New .22LR double-action revolver for new and old shooters (S&W 317?)

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I've had the pleasure of being able to introduce several folks to shooting over the past few years, and I have come to the conclusion that rather than having the first live .22LR round they fire come out of a semi-auto, it ought to be out of a revolver. For similar reasons, that revolver should be double-action. Weight of the firearm is a concern simply due to fatigue, and double-action trigger pull should be well manageable even by folks without much hand strength (two of the new shooters were grandmothers!).

I've considered used firearms and will snatch up a Model 17 (and/or 18) K22 or a Ruger SP101 in .22LR, should I find any at a reasonable price, but I'm primarily interested in new firearms, considering my current level of skill in mechanical appraisal.

The firearm I've in mind is a S&W 317, it being lighter than the S&W 617, and reported as the top-quality current production double-action .22LR wheelgun. A few folks have made comments about the 317's double-action trigger pull weight, claiming it is excessive. How does it compare to the double-action trigger pull on other late-model S&W revolvers, or to Ruger's GP100/SP101 revolvers (which I'm also familiar with)?
 
A few folks have made comments about the 317's double-action trigger pull weight, claiming it is excessive. How does it compare to the double-action trigger pull on other late-model S&W revolvers, or to Ruger's GP100/SP101 revolvers (which I'm also familiar with)?
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We have one in the gun shop where I work. It's a very light, compact eight-shooter made on the tried and true J frame. The single action trigger has about a five-pound pull, which puts it down in the same class as Ruger revolvers. The double action trigger is a lawyer's delight, which it to say: the pull is long, rough, and extremely heavy. The trigger spur is needlessly sharp, so it seems to dig into one's thumb.

It's kind of a cute little thing; for its $500 price tag, however, I'd greatly prefer to buy an older gun with a trigger worthy of the Smith & Wesson name. I bought a used 1951 K frame .22 revolver several years ago for $350 with an excellent trigger and adjustable sights.
 
From what I understand, heavy DA pulls are hard to avoid in .22 revolvers, due to the need to ignite a wide variety of rimfire cartridges, and the need to crush a rim rather than hit a primer. Hopefully someone more tech-savvy will explain that.


That said, the S&W 63 is pretty cool: originally a J-frame 4" stainless revolver, it has just been re-released as a 5" 8-shot stainless. The used ones went for around $400 this year, and the new one has an MSRP of about $600 IIRC.

You can save a little cash by getting the blued version, the S&W 34, which I've seen for $325-375 this year.


If you set aside the double-action requirement, I think the Ruger Bearcat is a a great little gun. Small but usable, "cute', solid steel, decent SA trigger, and only costs $350 or so new.
 
The new Model 63 has gotten my interest. If I buy it, it will be my first stainless revolver, oops, second as I have a SRH.
 
I have been interested in a 22 revolver. I think the mod 34 or 63 would hold up better than the 317. But the 317 is very light weight.
 
I have a SW 317 and it is a great take along gun. Very light. Nice gun. I have a 3" and would prefer standard sights over the HiViz sights it comes with.

I had a gunsmith try to reduce the DA trigger pull by changing the mainspring and it would not fire some rounds. We also tried removing 1 coil from the standard spring and again it would not fire rounds consistantly. We put the standard spring back in and it works fine. The same gunsmith had done DA trigger work for me on 642,442,432 for me and they all worked fine. Looking at Wolff Spring's web site they stay with a higher spring rate for the 317's (and other 22's).
 
Thanks, folks. I'm definitely going to check into the Model 63, and will wait until I can get my mitts on a 317 before committing to a purchase (a neat trick out here in "We Hate Guns, and You, Too" County, Nevada).

While I'm still a big fan of autos, there is something to be said for firearms which anyone with most of their fingers still working in any condition can use and have fun with, without the "coach" having to rack slides and otherwise make it feel as though some firearms are just too much for normal people.
 
The trigger pull improves considerably with use.
The high visability fiber optic front sight is easy to replace.
I have over two cases of ammunition, about 13,000 rounds now, through this 317 with no problems whatsoever, cases don't even stick in the chambers, so put the durability concerns aside.
These are very good revolvers.
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I have a 317, 2" bbl, regular (non high viz) sights. The double action is rather heavy and not particularly smooth. The sights are not all that easy to see.

I would not consider this a particularly useful gun for an absolute newbie.
It is a fun plinker and makes for cheap snubby practice. Though extraction can get a bit sticky when the gun heats up. And it will heat up since it is fun to shoot.
 
Any special cleaning/maintenance considerations for these aluminum framed firearms? I've only worked with blued and/or stainless models thus far, but this model looks interesting to me.
 
I had a 317 LS - with a supposedly lighter trigger pull and a full hammer spur. I got rid of it as the DA pull was really horrendous for my purposes. I didn't want to mess with it.

I wanted the gun for a plinker. So I got a Ruger SS Bearcat. True, it is single action but a fun and pretty gun. The newbies I've let try it - all liked it. Then, I moved them to a 38 SPL with wadcutters.
 
Onmilo,

Nice modifications to your 317. I see you replaced the front sight. Did you also replace the rear sight to match? Were they purchased or did you make them? Making a simple post front sight and a new leaf for the rear sight don't look too hard. (Although I have not taken the rear sight apart yet.)

I also see that you replace the grips as I did,to the smaller boot grip style.

Private Message is fine.

Thanks.
 
I have a SW 317 and it is a great take along gun. Very light. Nice gun. I have a 3" and would prefer standard sights over the HiViz sights it comes with.
Click to expand...

Westhope, what do you not like about the HiViz sights, and how would you contrast them with the standard ones?

Thanks
 
For the past three years I have used two J-frame .22 revolvers for teaching new students. I have a 4" Model 34 and a 4" Model 63. My new students (adults) find these two guns ideal.

If you plan on buying new, I'd go with the 8-shot 5" Model 63 that Matthew mentioned. Otherwise a used M34 or M63 would serve you well.
 
If you're interested in DA triggerpulls, you want to avoid too light a revolver -- the combination of light gun and heavy pull makes it difficult to learn to shoot such a gun well.

However, there are a couple of things you can do. First of all, get a set of Wolff replacement springs. Next, strip the revolver down and fill it's innards with toothpaste -- a fairly abrasive brand -- and dryfire it a few thousand times. Then disassemble, clean thoroughly, and lube.
 
westhope.
The front blade is a standard S&W .400" plain partridge blade.
The gun came with a ramp front of about the same height.
I did not find it necessary to replace the rear blade though taller and shorter blades are available.
You really need to replace the rear sight nut if you ever take a rear sight assembly apart and it needs to be restaked.
None of this is hard to do but the right tools make it a whole lot easier.
Brownells has a kit available that has the staking tools, replacement parts, and screwdriver bits in one box.
I have one of these kits and would recommend the purchase of one to anybody who is even thinking of taking a Smith and Wesson rear sight apart.
The grips are Eagle smooth ebony Secret Service boot grips.
 
Sounds like you're looking for more of a .22 range gun rather than a "kit gun" for woods carry. Therefore, before you spend a lot of bread on a newfangled 317 with bells and whistles (some actually have a triangular rear sight notch -- a terrible idea on a .22), consider spending a lot of bread instead on the 4" S&W 617 ten-shooter in stainless. Mine has a pretty decent DA trigger pull and a nice light crisp SA trigger. It's a good gun.

I sometimes take new shooters to the range, and the two guns they really go for (and shoot well) are the CZ 75B in 9mm and the 617. Notice these are not teeny little compacts but medium-sized guns with accurate sights, good grips, enough barrel length to shoot well, and enough weight to damp recoil.

Last time I helped coach a "new shooters" event, one middle-aged lady ended by asking me in great detail about my 617 (how much, what model number, which gun store to go to, etc.) so she could buy one just like it.

If you really want a lightweight range gun for new shooters, an interesting choice might be the newly reintroduced S&W 63, a steel compact (J-frame) 8-shot .22 revolver with 5" barrel. Me, I wish S&W had put a 4" or (better yet) 3" barrel on the thing, for carry. But it might be perfect for you. It has normal target sights, unlike some of the 317s. It would be lighter, smaller and "cuter" than the K-frame 617, with a smaller grip circumference. Yet as long as the trigger is decent, I bet you could do some good shooting with it.
 
JV 2108:

For me, I can get a finer, more precise sight picture with the standard "post and notch type" sights. With the HiViz sights my eyes get "confused" as what part of the front sight to focus on. I think the green dot also contributes to my confusion. I think a red would be better. I'm not color blind.

I have always used the standard post & notch sight in IDPA/IPSIC knowing the the HiViz type sights are faster. I just shoot the standard a little more precise.

I really like my 3 " SW 317 because it is so light and easy to take along with a spare box of ammo. I tried to make the DA trigger better but had some mis-fires and then went back to the standard main spring.

For the students I teach, I prefer a steel framed gun because the extra weight makes it easier to shoot.
 
Had a 3" 317 with adjustable (non-hi-viz) sights for a good number of years. Really didn't like the heavy DA trigger. It was very accurate in SA, though. The gun was so light it felt like a toy to me. I eventually sold it to buy a 4" Ruger SP101. By comparison, the Ruger feels like a brick, but its DA trigger is a bit lighter and smoother. I much prefer the Ruger.
 
As a follow-up, I did manage to find a 317 and handle it to test its trigger pull. If the firearm was primarily for my use as a plinker, it'd be fine. However, since I want to use it as a choice for neophytes, it's too heavy for that purpose, in my opinion.

I'll be looking at the 617, Model 63, and the used markets.
 
I tried a 317 on the range once. Nice little gun, very light, looks pretty. But, the DA trigger is ridiculously heavy and you have to be accustomed to shooting with a small handle. Also did not like the sights.
 
Don't pass up a chance to look at a used Model 17 or 18. You will be pleasantly surprised.
 
Something interesting I noticed about the 317s when I went back over this thread and took a another good look at Onmilo's photo. Made me pull out the S&W catalog I keep in my nightstand:

The 2" has fixed rear sights.

The 3" has adjustable rear sights.

For me, adjustable sounds great. This leads to a dumb question - would it be reasonable to ankle carry a 3" 317? I've got to believe pocket carry would be possible - though my only basis for comparison is a Colt DS (obviously 2" and heavier).

Thanks,

John
 
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