Need help with sniper info

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Balog

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I'm trying to put together a quiz about sniper trivia. I'm looking for confirmation of some info I have, and trying to find some numbers I don't have. A lot of my info comes from this page.

I'll try to put this in an easy to answer format. I'll list the info I'd like confirmed, and then give questions I'd like answered.

1. Simo Hayha of Finland has the most confirmed kills of any sniper with 542. Were these all from the "Winter War" of 1939-40? How many probables did he have? What rifle did he use (I'm assuming a tricked out M39)? Any additional sources of info about him?

2. What US sniper had the most kills in WWII?

3. The American with the most kills ever is Adelbert Waldron III from the Army with 109. How many probables did he have? What rifle did he use? Any additional sources of info about him?

4. The US Navy sniper with the most kills is Daniel L. Greene with 42. Any info on the Navy sniping program? Was it a part of the SEAL teams or was it it's own thing? How many probables did he have? What rifle did he use? Any additional sources of info about him?

5. The Marine with the most kills is Charles B. Mawhinney with 103. How many probables did he have? What rifle did he use? Any additional sources of info about him?

6. What sniper currently serving with any force from any country has the most kills?

7. Any info on snipers in the Falkland Islands War?

8. Any info on snipers in Russia's invasion of Afghanistan?

9. I believe the longest shot resulting in a kill was made by Carlos Hathcock with a Browning M2HB. I saw a video where he discussed the shot, but I don't know what the apprx distance was.

10. What was the first "official" sniper unit in any country? What was the first unit in the US?

11. Any info on "snipers" in the Revolution or War Between the States?

That's all I've got right at the moment. Any suggestions for more/different questions?
 
pipsqueak: thanks for the info. I see they list his kills at 505 tho. I wonder whether that is the correct figure, or the 542 listed on the site I was looking at?
Incidentally, I recently checked out a book about the Winter War from the library. It had a picture of him! I'll have to get it out and see if I can ID what kind of rifle he's holding.
 
I was looking at that page you posted and came across some info on Suko Kolkka. Not only did he have 400+ kills as a sniper, he had an additional 200 with a sub-gun! Amazing. Those Finns were great fighters. Too bad their cowardly politicians betrayed them:fire:
 
5. Chuck used model 70 rifle, I have seen a history channel interview with him on a few of his storys in veitnam maybe check that for a source.

9. I have read Carlos Hathcock book its 2500 meters was his longest shot he was sent there to test the idea of putting a scope on the m2 after he zeroed his weapon (@ 2500 meters or yards maybe) cant remember yards or meters would have to refer back to book can if you want...? ..I have also a video interview with carlos ...The longest shot today was my a sniper with a barret 50 cal it was over a mile cant remember exact distance would have to look it up but i know it was at least a mile maybe mile and a half or maybe even 2.

11. Here is a little info off the top of my head again...By 1776 George Washington created small units of sharp shooters all carried "kentucky rifles" as a early sniper rifle carried out hit and run tactics that the british thought was very unsporty. A man by the name of Timothy murphy, expert with kentucky rifle who grew up on the frontier was credited with winning the Battle of Saratoga, he killed both british commanders from long range & then battle turned instantly being that it had no leadership....

Then Civil War I recall Abe Lincoln was spotted by a sharpshooter but was not shot because his back was turned... (it was very disrespectful to shoot a man while his back is turned) so he got away unharmed ...kinda ironic though being that he later died by being shot in the back of the head by a differnt man ... guess the 2nd shooter wasnt as respectfull as the first? Im sure there are more that is just what lies around in my brain at the moment... sorry about my spelling i know its horrible but it too late (3:00 in morning) to spell check........... hope it helps a little
 
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Ever seen...

the Sniper documentary on History Channel??? Gives some of the above info IIRC. They usually have copies of the shows for sale..HTH
 
5. Chuck used model 70 rifle,
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actually, like the rest of the Marine scout snipers by 68-69, he used a Model 700 in .308 (offical spec said 7.62 Nato, not sure if it was a true NATO chamber or a match .308 chamber) customized by Marine Armorers to USMC Specs. (the cover picture from "Inside the Crosshairs: Snipers in Vietnam" is Mawhinney and his rifle btw. Here's a link to that pic i hope http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0804116202/ref=sib_dp_pt/103-3403947-6230259#reader-link )


the well known Marine sniper who used a M70 was Hathcock and his rifle was, if memory serves, NOT an issue rifle, but one buiolt by/for the USMC shooting team, and was a 30-06.

What got me was the account of Mawhinney's last spotter, Joseph T. Ward (who i THINK holds the #3 spot in "the most confirmed kills in SEA" list, have to look into that). the following is related in Ward's book "Dear Mom: a Sniper's vietnam" (which some have speculated was the result of Ivy/ballentine books being rebuffed in their attempt to get Mahinney to write account of his tour(s), so they went to "the next person down the list" i don't know if this is true or not, don't really care either it's a good book)

Ward's first field assignment upon assignment to the 5th Marines scout sniper platoon, was to replace the man then partnered with Mawhinney, due to the partner's developing "a slight case of nerves" (ward states that "slight" wasn't the right adjective) , Ward's first patrol with Mawhinney, was Mawhinney's last as a team leader, and when he (mawhinney) left the field he not only made WARD (a man with less than 2 weeks in-country) the new team leader but passed on the bolt rifle that he'd carried since HE bacame a team leader, with the words "take care my baby"
Ward then continues (this is tha passage that gets to me).

"chuck had gotten the rifle as soon as it came into the armory, Broken it in, then carried it for a year. although he logged 101 confirmed kills and over 150 probables (MY note: this was Mawhinney's record when he ended his time as a team leader adn became a "central squad leader" responsible for mutiple teams), i could have put that rifle in any sporting goods store and sold it for new. I vowed to keep it that way. and with the weather and rigors of combat, i spent a tremendous amount of time doing just that."
 
Then civil war I recall abe lincon was spotted by a sharpshooter but was not shot because his back was turned
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there is a similar tale from the Revolution, where a member of the "rifle corps formed to combat test the Ferguson Rifle (lead by the inventor Maj Patrick Ferguson) passed up a shot at the back of a mounted "colonial" officer, b/c it was not "civilized" to either shoot a man int eh back nor to purposely target officers, much less to do both with one action. according to the story the officer that this British sharpshooter passed an almost assured kill shot on turned out to be George Washington.

Now imagine if Washington had been killed prior to valley forge, and all that followed..... what would have happened who would have taken the reins of leadership for the continental army? or WOULD there have been a Continental army after that winter had Washington not been in place as a leader??
 
there is a similar tale from the Revolution, where a member of the "rifle corps formed to combat test the Ferguson Rifle (lead by the inventor Maj Patrick Ferguson) passed up a shot at the back of a mounted "colonial" officer, b/c it was not "civilized" to either shoot a man int eh back nor to purposely target officers, much less to do both with one action. according to the story the officer that this British sharpshooter passed an almost assured kill shot on turned out to be George Washington.
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I've never heard that Lincoln was ever in anyone's sights until that little night out at the theater. I think that the original post was confusing Lincoln and Washington.

And Washington's case, the man who held his fire was Major Patrick Ferguson himself. This occured at the Battle of the Brandywine.
 
Nah not confused but intresting that washington was in the same situation, It was presented that way on History Channel a show called Suiside missions i have a copy of the tape ... its a great video!! They didnt say anything about washington but i dont doubt the same thing happened maybe divine intervention that let these men persue to lead on to be victorus
 
The only place I've seen info on Adalbert Waldron was in David Truby's Silencers, Snipers and Assassins. I've asked the Chandler Brothers (Death From Afar) to follow up and research his story, but I guess me being a nobody didn't generate any interest.

Peter Senich is suppose to be writing a book on Mawhinney (and that's why the Chandler Brothers won't). It's been a couple of years now since he started. He had an article published in Precision Rifle. Darn if I can find it right now.

Most kills I know of during the Civil War was 117. Confirmation is difficult though and I should contact the National Archives to see if I can get the guy's record. His name? Well, that's reserved for an appendix in my book on sharpshooting.
 
The only place I've seen info on Adalbert Waldron was in David Truby's Silencers, Snipers and Assassins.
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there is also mention of him in "inside the Crosshiars....." and i think in Adrian Gilbert's books on the history, technology, and craft of sniping ("Sniper: The Skills, the Weapons, and the Experiences". and "Stalk and Kill"{there is a third title " Sniper: The World of Combat Sniping" But it may simply be the original title of "...Skills, weapons, experiences"} ), but all acouts i have found will at most provide Waldron's statistical data (kill stats, time in country and unit assigned to) and some comteporary commentary by a few Feild grade officers in Waldron's chain of command, and comanding general at the time, of the 9th Infantry.

sadly as you seem to note this information comes quite short of providing insight into the PERSON of Adelbert Waldron. But the case may be that Waldron like, and possible to a greater extent than, Mawhinney simply chooses NOT to make much of what he did in Southeast Asia. After the war both men quietly faded away and have lived their lives.

anyone know what FINALLY motivated Mawhinney to end is silence ont eh matter?? i know that for many many a year he refused to even talk to reporters or authors about his time with the 5th marines.
 
Mawhinney was hounded out. He lived quietly working for the Forest Service after the war and his coworkers never suspected he was a sniper. He hunted and fished like a "normal" American and earned his retirement.

Burt Ward's book, "Dear Mom" first brought Mawhinney to the public's eye. Everybody was astounded by Ward's claim of Mawhinney's 101 kills that topped Hathcock (remember, it's not the #s but who you kill) and so the search began. Some small newspaper found him and printed an article. Peter Senich dug him out and did an article in Precision Shooting. When Senich interviewed him, he found out that Mawhinney shot two more BGs right before he turned in his rifle. Senich added those 2 to his score for 103. Mawhinney has come out and attended a few sniper conferences where he was the guest speaker.
 
food for thought

So is waldron being saved the same treatment ONLY b/c none of his contemporaries have written books??
Or has the "The Marine's had 'snipers' the Army had 'sharpshooters'.." (a veiw i was first exposed to in a conversation with an accquaintance who was a Scout-Sniper. owing to the lesser emphasis placed on "stalking" and actual scouting work, in the Army Sniper training of the time) mentality, sway the interests of the the military history buffs and "wannabes" (two distinct categories) such that interest in Waldron simply was not pursued?

or (and in my mind likely) Has waldron done one of the following things,

A. threatened litigation on anyone approaching him for his story

B. wound up in some "undisireable/wretched circumstance" that has lead would-be biographers to leave him alone out of simple decency.

or
C. Died

??


Oh and on the subject of Mawhinney, does anyone here think that maybe he kept his being a sniper in vietnam secret, because for years it was hard for him to reconcile what he did in vietnam and some of the thoughts on that subject he has now admitted to having had at the time (like "well heck if i'd known they were gonna send me over here to do THIS i wouldn't have put in for delayed entry b/c of Deer season back home!!") with the person he was over all, as well as who and what he was once he returned to the states??
I know that many who have served in wartime suffer such dilemmas and resultant anguish. again just a thought.
 
Gee no one else gonna mention that there are famous women snipers. It is covered in at least one History channel program. My personal favorite is Hathcock, but for trivia my favorite trained sniper is Dr Ruth Westhiemer. I had heard taht as a "strange" trivia fact but have not found where I can give proof. Anyone else heard Dr. Ruth was a sniper?
 
Anyone else heard Dr. Ruth was a sniper?
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may or may not be true, but either way it has the distict smell of the "John Denver was a Sniper in the army in Vietnam" tales...

which btw is complete and utter BS.

now if it turns out that Dr Ruth WAS at one time a sniper then that really WOULD be kinda kooky no? :D
 
just went looking...

and i found the following passage in an on-line bio-blurb regarding Dr Ruth..

Ruth was 17 with no home, family or country when WW II ended . All she had was the hope of starting over again in a place where she would feel welcome. That place was supposed to be Palestine. But Palestine was not the land of milk and honey of which Ruth had heard. On May 14, 1948, Israel declared its independence. Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Egypt and Irak immediatley attacked the new nation, and once again Ruth's world collapsed. Ruth, dedicated to the building of a Jewish homeland, joined the Haganah and was trained as a sniper. On her twentieth birthday she had just finished up guard duty when an Arab shell exploded at her feet, seriously injuring her. Her recovery was slow, but she survived to walk again.
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and the following except from a National Geographic interveiw entitled Dr. Ruth: Sex Sage and Ex-Sniper on Global Sexuality that can be found HERE

Tom Foreman: You were trained as a sniper?

Dr. Ruth: We were all trained in the forerunner of the Israeli Defense Force, and for some reason that I can't explain I'm a very good sniper. I can put five bullets into this little red circle (makes circle with her fingers). I know how to throw hand grenades. I've never killed anybody. I was badly wounded.
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so i'd say that the rumors of Dr Ruth the trainer Sniper are true....
 
4v50 Gary: so when is your book gonna be ready? Sounds interesting.

Speaking of female snipers, I think I'll add another question.

12. What countries have utilized females in the role of sniper. Which female sniper has the most confirmed kills? How many probable did she have? What rifle did she use?
 
the country that used the most female snipers i believe was russia. during WWII, some female sniper had an ungodly kill count. i don't have time right now to find out her name, but i know that she, and almost all other russian snipers, used M91/30 nagants with 3.5X PU scopes.
 
Most of the research has been done. I'm trying to tidy it up and presently it stands at over 450 pages with 1,000 plus footnotes. I want the reader to be able to verify quote. Right now I'm working on getting photographs -and have been in contact with several museums and may make one more trip just for photos.

Regarding women snipers, Russia was using them in WW II. You have to be careful with the "kills" as they were subjected to the ever clear voice of truth, Pravda. Oh, there is a woman USA rmy Res. who made the grade for sniper so we have our first. :)
 
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