Need some help with a 38spl 158gr lead SWC load

[vaalpens]

I would test Bullseye, Unique and Titegroup at the prescribed starting loads. Every gun is different and will provide different results. My experience with cast 158 gr. loads is that Bullseye works the best with MOST guns but that may not apply to you! Personally, I also like to use WST powder because in light loads it burns the cleanest of all in my experience.

Thanks for your comments. I am just testing one powder with these bullets. Leaning towards HP38 and W244, but keeping WST in the running also.

 

[e rex]

4 grains of HP38 has always been a nice lite load with a cast bullet in a 38 special for me. 4.5 is about a standard 38 special load. Use a Winchester load manual before Hodgdon started selling the powder.

 

[vaalpens]

Unique will always work with those 158's, as will the Bullseye. Interested about that W244 powder. Been reading good things about it.

Thanks. I think W244 is going to make my short list.

So far I won't pick a powder that I have loaded 158gr before, so Bullseye, Unique and 700x are not in the running anymore. TG burns hot, plus I am decided on using a magnum primer, so TG is probably not in the running anymore. For now it looks like it is between HP38, W244 and WST.

 

[vaalpens]

My first venture into reloading (1980) was for 38/357 and using cast bullets. At the time I was using Speer 158gr and Hornady 158gr SWC along with both manf. model 148gr Wadcutters. I loaded these into 357 cases with Hercules Bullseye that worked out to be a mild 357 or a hotter 38Spl. Anyways they shot great and were a lot of fun. Speer and Hornady use to sell their Cast lead in boxes of 500.

Thanks for the comments. You have a lot more experience than I have, about 34 years.

 

[vaalpens]

I am loading up the 158 grain lead bullets ihave.
I am using 3.4 grains of BULLSEYE powder.
Real light recoil in the 6 inch Ruger GP100.
But it is a dirty powder in the GP100.

Thanks! I saw about 691fps with a 3.4gr Bullseye and ACME 158gr SWC bullet. Looks like I'll skip Bullseye this time and try a new powder.

 

[Dudedog]

I would say you want something in the fast to middle range.With the powders I have I would try AA#2 and HP38.
Given what you listed I would try Bullseye, or HP38.
Never used 700x but it might be good as well. For me Titegroup didn't seem to play well with lead, but then I don't care for Titegroup in general, but others like it a lot so it might be a possible to.
If you don't have a lot of them and don't plan on getting more, might be a good place to try whichever of the fast powders you have that is your least favorite for other things.
(I know strange logic)

Soft lead (if they are soft) in revolvers for me always seem to want a different powder than my 9mm/.45s prefer.

Are they lubed? (tumble lubed?)

 

[joneb]

What velocity do you see for a load between 3.8gr and 4.2gr W231/HP38? Is that a 38spl +P load?

I'm not sure if I recorded numbers for those loads. My intent was to work up a accurate load for a LSWC in a 1.875" S&W 36 I would guess the 4.2gr of w-231 with a 158gr LSWC would clock about 700 fps from a snub.
just guessin.

 

[vaalpens]

View attachment 1066848

Pic is of the 244 Data. Starting load for Win244 is 3.6 grains with a 158 SWC max is 4.0. 3.6 shoots very nicely, I load 3.7 over the Speer Swagged 158 SWC HP. Unique anything from 4.2 to 4.7 (Max) will give you a sweet load. Enjoy. FYI those numbers are from the Winchester and Alliant website data. Good luck

Thanks! I like W244 in a few cartridges, so it would be interesting to see how it performs in 38spl with a 158gr bullet. Decisions, decisions.

 

[vaalpens]

I would say you want something in the fast to middle range.With the powders I have I would try AA#2 and HP38.
Given what you listed I would try Bullseye, or HP38.
Never used 700x but it might be good as well. For me Titegroup didn't seem to play well with lead, but then I don't care for Titegroup in general, but others like it a lot so it might be a possible to.
If you don't have a lot of them and don't plan on getting more, might be a good place to try whichever of the fast powders you have that is your least favorite for other things.
(I know strange logic)

Soft lead (if they are soft) in revolvers for me always seem to want a different powder than my 9mm/.45s prefer.

Are they lubed? (tumble lubed?)

Thanks Dudedog. With your "don't plan on getting more" made me think a little. I have some powders that I don't really have go to loads for. This is a one-off, so maybe just use one of them. I use W244 for a few cartridges, so maybe I should not be looking at W244 for this load.

 

[joneb]

I seem to favor Bullseye over W-231 for lead in .38spl. and I favor Bullseye in 45 acp with plated bullets.
How is it this old powder works so well
I guess with powder being hard to find I would let that help me to decide.

 

[AzShooter1]

I received these lubed 158gr lead SWC bullets and would like to make the best out of it. I don't know how hard/soft these bullets are. The revolver is a Ruger 3" SP101 357mag, but I am planning to just stick with a light loading 38spl load that I can enjoy. The load development plan is to test about 4 different loads using one powder, then pick a load and load the rest of them with this selected load. I created a dummy round just to set my dies for this bullet. The COL came out to 1.438".

I would appreciate it if you can help me by suggesting a powder to use, and a bracket or min max load to test. An example will be HP38 with tested loads 3.1g, 3.3g, 3.5g and 3.7g.

The powders I am leaning towards are, HP38, Bullseye, Unique, 700x, W244, Titegroup.

Any help will be appreciated.

Bullets:
View attachment 1066784
Dummy Round:
View attachment 1066785

I've always liked Bullseye for light target loads with the bullets you have. My range to start with would be 3.5 to 4.0. My load for USPSA was 4 grains with the 158s. It would easily make the power factor needed for competition.

For practice and just fun I used 3.5.

I also found Unique to be a good powder. 4 grains is a nice starting point and I wouldn't go past 4.5.

Using your 200 primers will not be a problem. You may get a few more feet per second from them but they will help your burn rate and give you cleaner ammo.

 

[tightgroup tiger]

If you run into Power Pistol, try 4.9 grains. I use it for very light loads in my .357mag. Very accurate. I use 6.7 gr in .357 mag. and it downloads well also.
6.7 is below Alliants min for .357 but I'm not making magnum loads, I'm making 38 special loads in magnum cases, so who cares.
4.9 to 5.4 is the spread for 38 Spl brass if you are using it.

 

[DaveinMiami]

If you decide to go with WST, the load I use is 3.5 grains for 158 grain SWCs, which gives a velocity of about 730 fps in my pre 27 6-inch Smith and Wesson .357 Magnum revolver. It also shoots well and very clean with 148 grain DEWCs with a load of 3.0 grains. I use Clean Shot for .357 magnum loads.

 

[length_of_pull_1]

I've been shooting 158gr coated lswc from MBC using 4.0gr of w244 in 38spl cases out of a 4" 357. Great load. I haven't chrono'd it yet but it burns super clean and the brass just falls out of the cylinder.

 

[PapaG]

I think I'd tumble lube them again. Looks kind of skimpy. 2.7-3.0 Bullseye

 

[Bfh_auto]

At risk of being the odd man out. My most accurate 38 load was a 158 and 700X. It required using a dipper instead of my volumetric.

 

[vaalpens]

At risk of being the odd man out. My most accurate 38 load was a 158 and 700X. It required using a dipper instead of my volumetric.

Yes, 700x is a good powder. I have done a few loads using 700x, and I do use the Lee dipper. You are not the old man out.

 

[vaalpens]

I think I'd tumble lube them again. Looks kind of skimpy. 2.7-3.0 Bullseye

I did not cast those bullets and are not casting, so i won't be able to tumble them again. It seems Bullseye is the consensus, but I have loaded some Bullseye before, so it looks like I'll pass on Bullseye this time.

 

[vaalpens]

I've been shooting 158gr coated lswc from MBC using 4.0gr of w244 in 38spl cases out of a 4" 357. Great load. I haven't chrono'd it yet but it burns super clean and the brass just falls out of the cylinder.

Thanks for the information. If this was a bullet that I would load going forward, then probably I would have tried W244. For now it seems I'll pass on W244 and pick a powder that I don't really have any loads for. Hopefully I and maybe others will learn from it.

 

[vaalpens]

If you decide to go with WST, the load I use is 3.5 grains for 158 grain SWCs, which gives a velocity of about 730 fps in my pre 27 6-inch Smith and Wesson .357 Magnum revolver. It also shoots well and very clean with 148 grain DEWCs with a load of 3.0 grains. I use Clean Shot for .357 magnum loads.

Thanks for the suggestion. I think I have decided on WST since I don't have any other WST loads, so it makes sense, at least in my mind, to use WST for this one-off load.

I will load and test loads using WST from 3.3gr to 3.7gr. I need to decide how many loads. If 6, then I'll probably start at 3.2gr and end at 3.7gr. If 4 loads, then maybe just 3.3, 3.4,3.5 and 3.7.

 

[vaalpens]

If you run into Power Pistol, try 4.9 grains. I use it for very light loads in my .357mag. Very accurate. I use 6.7 gr in .357 mag. and it downloads well also.
6.7 is below Alliants min for .357 but I'm not making magnum loads, I'm making 38 special loads in magnum cases, so who cares.
4.9 to 5.4 is the spread for 38 Spl brass if you are using it.

Thanks for the suggestion. I have loaded 158gr SWC using PowerPistol in 38spl from 5.4gr to 6.0gr with velocities from 860 to 960. Power Pistol is one of my favorite powders in pistol cartridges.

 

[vaalpens]

I've always liked Bullseye for light target loads with the bullets you have. My range to start with would be 3.5 to 4.0. My load for USPSA was 4 grains with the 158s. It would easily make the power factor needed for competition.

For practice and just fun I used 3.5.

I also found Unique to be a good powder. 4 grains is a nice starting point and I wouldn't go past 4.5.

Using your 200 primers will not be a problem. You may get a few more feet per second from them but they will help your burn rate and give you cleaner ammo.

Thanks for the comment about the 200 primers. The consensus is for Bullseye and Unique, and I appreciate you sharing the data. For now I have decided to try something completely new, and will go with WST. I can change my mind by tomorrow, but for now it seems I'll be trying WST.

 

[vaalpens]

I seem to favor Bullseye over W-231 for lead in .38spl. and I favor Bullseye in 45 acp with plated bullets.
How is it this old powder works so well
I guess with powder being hard to find I would let that help me to decide.

Thanks for the comments. Yes, sometimes powder availability decides for us, but for me I have decided on a powder I don't have another load for, so I'm going to try WST with this bullet. I am looking forward to see what performance I'll be seeing.

 

[joneb]

I have not loaded with WST but it seems to be a solid choice. I have been very happy with WSF in my quest for a upper end load.
best wishes to you.

 

[DaveinMiami]

I think that is a solid choice. Let us know how it turns out for you. I think you'll be happy with WST.

Thanks for the suggestion. I think I have decided on WST since I don't have any other WST loads, so it makes sense, at least in my mind, to use WST for this one-off load.

I will load and test loads using WST from 3.3gr to 3.7gr. I need to decide how many loads. If 6, then I'll probably start at 3.2gr and end at 3.7gr. If 4 loads, then maybe just 3.3, 3.4,3.5 and 3.7.