it might be scrap steel. IOW, the smith in question may or may not even know specifically which steel he was working with. Quality of items from that region varies considerably with who made the item. Vast quantities of junk cutlery come out of India and Pakistan.
Hey RugerGuy you did realise that the Enfield's sold by Middlesex Village aren't rifled right? I mean I guess it's a good deal for a smoothbore, but I'd like mine to be rifled so I could use Minie' balls. Although I could be talking out my @$$ on that one. Can anyone confirm that you can't use Minie' balls in smoothbored rifle for me? Thanks.
RugerGuy
Member
Yes I knew it was a smoothbore. Bet it's still fun to shoot though.
OK just making sure didn't want you to find out when it arrived at your door and have to go through a whole lot of mess to get what you really wanted. I sure like their East India Brown Bess and their Baker. Wonder when they're gonna release that shotgun. I need a good 12 gauge.
Dave Markowitz
Member
I have one of the Middlesex Village French M1717 muskets. The workmanship isn't on par with say, a Pedersoli, but it's not bad. The lock is fast and the frizzen throws a good shower of sparks. The one thing which needs work is the trigger, it's really heavy.
tkendrick
Member
Given my experience with pedersorry, that can only be a good thing.
Dave Markowitz
Member
The Pedersoli shotgun I owned and those I've handled have been very nicely made. Perhaps quality has declined recently, but Pedersoli sure used to make fine firearms.
tkendrick
Member
Yeah, the ones I own or have owned all looked fantastic. The problem was the quality of materials, and or the specs for which they were manufactured.
Ever try to load for a 46/70 govt cartidge? How about a frizzen so soft that the flint is digging chunks of metal instead of sparking.
Every pedersoli I've ever handled has had problems of one kind or another, from minor things like loose screws in locks to major things like a 45/70 Sharps that was bored to .460.
They may look good, but I'll never buy another one.
Macmac
Member
Ruger Guy , Thanks for that info.. I am not in a buying mod as of late or my wallet isn't anyway.
OUCH yoiu don't want to be buying ammo for anything over .54 cal either. About that calibur things get real pricey. That .54 and under for the buck you spend you get 100 pices counts, but over that and you get 25 in my experience anyway.
A mold and some casting equipment will be in order soon.. I have no idea how a minie will fly from a smooth bore, but a patched round ball will shoot pretty well.
I must have it wrong in that I assumed all the guns in a group buy would be the same type of gun.. Seems like you bought what you wanted and others bought what they wanted.
I recognize the address as in Charleston NH, where guns I have held in my grubby kmits also came from as flinters. They were pretty good, better than I expected from India, and I tend to be fussy. Most re-enactors are.
25 years ago we suffered soft frizzens and for crap quaility, which seemingly has been corrected these days...
OUCH yoiu don't want to be buying ammo for anything over .54 cal either. About that calibur things get real pricey. That .54 and under for the buck you spend you get 100 pices counts, but over that and you get 25 in my experience anyway.
A mold and some casting equipment will be in order soon.. I have no idea how a minie will fly from a smooth bore, but a patched round ball will shoot pretty well.
I must have it wrong in that I assumed all the guns in a group buy would be the same type of gun.. Seems like you bought what you wanted and others bought what they wanted.
I recognize the address as in Charleston NH, where guns I have held in my grubby kmits also came from as flinters. They were pretty good, better than I expected from India, and I tend to be fussy. Most re-enactors are.
25 years ago we suffered soft frizzens and for crap quaility, which seemingly has been corrected these days...
When I surveyed the Middlesex Village site a few years ago, I remember the seller would check the guns out personally before shipping and harden the frizzens as a matter of habit. He said you could send them back any time for rehardening if necessary, IIRC.
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