OCD load development

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Yeah, I guess I reloaded for 25 years before I even bought a chronograph. The rest came from too much time on my hands.

There can be a lot gained from data but it’s not uncommon to become lost in data either or just not interpret it correctly, gather too few data points, etc.

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Mabey some cowboy will get to the point of dissolving mixed powders in acetone & extruding your own. Now THAT is bragging rights.
 
DeepSouth said:
friend of my wife, her husband was ... cutting the longer grains in half ... If there is such thing as OCD reloader, it’d be him.
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After addressing the zero drift of the "analytical/lab" digital scale, inspired by jmorris and Nature Boy to resolve powder to single kernel, I ventured further down the "OCD" rabbit hole of handloading - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...lab-scale-for-120.873830/page-2#post-11627511

Under max-zoom examination with my phone (Wife uses a lab grade microscope for her chicken breeding and was my back up if max-zoom on phone didn't do it ;)), I found Varget granules were not consistent in length and cut shape.

index.php


As you can see in above picture that while most kernels are of similar length, some are shorter (almost half the length) and some have angled cut ends.

And this variation in length and cut shape resulted in variation of single kernel weight variation.
LiveLife said:
I started adding additional kernels and each kernel would increase reading by 0.001 g to 0.002 g (.02 gr to .03 gr) depending on the size/length of kernel I added.
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DeepSouth said:
... he kind of grinned and said “I don’t really think it helps, but it makes me feel better”
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Well, cutting the kernels in half certainly would alter the burn characteristics the powder was tested under to develop published load data.

Would resolving powder charge to single kernel make a difference on target? May be not as there are other reloading variables and shooting variables that could overshadow the minute variation of powder charge whether by volume or weight. But if you are OCD enough to get to that point, it may and ultimately holes on target will show if that's the case.

We live at the coast near the beach and usually have all of our windows wide open. When wife noticed all the windows in the house were closed and I was "tinkering" with the scale on the kitchen breakfast counter, she asked "Honey, why are all the windows closed?" I replied, "Oh, just doing another myth busting project for the gun forum." and she replied, "That's nice ... Can you open the windows back up when you are finished?"

I don't think I am an OCD reloader at all ... Wife thinks everybody does what I do. :p
 
LiveLife said:
After addressing the zero drift of the "analytical/lab" digital scale, inspired by jmorris and Nature Boy to resolve powder to single kernel, I ventured further down the "OCD" rabbit hole of handloading - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...lab-scale-for-120.873830/page-2#post-11627511

Under max-zoom examination with my phone (Wife uses a lab grade microscope for her chicken breeding and was my back up if max-zoom on phone didn't do it ;)), I found Varget granules were not consistent in length and cut shape.

index.php


As you can see in above picture that while most kernels are of similar length, some are shorter (almost half the length) and some have angled cut ends.

And this variation in length and cut shape resulted in variation of single kernel weight variation.
​


Well, cutting the kernels in half certainly would alter the burn characteristics the powder was tested under to develop published load data.

Would resolving powder charge to single kernel make a difference on target? May be not as there are other reloading variables and shooting variables that could overshadow the minute variation of powder charge whether by volume or weight. But if you are OCD enough to get to that point, it may and ultimately holes on target will show if that's the case.

We live at the coast near the beach and usually have all of our windows wide open. When wife noticed all the windows in the house were closed and I was "tinkering" with the scale on the kitchen breakfast counter, she asked "Honey, why are all the windows closed?" I replied, "Oh, just doing another myth busting project for the gun forum." and she replied, "That's nice ... Can you open the windows back up when you are finished?"

I don't think I am an OCD reloader at all ... Wife thinks everybody does what I do. :p
Click to expand...


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LiveLife said:
After addressing the zero drift of the "analytical/lab" digital scale, inspired by jmorris and Nature Boy to resolve powder to single kernel, I ventured further down the "OCD" rabbit hole of handloading - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...lab-scale-for-120.873830/page-2#post-11627511

Under max-zoom examination with my phone (Wife uses a lab grade microscope for her chicken breeding and was my back up if max-zoom on phone didn't do it ;)), I found Varget granules were not consistent in length and cut shape.

index.php


As you can see in above picture that while most kernels are of similar length, some are shorter (almost half the length) and some have angled cut ends.

And this variation in length and cut shape resulted in variation of single kernel weight variation.
​


Well, cutting the kernels in half certainly would alter the burn characteristics the powder was tested under to develop published load data.

Would resolving powder charge to single kernel make a difference on target? May be not as there are other reloading variables and shooting variables that could overshadow the minute variation of powder charge whether by volume or weight. But if you are OCD enough to get to that point, it may and ultimately holes on target will show if that's the case.

We live at the coast near the beach and usually have all of our windows wide open. When wife noticed all the windows in the house were closed and I was "tinkering" with the scale on the kitchen breakfast counter, she asked "Honey, why are all the windows closed?" I replied, "Oh, just doing another myth busting project for the gun forum." and she replied, "That's nice ... Can you open the windows back up when you are finished?"

I don't think I am an OCD reloader at all ... Wife thinks everybody does what I do. :p
Click to expand...

I discovered the different kernel weight when I got my GP250 scales. It's amazing all the little stuff you thought were uniform are not.

Since I worked in a R&D center for over 20 yrs OCD was a requirement if you want repeatable data. I was a natural fit, do it right the first time then confirm on the second run and your done. One of the engineers I worked with could not duplicate any test. He was one of those close is in the ball park. Did not work well in the lab.
 
Blue68f100 said:
I discovered the different kernel weight when I got my GP250 scales. It's amazing all the little stuff you thought were uniform are not.

Since I worked in a R&D center for over 20 yrs OCD was a requirement if you want repeatable data. I was a natural fit, do it right the first time then confirm on the second run and your done. One of the engineers I worked with could not duplicate any test. He was one of those close is in the ball park. Did not work well in the lab.
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I was a lab rat for a year, I was so bored I nearly lost my mind
 
+1,+2,+3 Yup I'm OCD as well!!! South Prairie Jim has it nailed. Have you been speaking with my wife???
 
Engineer1911 said:
I am presented with 100 to 150 rounds of 'range pick-up ammunition' per week to "dispose of" because the store can't sell it. Some of it is lost, dropped, misfires, or jams. Jams are rounds that failed to feed in semi-auto pistols or rifles. I shoot the stuff that fits a case cage and has a good primer. The other stuff is pulled down and sorted. Bullets go into same Weight & Caliber boxes, brass sorted by caliber and powder into either of two bottles 1] Pistol Powder is 22 LR to 500 S&W, may include 7,62 X 39. 2] Rifle Powder is 22 Hornet to 45-70. The Rifle or Pistol powder is thoroughly mixed before reloading ammunition with it.
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I'm quite serious.

Review 2 or 3 reloading manuals for 38 Special with 148 / 150 grain wad cutter bullets. Almost any powder with 2.8 to 4.5 grains is a safe load. I load 3.5 grains of 'Pistol Powder' in a 38 Spl case with the Lee cast wadcutter bullet. The wadcutters are cast from melted "range scrap", composition unknown, lubed with home brewed lube made with beeswax, Tacky red grease, candle wax, spoonful of ATF, all melted together in a 3# metal coffee can. The bullets are fired in K- , L- or N-frame S&W 357 magnum revolvers. Muzzle velocity is 750 FPS nominal. Accuracy is as good at 50 YARDS as my "pure load" Accurate Arms #5 using the same bullet. I have had no problems in shooting over 3,000 rounds using "Pistol Powder"

I achieve similar results with 223 brass and 55 grain FMJ and 22 grains of "Rifle Powder" in a bolt action 223. My prairie dog loads group at 1/2" at 100 yards on a calm day. The blasting ammo holds 1-1/2' groups at 100 yards. The fun starts when shooting out to 400 yards at the steel tombstone targets. I have as much success as the 'Match Ammo' boys for much less money.
 
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Engineer1911 said:
I'm quite serious.

Review 2 or 3 reloading manuals for 38 Special with 148 / 150 grain wad cutter bullets. Almost any powder with 2.8 to 4.5 grains is a safe load. I load 3.5 grains of 'Pistol Powder' in a 38 Spl case with the Lee cast wadcutter bullet. The wadcutters are cast from melted "range scrap", composition unknown, lubed with home brewed lube made with beeswax, Tacky red grease, candle wax, spoonful of ATF, all melted together in a 3# metal coffee can. The bullets are fired in K- , L- or N-frame S&W 357 magnum revolvers. Muzzle velocity is 750 FPS nominal. Accuracy is as good at 50 feet as my "pure load" Accurate Arms #5 using the same bullet. I have had no problems in shooting over 3,000 rounds using "Pistol Powder"

I achieve similar results with 223 brass and 55 grain FMJ and 22 grains of "Rifle Powder" in a bolt action 223. My prairie dog loads group at 1/2" at 100 yards on a calm day. The blasting ammo holds 1-1/2' groups at 100 yards. The fun starts when shooting out to 400 yards at the steel tombstone targets. I have as much success as the 'Match Ammo' boys for much less money.
Click to expand...


Sounds like a better plan than I had.

One Saturday afternoon, I was cleaning the bench. Had 30 or so, various shotshells that collapsed, crimp was bad, some reason it was mot shootable.

I carry a bunch in the house, to disassemble.
Got a "butter bowl" to dump shot in. A shotshells box to put wads in, dumped the powder into an old ashtray ( I hadn't smoked in a few years, but we kept the ashtray for visitors use ) and dropped the hulls into a shoebox to be deprimed.

I had done the tear down and was in my reloading room depriming. I had just finished and heard car door slam. Was walking in, when I see a flash and hear screams.

I run in, wife and daughter were looking like ghosts. I never had to tell daughter not to be smoking in my house, ever again. She heard me coming and put her cig in my ashtray. LoL
 
Engineer1911 said:
I'm quite serious.

Review 2 or 3 reloading manuals for 38 Special with 148 / 150 grain wad cutter bullets. Almost any powder with 2.8 to 4.5 grains is a safe load. I load 3.5 grains of 'Pistol Powder' in a 38 Spl case with the Lee cast wadcutter bullet. The wadcutters are cast from melted "range scrap", composition unknown, lubed with home brewed lube made with beeswax, Tacky red grease, candle wax, spoonful of ATF, all melted together in a 3# metal coffee can. The bullets are fired in K- , L- or N-frame S&W 357 magnum revolvers. Muzzle velocity is 750 FPS nominal. Accuracy is as good at 50 feet as my "pure load" Accurate Arms #5 using the same bullet. I have had no problems in shooting over 3,000 rounds using "Pistol Powder"

I achieve similar results with 223 brass and 55 grain FMJ and 22 grains of "Rifle Powder" in a bolt action 223. My prairie dog loads group at 1/2" at 100 yards on a calm day. The blasting ammo holds 1-1/2' groups at 100 yards. The fun starts when shooting out to 400 yards at the steel tombstone targets. I have as much success as the 'Match Ammo' boys for much less money.
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An Engineer that has fallen off the deep end and gone to the Dark Side.(The Low Road)

Fellow members of NSPE and ASCE, ASME and all the rest have cried out in horror.!

:what:
 
Guilty as charged; American Society of Quality Engineers, American Society of Mechanical Engineers, Society of Manufacturing Engineers, National Society of Professional Engineers, American Society of Safety Engineers, and Registered Professional Engineer. A veritable Chorus of Dismay sung in harmony, fortunately I left it all behind 10+ years ago when I retired.

We Support and Encourage Thread Drift, Scale Drift, and Powder Variation.
 
The flame from a primer is not round but elliptical. How do orient so they are all the same and have you discovered if vertical or horizontal is more consistent and do you just turn the round or take the primer out and turn it?
 
10wt308 said:
The flame from a primer is not round but elliptical. How do orient so they are all the same and have you discovered if vertical or horizontal is more consistent and do you just turn the round or take the primer out and turn it?
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Don't forget "air gap" between primer flash hole and powder charge, especially for semi-auto that slams powder charge forward when chambered.

For some of my loads, I do case fill calculations with selection of bullet type, seating depth, powder and charge to produce near 100% case fill loads to minimize air gap so powder granules are in contact with flash hole when chambered - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...ished-load-data-for-9mm.870180/#post-11544839

OCD? Nah ... :p
 
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I'm going to guess my major SD problems stem from having too many short sticks or long sticks of IMR powder per charge (for high or low variations, respectively...) in my reloads... certainly not charge variances, neck tension, or chrono variations. I'll have to look into that...
 
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