Need help picking self-defense only knife...

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DomMega

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Thinking of buying a defensive only knife as part of my CCW rig when I move to Arizona. I've been looking at quite a few blades and have found some nice Ka-Bars, Columbia River (recommended by a Marine friend of mine), and the Smith and Wesson tactical. I think I'm in the market for a tanto point, as I like the strength of the blade for penetration, however I'm not going to pretend I know what would be the best deal.

I have a membership to the buyer's club on Cheaperthandirt.com and would like to shop there for obvious reasons but if not its not a super big deal if I can find something of extreme value and usage. Like I said this will be a self-defense only knife so I won't be opening boxes with it and will in fact be carrying it everyday out here in Cali seeing its about all we're allowed to carry. We've been a communist state for quite some time now.

Either way, anything you guys can recommend or point me to would be definitely appreciated. Thanks in advance.

-Dom
 
There have been endless discussions on defensive knives here in NFW. You can find as many recommendations as there are members (or more). From $7.00 Chicago Cutlery 3.5" paring knives to $300.00 folders. As long as you don't buy an inferior product (Smith and Wesson) it hardly matters.

What is important is whether you get any training to use that knife.
 
you didn't specify fixed or folding, or what size. cold steel has a few very nice folders, all of which are legal for CC in cali. spydercos are my personal favorites, especially the spyderco chinook II. if money's not an issue, i'd invest in an emerson, especially the karambit. other brand choices are:
benchmade (though i never held one i liked, people love them for a reason)
crkt (lots of good knives on the cheap)
hide away knives, or HAKs (i own one; it rules!)
ka-bar (especially the TDIs)

you kind of asked one of those questions that are impossible to answer, like, what's the best gun out there for concealed carry? it's just a matter of personal taste. if there's a sporting goods or knife store near you, i'd go there and pick up a few to get a feel for them.
 
Your choice of SD knife should depend solely on what style of self defense you plan on using, not what people on the internet recommend. I've never been in a knife fight (I have seen one), and neither have most of the people that will post here. Why do you want our advice?

Whatever martial arts you study will influence the style of knife; even if you do not practice any style your selection of knife should lend itself to what are the most likely motions that you will make in a SD situation.

Most people (trained or untrained) tend to slash with a knife rather than stab, perhaps you should pay more attention to a knife designed to make deep aggressive cuts? (Spydie chinook will fill this role) Tanto points may be cool, but unless you are practiced in pushing a knife into someone's vitals all that point will be good for is showing off. A spearpoint may be more functional for general carry.

I'd suggest that you take some time in considering what you want to do with a knife before choosing anything.
 
Thanks for the replies gentleman. It's just one of those things that I find myself not very well-versed with. I would prefer a folder and I also wouldn't expect to slash in a knife fight (not that I ever want to be in one) more so than plunging the blade into vitals. When I took Kenpo and some other various fighting arts I learned a great deal about where to strike if a blade is all you have. What to look for and where most attackers aren't expecting to get penetrated. I'm certainly no professional and would definitely look into further training, but I just wanted a general consensus on if you boys advocating anything over the other. Ultimately it does come down to how it feels, how balanced the blade feels in your hand, so on so forth.

Thanks for the replies, I'll take everything you said into consideration as well as stay away from those Smith and Wessons. If anyone has anything else they'd like to throw my way it would certainly be appreciated. :cool:

-Dom
 
If you are looking for a folder: CRKT M16 series. Fast (I mean very fast) one-hand open and close. Cheap, so you can lose it without being out too much money. 3.5" blade, so usually you can even carry concealed. If I were looking for a self defense only knife it would be a full tang knife.



Personally, knives are a very dirty business in a fight. You had best decide if you have the resolve to basically "sucker punch" a guy who is attacking when you wish to defend yourself with a knife. The weird rubbery slick/scratchy feel of pentrating muscle and bouncing off of bone is NOT pleasant. A knife should never come out in an altercation until the last moment, it is much harder to counter a knife if you don't know it's there until too late. Expect to have his blood all over you, and if he is armed with knife or firearm expect you have yours all over you too.

Even though I carry a knife everywhere, I find I use it more for digging, prying, utility cutting. Just remember club trumps knife. Gun trumps both. However at most self defense distances a knife in the hand beats a gun on the belt every time. Good situational awareness will identify more useful weapons than a lowly knife.
 
DomMega said:
Thinking of buying a defensive only knife as part of my CCW rig when I move to Arizona....I think I'm in the market for a tanto point, as I like the strength of the blade for penetration...I would prefer a folder.
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You don't mention your budget. But if you want a robust, tanto bladed folder for defensive use, one of the "modern classics" is the Emerson CQC-7:

CQC-7BW-BT.jpg

I have a similar model, and it came razor sharp from the factory. It's held up to around 10 years of use (and some abuse as well).
 
Against most threats, I would rather be unarmed than have to get up close and personal with a knife.

In order to stab somebody, you need to get within their arms reach- same as if you punch or kick them.. Once you introduce a weapon, you are giving them the oppertunity to take control of an implement that the WILL (if they have 2 brain cells) take control of and use to KILL or seriously injur YOU.

As weapons, knives are good killing tools but suck for self defense, or for the person who introduces the knife into the situation in the case of the agrssor who brings a knife to the fight.

I have been on the unarmed self defense end of a real world knife attack. With how easy it was for me to disarm the attacker, I learned how easy it is for a BG to grab a knife out of my hands if I ever pulled one (in SD) against another human.

I would rather pray that my Surefire would be a viable SD tool than my knife- regardless of how tactical and black that knife may be.
 
If you have the training, more power to you, but a SD purposes a knife is a difficult weapon to use, as you can be easily disarmed. Just keep in mind that though you follow the laws pertaining to carrying weapons, BGs don't. So if you pull a knife, and the BG has a gun concealed, he may then consider you threat, pull the gun out, and shoot you.
 
Avoid Smith & Wesson like the plague.

Benchmade are great for tantos. Their new HK line (unlike previous HK knives in my opinion) is great. The 14255 is a good tanto:

http://www.benchmade.com/loading.aspx?model=14255

If you don't need a tanto, the new Becnhmade Snody 14205 looks absolutely superb (not got one yet but I will be doing so):

http://www.benchmade.com/loading.aspx?model=14205

Emerson are also great, like the CQC 7:

http://emersonknives.com/HardWear_index.html

Do you have blade length restrictions? Do you know a specific style of fighting? Do you have a price bracket?

Though, as others have said, I wouldn't reccomend a knife for self-defence. A kubaton or pepper spray would serve you much better, and probably be a lot cheaper.
 
as you can be easily disarmed
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Please explain.
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I didn't post the original comment, but my post was to similar effect, so I'll justify his comment based on my personal experience.

Bear in mind that I have actuallly disarmed an individual of a knife in self defense. My commentary largely bases out of that incident.

To give background on my incident, again, I was attacked by an individual armed with a Leatherman tool, a PST if I recall, though it may have been a supertool. That really is a non-issue. The knife blade was extended.

For further understanding, I am a 6'0" 185 LB white male. The assailant was a Latino male, between 5'6" and 5'8" and was stocky, probably a little bit heavier than I.

Being alert, I noticed the knife in his hand before the attack began, but did not have the ability to retreat as would have been preferable. He had a dog that was off-leash, and I was concerned that I could be chased down and mauled if I ran. Furthermore, he was moving forward towards me in what I percieved to be a hostile manner. I determined that I had no choice but to stand my ground. Bear in mind that I was unarmed- no knife, no gun, no cell phone (didn't own one until about 16-18 months later).

I continued to proceed forward, my original direction of travel to prevent an attack from the rear. If I was wrong, and he just happend to be idiotically carrying an open knife, I did not initate any violent action- no harm, no foul. As I expected he rushed up to me, demanding "money".

Immediately thereafter, he thrust the knife at my throat, missing by a matter of about 2"-3" to my left side. The knife was thrust from his right side. Using my right (dominant hand), I grabbed his wrist, forced it down, twisted it and applied significant pressure. His hand opened and the knife dropped.

I immediately kicked it off to the side. My right hand continued to restrain his hand to prevent him from striking me. During that time (very very short elapsed time), he attempted to suck punch my with his other hand, though I blocked that attempt with my left arm (yes, my arms crossed- bad move- I know). I kneed him in the lower abdoman, notice a means of ascape to my right, and took.

Lessons Leanred
1. weapons brung close to another person are liable to be grabbed. If it's in arms reach, he can grab it.
2. Unlike a handgun that has a vaguly right angle grip, the can be used as leverage against a grab, a knife is straight line, and can easily be removed without even touching the knife while it is in hand. Had I been a bad guy, I could have picked the knife up and easily stabbed him.
3. I was in better physical shape than said assailant. Made it easier to defeat him, despite is higher BMI, lower center of gravity, due to his higher weight and lesser height.
4. Even a utilitarian, plain blade, even if it is only 2.75 or 3" scared the living **** out of me when it was coming towards my throat at an upward angle. I can remember that vision to this day. Don't think I'll ever forget it.

Since then, I have also figured that had I not grabbed his wrist and instead did grab for the knife, I still could have disarmed him with no or superficial hand injuries to slightly more serious one. If a criminal was so dedicated, he could easily put an individual 6' under, while himself only getting minor injuries. I consider even serious hand lecerations to be relatively minor compared to death.
 
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I just don't see how you'd be better off without a weapon than with a weapon in a self-defense situation (assuming, of course, that you know how to use that weapon). The argument that it's better to be unarmed otherwise an assailant "will just take it and use it against you" doesn't sit right with me.

I'd rather be armed with a weapon I'm comfortable with and trained to use. If I was attacked, I'd be pretty confident with a razor sharp CQC-7 in my hand. If my attacker is skilled enough to wrest it from my grip...then I'm in pretty serious trouble one way or the other.
 
What did OJ use? it seemed pretty good for self-defense.
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Unless your very well trained in martial arts and are very athletic and strong, a knife is a good killing implement but a poor choice for self defense.


I just don't see how you'd be better off without a weapon than with a weapon in a self-defense situation (assuming, of course, that you know how to use that weapon). The argument that it's better to be unarmed otherwise an assailant "will just take it and use it against you" doesn't sit right with me.

I'd rather be armed with a weapon I'm comfortable with and trained to use. If I was attacked, I'd be pretty confident with a razor sharp CQC-7 in my hand. If my attacker is skilled enough to wrest it from my grip...then I'm in pretty serious trouble one way or the other.
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For a majority of circumstances where the knife would be drawn, introducing a weapon will compound the possibnility of injury to you, given the ease in disarmament. If the perp is assaulting you with a projectile weapon, taser, baton or most other weapons, you'll do about as well with a knife as you will without. For the other circumstances, your mitigating liability. When you introduce a weapon, there is a factor of positives v. liabilities that needs to be be figured. The liabilities outway the positive potential outcomes for me to believe carrying a knife as a good self defense option. The fact of the matter is, dedicating a knife for SD leaves more than a necesary amount of liability potential.

In all honesty wrestling a knife out of someones hand was not all that difficult for me to do. I have 0 martial arts training and I'm not a body builder.

Your goal should be to minimize liabilities, not add liabilities. I have no problem with armed self defense- I just believe that believing that tangoing with a knife, especially a short blade folder that requires one to get up-close and personal is a bad idea. It's going to give you a false sense of security.

You seem to propogate the idea that the bad guy dosen't know what he's doing. That's a very bad position to take. It's better to assume a competent enemy and have to fight an incompetent one. That's the type of danmgerous mentality that gets good people killed.
 
I wouldn't recommend a knife for self-defense either, but I live in California so its pretty much knife and fox pepper spray. I don't forsee too many assailants really getting past the pepper spray but if they do, I'd rather have a blade and use it if they can't see anything.

As far as styles of fighting it was mostly pressure point and major artery points when I was learning knife fighting in Kenpo, what little I was taught.

Thanks for sharing that story mp510, I had a similar one I posted in the general discussion forum about how I had a gun pulled on me in a liquor store on Christmas Day last year and escaped defenseless. I know the feeling and know it well, although it will never happen again without me being more ready for it next time.

I like that Emerson CQC and coincidentally I saw the M16 CRKT on cheaper than dirt and as soon as they restock the one I'm looking at I'll purchase it. Although if the price is right on some of those others you gentleman mentioned I may very well go that route as well.
 
When I hear "knife for self defense only" I immediately think of the Spyderco Civilian. Designed purely for slashing...virtually no other usefulness.
 
with all due respect. . . . .

to mp510, I am glad your encounter with the knife wielding bad guy turned out as it did, but just as with firearms, training and experience are invaluable when dealing with edged weapons. Maybe you're that good but maybe you just got lucky. Showing him your own blade and turning an armed vs. unarmed encounter into a possible knife fight would likely have worked as well without the need for physical contact. Most any blade-fixed or folding employed in a strictly defensive or counter strike mode can be effective and disarming someone using the blade in such a manner is an order of magnitude more difficult than disarming an attacker. Had the dog decided to attack you as well, a knife would have been mighty useful. Most untrained dogs will not continue to press an attack after receiving a significant wound.
 
MP510, if everything went down in your situation as you have described, you should have gone to the nearest convenience store and bought a lottery ticket. Luck was with you.

It sounds like your attacker was either incompetent, lacked the will to really harm you, or a combination thereof.

If an individual has even a small amount of training or seriously means you bodily harm, it is not at all easy to disarm them without getting cut.

In response to the DomMega, I suggest looking at the Spyderco line of knives and then getting some training.
 
Just for clarification, In my situation the assailant was:
- An appx 16 year old punk
-Was definetely out of shape, and I presume incompetent and probably did not expect any resistance. He was probably looking for a quick buck- maybe a wallet or something.

to mp510, I am glad your encounter with the knife wielding bad guy turned out as it did, but just as with firearms, training and experience are invaluable when dealing with edged weapons. Maybe you're that good but maybe you just got lucky. Showing him your own blade and turning an armed vs. unarmed encounter into a possible knife fight would likely have worked as well without the need for physical contact. Most any blade-fixed or folding employed in a strictly defensive or counter strike mode can be effective and disarming someone using the blade in such a manner is an order of magnitude more difficult than disarming an attacker. Had the dog decided to attack you as well, a knife would have been mighty useful. Most untrained dogs will not continue to press an attack after receiving a significant wound.
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For clarification: The point of my story was not to say an individual should not carry a weapon for SD or suggest it's a good idea to go unarmed against a guy with weapon. By know means is it a smart idea. My point was to illustrate the propensity for weapons retention with a knife to be very poor, and that an assailant with a will can easily disarm you. Remember, when you bring a weapon to an individual, if you can't keep control of it, you'll get messed up. There's a reason why more often than not, the weapon used to fatally shoot a police officer was that officers own duty weapon.


Dom-
I feel you. Make sure you get retention training.
 
ok, I get it . . . . .

If I misread or misinterpreted your previous post - my bad. I did not intend my comments to be in any way disparaging - only indicative of my own experience and training. Peace.
 
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