Moving a known good rifle load from a single stage to a progressive press

[MCMXI]

Has anyone done this and collected enough data to give a sense of how well it worked or didn't work? I've never loaded any rifle ammunition (bottleneck) on a progressive press but now find that I can dedicate a Dillon 550B to .223 Rem/.300 Blackout. So if you've worked up a load using a single stage press and then tried to reproduce the same results on a progressive press can you provide some results, observations, thoughts etc. Thanks.

 

[Walkalong]

I haven't made the switch, but I do load "Match" .308 on my LNL. I use pre-sized, pre-primed cases so the only thing going on is seating. Works great. I believe the bit of slop/float in the o-ring/bushing set up helps let things align well. Either way, I do know that if the brass is straight, the loaded rounds come out straight as well. Since I size in one step, then hand prime, the seat bullets in another step, it's a lot like using a single stage. I have tested seating with a Forster seater on the LNL vs a Wilson hand die in an arbor press and could not measure a difference. Both using Lapua cases sized with a Redding bushing die on the LNL.

 

[Fine Figure of a Man]

223 is the only rifle round I load on a progressive. 55 grain Hornady Spire Point, 25.3gr IMR 8208 XBR, mixed brass, wolf, S&B or Winchester primers. With one of my AR's this load shoots under 1 MOA.

 

[Jeff Flannery]

plus one for only .223 on my LNL

 

[jmorris]

I have worked up loads on a single stage and then moved the production over to progressives.

How well it works out depends on what the load is.

All things equal the powder it the largest factor. If you are trickling loads using large kernel extruded powders into a .223 then want to throw them with a measure and have bridging and variance issues, they won’t be the same. Bridging will make you want to pull the hair from your head. If you are using powders that meter well like 748, TAC, or other spherical powders for .223 or H110/296, 1680 for 300 blk, the difference between the two methods is negligible.

At that point the components and dies you use are the next important. A press goes up and back down, that’s it. Many progressives have the cases riding “in” a shell plate but you mention the 550 and with that press the shell plate only moves it from one position to another and removes it from the dies.

 

[Varminterror]

The downside of loading precision ammo on a progressive, which is really what I consider the advantage of an arbor press, is the difference in dexterity for the bullet seating.

That, of course, and the fact you’re using a progressive press as a single stage.

 

[Lennyjoe]

I’m loading .223, .300 Blackout and 7.62x39 on a progressive. .308, 30-06, .243 and 6.5 Grendel stay on single stage.

 

[Laphroaig]

I've switched over my Highpower comp ammo in both .223 and 30-06 to my 550B. Can't say I notice much of a difference. In fact, one of my pet -06 loads has resulted in some nice scores for me since I've switched over.

I do still load my 300/600 .223 ammo single stage, and use my same powder measures for -06. Otherwise, I do everything including priming on the Dillon. My only advice would be to check that all primers are seated flush. My only complaint is I don;t get a lot of feel priming on the Dillon.

 

[jmorris]

These guys have both won with ammunition loaded on progressives. Mr. Tubb points out the most important thing for him to win is how to tell the difference between what makes an improvement or not.



http://www.65guys.com/precision-from-a-progressive-reloader/

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2018/02/load-winning-ammo-with-progressive-whidden-shows-how/

 

[cfullgraf]

Currently, I load 204 Ruger for prairie dogs (500-800 rounds per outing) and 300 BLK on a progressive.

I do resizing, case prep and cleaning at one time and set the cases aside for a future loading session when I need some ammunition or have good inventory of prepped cases. Currently, this is done on a single stage press but I recently obtained a Dillon trimmer to try sizing and trimming on a progressive.

I prime off the press.

I charge the case then seat the bullet. With 204 Ruger, I use an RCBS Gold Medal seating die which allows you to set the bullet in the die before raising the ram to seat it. Pricey but makes handling the small bullet easier.

As jmorris said, I use powders that meter well.

I plan to load 223 Remington on the progressive but I have not needed any new ammunition yet.

Cartridges that I do not shoot a large volume of will stay on a single stage press.

 

[JimKirk]

As JMorris said in his post .... John Widden loads championship ammo on a Dillon 650 with a special floating die head ..... I have watched him load ammo on it and check it for run out .... He also use a CoAx to develop loads .....

 

[horsemen61]

Ttrl!

 

[MCMXI]

Thanks for the all the good information here. @jmorris, your point about the powder measure is well-taken. A friend of mine back in Hawaii was a very good Service Rifle competitive shooter and he invested in some high end powder measures that could cut extruded kernels effectively since he used Varget for his match .223 Rem loads. I don't remember the make/model but they were $300 or so back in 2010. I have a couple of Redding powder measures (10X and BR-30) that I use for pistol powders but use a ChargeMaster 1500/GEM PRO for all rifle loads. I have no experience with the powder measures that come with the Dillon 550B so it looks like I'll be on a learning curve for a while. I also have no experience with TAC or 748 but if the 550 powder measures won't work well with Varget I'll need to make some changes.

I use an RCBS Gold Medal seating die which allows you to set the bullet in the die before raising the ram to seat it. Pricey but makes handling the small bullet easier.

I have a .308 Win RCBS Gold Medal seating die and you make a good point about handling small bullets. One of the things I don't like about loading .223 Rem is the small bullet and placing it in the case. I need to order a .223 Rem Gold Medal seating die for sure.

Mr. Tubb points out the most important thing for him to win is how to tell the difference between what makes an improvement or not.

Wise words indeed!.

 

[Walkalong]

All things equal the powder it the largest factor. If you are trickling loads

A good point, I was throwing and going with my .308, no trickling.

 

[Kaldor]

I do bulk runs of certain stuff, but it all revolves around what powder Im using. If its a short grained extruded like 8208 or a ball powder, Ill run it on the progressive after I develop on my single. If its a long grain like Varget then I just run it on a single as I use a CM1500 for powder drop. I do have the Hornady powder thru funnel for the top of my progressive which does work pretty well when teamed up with my LnL. However, I need to add a second CM1500 to really maximize production

 

[Laphroaig]

I use Varget in my Dillon measure. I can't remember what the +/- was when I set it up, but it wasn't enough to scare me away.

I pretty much throw charges for everything I load in bulk, and operate under the theory that if I have good solid loads that fall into a "node" then a tenth or 2 difference isn't going to matter that much.

 

[Toprudder]

I size in one step, then hand prime, the seat bullets in another step, it's a lot like using a single stage. I have tested seating with a Forster seater on the LNL vs a Wilson hand die in an arbor press and could not measure a difference.

That has been my observation. If anything, I think I get a little more consistent OAL with the Forster when I am compressing powder (Varget).

 

[Bartojc]

Not a progressive but I do load .223 on a Lee Turret. Even then it is powder drop and bullet seating w/crimp if I want.
I prep a batch 100 or 200 of brass w/primer. Then I can add powder and go rather quick on the turret. For what I'm doing it's plenty accurate.

-jeff

 

[Galil5.56]

I'm basically a plinker, but did load for my .243 Hvy varmint rig on a Dillon 550B, and can't see any difference in group sizes or consistency going from a SS to the 550B. I like turning out .308, 30/06, .303 British and .223 on the 550B, and will only/have only used ball propellant to do so. Once you get in your rhythm, dropping very consistent charges of say H335, AA2460, TAC, WW748, and H414/WW760 w/the Dillon measure is very doable. Good luck.

 

[cfullgraf]

I have a couple of Redding powder measures (10X and BR-30) that I use for pistol powders but use a ChargeMaster 1500/GEM PRO for all rifle loads. I have no experience with the powder measures that come with the Dillon 550B so it looks like I'll be on a learning curve for a while. I also have no experience with TAC or 748 but if the 550 powder measures won't work well with Varget I'll need to make some changes.

If you do not like how the Dillon powder measure performs, it is not difficult to modify either of your Redding powder measures to work with a Hornady or RCBS case activated powder measure die. For the Dillon 550, the powder measures mount in a 7/8"-14 threaded hole.

I've only used the Dillon powder measure for handgun powder charges on my Dillon SDB press and it has performed well. I also have a modified Redding 10-X and an RCBS Uniflow that I use on my other progressive presses.

 

[MCMXI]

it is not difficult to modify either of your Redding powder measures to work with a Hornady or RCBS case activated powder measure die. For the Dillon 550, the powder measures mount in a 7/8"-14 threaded hole.

I modified the 10X and BR-30 to work with Hornady case activated linkages years ago. They work great on my RCBS Piggyback II and Hornady LNL presses but I haven't done enough with the 550B to know whether or not a similar mod is doable so thanks for the confirmation that it is. I don't think I've used the Redding powder measures to drop any extruded powders yet so not sure how well they'd work for Varget. They're extremely accurate and precise for ball powder. I was loading some .454 Casull recently using the PBII and BR-30 and the 24.0gr charge weight was only varying by a couple of hundredths of a grain i.e. +/- .01 grains. I was checking with the Gem Pro scale.

 

[Whiterook808]

My Dillon measure drops H335 to within a tenth of a grain, while loading .223 on my 550b. One thing I did find is that those tall, skinny, cases need to be guided into the powder funnel or they can hit off center and cause over charges. That is not something I have had to do on any pistol cartridges, so it took me by surprise.

 

[243winxb]

Case separations when i went fron RCBS RC to Dillon RL 450. 223 Rem.

Check fl sizing from each station. Shell plate deck height problem.

 

[jmorris]

If you size too much for the chamber the case is fired in, so you have to trim the excess off and keep doing the same thing over and over, you will have a case head separation, using any kind of press.

 

[cfullgraf]

I modified the 10X and BR-30 to work with Hornady case activated linkages years ago. They work great on my RCBS Piggyback II and Hornady LNL presses but I haven't done enough with the 550B to know whether or not a similar mod is doable so thanks for the confirmation that it is.

The case activated powder measure dies systems are self contained so they will work on about any press that accepts 7/8"-14 thread dies. They do not use any of the Dillon powder measure linkages. Some adjustment of the dies will probably be necessary due to the different height of the various brands of presses.

I use my modified Redding 10-X or RCBS Uniflow on a Hornady L-N-L, RCBS Pro2000, and Dillon BL550 (basic version of the 550B). I have a die set for each press so that I just swap the powder measure from die to die.

I use the Uniflow to drop charges of Varget and H4895. It does a good job although cycling the measure gets a bit tough when it cuts a few kernels of powder. I've not loaded Varget or H4895 on a progressive yet although at some point, I'll be loading some 30-06 on either my Pro2000 or BL550.