I agree with your line of thinking but I don't have a problem taking closeout ammo when they make no profit. Their markup couldn't have been more than 50%.
Now that Walmart ended ammo sales on many calibers......
- Thread starter lionking
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I agree with your line of thinking but I don't have a problem taking closeout ammo when they make no profit. Their markup couldn't have been more than 50%.
bannockburn
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fireside44
Thank you for your forthright reply! I too will not patronize Walmart, Dick's, or any other store or vendor who would sell us all out with their misguided efforts to neutralize the Second Amendment, as well as for the sake of pursuing the almighty dollar!
Thank you for your forthright reply! I too will not patronize Walmart, Dick's, or any other store or vendor who would sell us all out with their misguided efforts to neutralize the Second Amendment, as well as for the sake of pursuing the almighty dollar!
Trunk Monkey
member
I can't remember the last time I've been in a Walmart Superstore but when ever it was their per box price on 9mm WWB was higher than SG Ammo. IMO this will be a good thing because it will drive business to sellers that actually do support the Second Amendment.
The samed Wal-Mart, that jacked us around, for the ENTIRE Obama Administration, shipping just enough bricks of 22LR, to manipulate us into going to the store 3-5 times a week, checking availability ?
Seems they should decide whether they want to commercially exploit us, or Virtue Signal, to me.
I'm fine with on-line bulk orders, and I doubt anything W-M does is going to affect that very competitive market.
Seems they should decide whether they want to commercially exploit us, or Virtue Signal, to me.
I'm fine with on-line bulk orders, and I doubt anything W-M does is going to affect that very competitive market.
crestoncowboy
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I try my best to avoid walmart for anything. I hate walmart. (Although sometimes you just can't beat their everyday low prices. Lol) But I'd bet they have sold more 22 ammo, as well as just as many shotguns and 22 rifles as any other company. They also didn't sell 70 dollar bricks during the panics. I order mine by the case online but if they have to stop selling handgun ammo to stay off the radar of the grabbers while pumping millions and millions of rounds of shotgun and rimfire ammo into the market I'm not sure they are entirely anti-2a, just trying to play strategy I believe. For me they are a wasted space and an abomination of pavement in every town but if you lived in places with no option of internet ammo sales? They wont stay open because of me but I dont judge anyone for shopping there since every situation is different. Also If online ammo sales was banned I wonder if walmart would be back into sales because of the margins.
I did stand at the counter in another town For some 15 dollar .40 100 packs this week. They had a ton and I was going to buy 10 boxes of .40 for 150 bucks. After 20 minutes of watching employees walk by me (4 including the store manager many times) I gave up though. So I guess I didn't support them. I fully intended to. Like another poster says, I'm sure they are taking a loss on this ammo selling it and if its turned over to LE it's a tax write off. so maybe you are actually sticking it to "the man" by buying it. I sent my wife by my "local" (45 minutes away) walmart and they had no handgun ammo.
I did stand at the counter in another town For some 15 dollar .40 100 packs this week. They had a ton and I was going to buy 10 boxes of .40 for 150 bucks. After 20 minutes of watching employees walk by me (4 including the store manager many times) I gave up though. So I guess I didn't support them. I fully intended to. Like another poster says, I'm sure they are taking a loss on this ammo selling it and if its turned over to LE it's a tax write off. so maybe you are actually sticking it to "the man" by buying it. I sent my wife by my "local" (45 minutes away) walmart and they had no handgun ammo.
A brief prediction, Wal Mart will be totally out of the firearm and ammunition market in the next 5-10 years. One of the issues that large brick and mortar general retailers face is that specialty retailers can usually beat the general retailer on stock variety but maybe not on price. In some ways, the widespread availability of smart phones and shopping apps along with internet sellers is steadily shrinking that strategy for brick and mortar stores. Jewelry is one example, pharmacy is another, pet departments, and so on. So, large retailers have items that draw customers in at with some items at low prices so as to sell them other items at higher prices. At a certain point, however, the opportunity costs of having the floorspace devoted to items that are not moving sufficiently or that have higher labor costs causes a retailer to shift product mixes.
With the elimination of high frequency buyers on such ammo as semi-auto .223, 7.62x39, etc. and handgun ammo, to rely on hunting ammunition which is more or less a seasonal thing tells me that firearms are on their way out. WalMart is probably not going to continue having a department that relies on seasonal selling with the high regulatory costs of firearm and ammo sales. Toys and Christmas along with lawn and garden are a more natural fit as these do not require employee training, locked cases, etc..
Also, the less that WalMart buys from ammo companies and its uncertain guidance will probably lead firearm and ammo companies to redouble trying to sell to other competitors including better price breaks etc. Customers will shift buying patterns to new sources absent any policy changes by WalMart. At a certain point, Wal Mart probably will find that servicing the remaining gun customers is an unprofitable use of the space as its market presence declines in the mkt.
My personal guess is that the hassles of continuing to sell firearms and ammo combined with liability, politics of expanding into urban areas, and decreasing profitability from selling such caused WalMart to make this decision to start to phase out this line of sales. They more or less pulled such in quite a few stores back a few years ago but returned them to some stores when they found out male customers were going elsewhere to buy other items. Too lazy to look it up but you would probably find out about when by searching THR.
In the long run, I am not really sure about the gigantic one stop shopping general store viability with the increasing availability of the internet. We may go back to the future with specialty stores in brick and mortar for things that people do not want to buy online and internet sales.
With the elimination of high frequency buyers on such ammo as semi-auto .223, 7.62x39, etc. and handgun ammo, to rely on hunting ammunition which is more or less a seasonal thing tells me that firearms are on their way out. WalMart is probably not going to continue having a department that relies on seasonal selling with the high regulatory costs of firearm and ammo sales. Toys and Christmas along with lawn and garden are a more natural fit as these do not require employee training, locked cases, etc..
Also, the less that WalMart buys from ammo companies and its uncertain guidance will probably lead firearm and ammo companies to redouble trying to sell to other competitors including better price breaks etc. Customers will shift buying patterns to new sources absent any policy changes by WalMart. At a certain point, Wal Mart probably will find that servicing the remaining gun customers is an unprofitable use of the space as its market presence declines in the mkt.
My personal guess is that the hassles of continuing to sell firearms and ammo combined with liability, politics of expanding into urban areas, and decreasing profitability from selling such caused WalMart to make this decision to start to phase out this line of sales. They more or less pulled such in quite a few stores back a few years ago but returned them to some stores when they found out male customers were going elsewhere to buy other items. Too lazy to look it up but you would probably find out about when by searching THR.
In the long run, I am not really sure about the gigantic one stop shopping general store viability with the increasing availability of the internet. We may go back to the future with specialty stores in brick and mortar for things that people do not want to buy online and internet sales.
George P
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Sorry, but Walmart didn't jack you around. What they DID do was NOT raise their pricing to reflect market supply/demand issues which resulted in folks going in, buying it up and then selling it at flea markets and gun shows for stupid prices. had they raised their prices accordingly, the "shortage" never would have happened. Instead, they followed their internal pricing model, which kept their prices the same.
huntsman
Member
For me Walmart was my ammo supplier, I order my boutique ammo from Midway and occasional sales from Cabela’s online.
locally I hope family farm home or tractor supply step up with better selection and price, my LGS is a 40 mile round trip and prices are not as good as Walmart was.
online ammo stores IMHO are low hanging fruit for the gun grabbers so I’m not counting on them being around after next election so maybe it’s time to go revolver and reload .38spcl.
locally I hope family farm home or tractor supply step up with better selection and price, my LGS is a 40 mile round trip and prices are not as good as Walmart was.
online ammo stores IMHO are low hanging fruit for the gun grabbers so I’m not counting on them being around after next election so maybe it’s time to go revolver and reload .38spcl.
Amazon has its own problems but they are not a bricks and mortar store (for the most part leaving out Whole Foods). For all their stock value, their actual profit is not that high per share. The Price to Earnings ratio is 78 more or less which means that the market is predicting future growth in profit than its current $4.00 buck and change earnings right now.
The mall department stores got it first with the decline of malls as shopping destinations but Wal Mart's growth in sales revenue is increasingly stagnant. WalMart, despite the expensive acquistion of Jet.com, appears unable to really execute a move into online retail with its online experience being poor. Walmart's P/E ratio is about $24 and its earnings per share so far this year is around $2 and change per year which is the worst since 2007. Walmart did better ironically when the country's economy was worse and has declined relatively as it has gotten better.
Retailers grow explosively when they are able to use leverage between paying producers for the goods and getting money up front to expand. When they reach middle age where growth is now in the single digits, stores become tired, and so on, cost structures become greater, and they become ripe for disruption. A bad decision or two by a CEO results in something like what has happened to Sears. IN the 1990's, Sears had the Sear Catalog which was the closest thing to Amazon but chose instead to go into apparel and scrap the logistics and infrastructure that the catalog built up that could have created the next Amazon. They did that because retail markup for clothes was better, they did not foreseen internet shopping being a thing, and they did not want to cannibalize sales from the malls.
Business/ profits do not have principals (per se), they are in business to make money - a business just rides the wave. To me, it is counterintuitive to blame a business for following the whims of their customers - a business (like a politician) is a result, a responder, not a cause. It makes more sense for me to blame my fellow citizens, they drive that marketplace. If somehow we became Upside Down Land and slavery was in vogue again, Walmart would sell cages and shackles. Business is a follower, forever chasing customers/ trends - if you are looking for principals, righteousness and leadership, don’t hang your hat on business - you will be very disappointed.
Rock185
Member
Prices will start creeping up on ammo from online suppliers IMHO. I live in a smaller town, and Walmart is kinda like the mall here. They have most everything, and you will run into everyone you know there at some point. Usually sooner, rather than later. "Socially responsible", I don't know. ~*~Virtue Signalling~*~, For Sure ! I primarily shoot handguns now days, and have routinely bought plinking/range/practice ammo from Walmart. I use online suppliers for more exotic ammo not available at WM. Went in the other day, and all the handgun ammo is gone. LGS prices have always been high, and will undoubtedly be higher now. I will start doing more online ordering.
BTW, boom boom, I suspect WM will be out of the guns,ammo,etc. business even sooner. I'm guessing within two years. Just think of the wonderful Virtue Signalling/Socially Responsible opportunity that will be
BTW, boom boom, I suspect WM will be out of the guns,ammo,etc. business even sooner. I'm guessing within two years. Just think of the wonderful Virtue Signalling/Socially Responsible opportunity that will be
Prices will start creeping up on ammo from online suppliers IMHO. I live in a smaller town, and Walmart is kinda like the mall here. They have most everything, and you will run into everyone you know there at some point. Usually sooner, rather than later. "Socially responsible", I don't know. ~*~Virtue Signalling~*~, For Sure ! I primarily shoot handguns now days, and have routinely bought plinking/range/practice ammo from Walmart. I use online suppliers for more exotic ammo not available at WM. Went in the other day, and all the handgun ammo is gone. LGS prices have always been high, and will undoubtedly be higher now. I will start doing more online ordering.
BTW, boom boom, I suspect WM will be out of the guns,ammo,etc. business even sooner. I'm guessing within two years. Just think of the wonderful Virtue Signalling/Socially Responsible opportunity that will be
You may very well be correct because the main areas left to expand are urban areas that are quite used to forcing their politics on retailers to get development permits. Walmart was originally created in rural areas because the competition from local family owned businesses was easier than confronting suburban and urban markets at the time. However, they have pretty much maxed out in rural areas so future growth has to come from urban areas and foreign stores. Thus, I see that future Walmart CEO's will decrease any reliance on the rural trade and Dollar General/Family Dollar, etc. will probably pickup some of that trade along with farm and home type retailers.
fireside44
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To be honest me and my wife have found very few items that Wal Mart sells cheaper than the rest. I mainly bought groceries. They just repeat the lies about savings and people assume it's true. Maybe for cheap Chinese goods it is but I don't buy much Chinese unless it's hunan beef or stir fry.
LaneP
Member
I gave up buying ammo at Walmart during the Great Shortage of 2008-2016. They simply never kept any stock at the stores I went to, and that was if I could find someone to go over to the counter to help me. Now I buy online and that gets me by just fine.
Probably over a decade ago, I saw a market analysis of Walmart where that Walmart tracked prices on common goods and package sizes sold by others and did very good on pricing for those items. The idea was that these were the items most likely to be price checked. The example that stuck out to me was a four pack of 60 watt lightbulbs where Walmart made sure to have cheaper prices than competitors, but their single light bulb cost markup on things like 100 watt single and double bulbs was incredible. Other store chains did the same but lacked the computing resources to do the sort of market tracking in real time that WalMart did. Walmart also did a good job tailoring to individual markets in those days and controlled its own shipping and warehousing. Now, though, Amazon and others have caught up on computing analysis and logistics and those that did not sharpen their competitiveness went under.
Today, the smart phone has eroded that ability to do that as well as making it easier to check for availability from other sources.
Fine Figure of a Man
Member
Pick another product Wal-Mart sells. Lets say they quit selling soap. Are we faced with spending our life savings on a bar of Irish Spring or being filthy forever?
No, the free market will fill the void.
No, the free market will fill the void.
crestoncowboy
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And that was part of my point. As long as California keeps setting standards for all the other states and keep getting re- elected for it then others will follow suit with these restrictions. And if your gun store was marking 550rd 22 up to 80 dollars a box then they will do the same with any other ammo when they are the only source. I have 30 or 40 gun stores in a 2 hr radius. All of them tripled their prices on rimfire because they knew people needed it (or thought they needed it). Dunhams and Walmart kept their prices the same. I still bought online but many don't like to for whatever reason. I had never bought a gun online until then, choosing to pay more from the brick and mortar stores. Now I've changed my buying habits.
Tractor supply has a decent opportunity to sell ammo with all the safes they sell. I've never saw one that did though
Groceries, school supplies, and motor oil and filters are about all I've found
cougar1717
Member
Here's the story, quotes below.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...o-doug-mcmillons-memo-gun-changes/2200572001/
Direct quotes from Walmart CEO Doug McMillon:
"After selling through our current inventory commitments, we will discontinue sales of short-barrel rifle ammunition such as the .223 caliber and 5.56 caliber that, while commonly used in some hunting rifles, can also be used in large capacity clips on military-style weapons;
We will sell through and discontinue handgun ammunition; and
We will discontinue handgun sales in Alaska, marking our complete exit from handguns."
"Our remaining assortment will be even more focused on the needs of hunting and sport shooting enthusiasts. It will include long barrel deer rifles and shotguns, much of the ammunition they require, as well as hunting and sporting accessories and apparel. We believe these actions will reduce our market share of ammunition from around 20% to a range of approximately 6 to 9%."
If the premise of the question is whether all ammo prices will rise due to WM's reduced offerings, the answer is no. The economics of supply and demand for the types of ammo in question is much larger than WM sales. That demand will be picked up by those who have supply - be that your local big box outdoor store, your farm and home store, or online sales.
WM is making a calculated move here. They are still going to sell rimfire, shotgun, and long rifle ammo. When I went one location, they didn't have 223 bulk packs anymore, but they still were carrying 223 SP boxes of 20. It's the hunting ammo exception.
"We have a long heritage as a company of serving responsible hunters and sportsmen and women, and we’re going to continue doing so."
While it may make it inconvenient for those who almost exclusively sourced handgun and 223 ammo there, other places still sell it. There is no sense in considering this news something to be feared. If you're reading an online forum, more likely than not, you've made an online purchase. There are plenty of businesses willing to take your money for the guns and ammo WM doesn't sell. If you are a rural individual who always pays cash for ammo and is concerned about your purchase records and WM was your main vendor, I suppose you will have to reconsider how you shop.
WM got out of handguns years ago in the lower 48 and is getting out of handgun ammo. They stopped selling AR-15's more recently, and are getting out of bulk 223 ammo. They are making a political statement and are willing to live with the lack of ammo sales. They will join Sports Authority and Dicks to some extent, but WM's stance is incrementalism.
However, think about this from their perspective.
They have experienced tragedy with in store shootings. People have also used their stores for exerting their OC rights and scared off their customers. If customers do not feel safe, they will not purchase there.
"We have also had well-intentioned customers acting lawfully that have inadvertently caused a store to be evacuated and local law enforcement to be called to respond. These incidents are concerning and we would like to avoid them, so we are respectfully requesting that customers no longer openly carry firearms into our stores or Sam’s Clubs in states where “open carry” is permitted – unless they are authorized law enforcement officers."
"A month ago, in El Paso, Texas, a gunman with an assault-style rifle launched a hate-filled attack in our store, shooting 48 people resulting in the loss of 22 innocent lives."
While I do not agree with their conclusion, I can understand why they would take that stance, based on their experiences.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...o-doug-mcmillons-memo-gun-changes/2200572001/
Direct quotes from Walmart CEO Doug McMillon:
"After selling through our current inventory commitments, we will discontinue sales of short-barrel rifle ammunition such as the .223 caliber and 5.56 caliber that, while commonly used in some hunting rifles, can also be used in large capacity clips on military-style weapons;
We will sell through and discontinue handgun ammunition; and
We will discontinue handgun sales in Alaska, marking our complete exit from handguns."
"Our remaining assortment will be even more focused on the needs of hunting and sport shooting enthusiasts. It will include long barrel deer rifles and shotguns, much of the ammunition they require, as well as hunting and sporting accessories and apparel. We believe these actions will reduce our market share of ammunition from around 20% to a range of approximately 6 to 9%."
If the premise of the question is whether all ammo prices will rise due to WM's reduced offerings, the answer is no. The economics of supply and demand for the types of ammo in question is much larger than WM sales. That demand will be picked up by those who have supply - be that your local big box outdoor store, your farm and home store, or online sales.
WM is making a calculated move here. They are still going to sell rimfire, shotgun, and long rifle ammo. When I went one location, they didn't have 223 bulk packs anymore, but they still were carrying 223 SP boxes of 20. It's the hunting ammo exception.
"We have a long heritage as a company of serving responsible hunters and sportsmen and women, and we’re going to continue doing so."
While it may make it inconvenient for those who almost exclusively sourced handgun and 223 ammo there, other places still sell it. There is no sense in considering this news something to be feared. If you're reading an online forum, more likely than not, you've made an online purchase. There are plenty of businesses willing to take your money for the guns and ammo WM doesn't sell. If you are a rural individual who always pays cash for ammo and is concerned about your purchase records and WM was your main vendor, I suppose you will have to reconsider how you shop.
WM got out of handguns years ago in the lower 48 and is getting out of handgun ammo. They stopped selling AR-15's more recently, and are getting out of bulk 223 ammo. They are making a political statement and are willing to live with the lack of ammo sales. They will join Sports Authority and Dicks to some extent, but WM's stance is incrementalism.
However, think about this from their perspective.
They have experienced tragedy with in store shootings. People have also used their stores for exerting their OC rights and scared off their customers. If customers do not feel safe, they will not purchase there.
"We have also had well-intentioned customers acting lawfully that have inadvertently caused a store to be evacuated and local law enforcement to be called to respond. These incidents are concerning and we would like to avoid them, so we are respectfully requesting that customers no longer openly carry firearms into our stores or Sam’s Clubs in states where “open carry” is permitted – unless they are authorized law enforcement officers."
"A month ago, in El Paso, Texas, a gunman with an assault-style rifle launched a hate-filled attack in our store, shooting 48 people resulting in the loss of 22 innocent lives."
While I do not agree with their conclusion, I can understand why they would take that stance, based on their experiences.
entropy
Member
I think you are right about the direction it is headed, but I don't think it will be that fast unless there is a Dem. takeover in Nov., and possibly not even then. For now there are no further decreases in ammo availability. Guns and ammo are somewhat seasonal, but not entirely, and Walmart sells other seasonal outdoor merchandise, too. it is tailored for the specific area of the store. We have a lot of Archery stuff, in addition to guns and ammo, and the ice fishing display went out last week.
denton
Member
You can buy ammunition already put together? Why wasn't I told?
FROGO207
Member
When I do venture into a WM I already know what I want and that it is a deal or I will shop elsewhere first. Ammo is seldom what I go there for either. Last time I remarked about how the self checkout area has grown and regular checkout counters are endangered. I commented that when they convert to self checkout I will just stay home and order from Amazon. The checkout clerk said that would be ok with them as their job would be easier. I replied it sure will, you will no longer be employed will you. That will be a reason to stop selling firearms and ammo rite there! I am somewhat concerned about sellers keeping track of our purchases when cash is no longer needed or used. That makes it ripe for abuses of the 2A and other rights by our .gov! Like you go and order a few pounds of nails for a project and some fertilizer and then your wife orders a pressure cooker the same day. Then the swat team visits at 0 dark thirty because you fit a profile.
That will be a reason to stop selling firearms and ammo rite there! I am somewhat concerned about sellers keeping track of our purchases when cash is no longer needed or used. That makes it ripe for abuses of the 2A and other rights by our .gov! Like you go and order a few pounds of nails for a project and some fertilizer and then your wife orders a pressure cooker the same day. Then the swat team visits at 0 dark thirty because you fit a profile.
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Old Dog
Member
I will freely admit that I shopped Wal-Mart regularly for ammo, as my local WM stores had better prices on 9mm, .45 ACP and .223/5.56mm including tax than I could get shopping on-line with shipping.
But since WM caved to the gods of political correctness and don't even sell SWAT Magazine, American Handgunner or other gun mags with pics of handguns or AR-15s on the covers, discontinued selling ALL handgun and AR-15 ammo, I have ZERO reason to set foot in a Wal-Mart ever again.
But since WM caved to the gods of political correctness and don't even sell SWAT Magazine, American Handgunner or other gun mags with pics of handguns or AR-15s on the covers, discontinued selling ALL handgun and AR-15 ammo, I have ZERO reason to set foot in a Wal-Mart ever again.
Haven't shopped W-Mart ammo for years. My local wmart had such limited variety and availability I just gave up. Easy to do since there are dozens of better vendors out there, on-line and at Gun Shows. I'm talking better supply, better prices, and better customer service.....WAAAAY BETTER!!
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