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"one shot stop" for knives?

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kannonfyre

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Feb 19, 2003
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There've been the famous "one shot stop" evaluations done for bullet calibers but have there ever been any evaluations done for the potential self defense effectiveness of various popular knife models?

For example, SOG's SEAL 2000 vs Kar-Bar's USMC fighting knife, both connected to robotic arms to test for stabbing/slashing depth on a pig carcass or parrying stability vs a constant attacking force?
 
Hmmm... Well I for one don't buy into the concept of a firearm one-shot-stop. IMHO, I'm not sure any knife could be counted on to immediately "stop" a determined opponent either. Unless you can lop off a head, knife wounds are somewhat time delayed. It takes time to bleed out. Folks can take a real impressive amount of damage - cuts and stabs - and keep working. Don't get me wrong, I think knives make fearsome weapons up close. But a "one-stick" stop - I just can't see it under most/all circumstances. :evil:
 
I think the mechanics of blades cutting or stabbing work a bit differently than bullets - protective vest test tend to bear this out. Wounds caused by stabbing or cutting can vary greatly and are dependent on a slew of variables. How long is the blade, how sharp, what blade geometry, what angle, etc.. In general terms most knives of similar size and format should do similar damage - that is I'm not too sure anyone could tell the difference between a stab/cut wound that a KaBar or a Sog2000 might inflict. Most evals of knives look at cutting ability in some medium say cardboard or rope, strength, chopping ability, edge holding, and resharpening. I guess you could gauge tissue damage by poking and cutting up a roast. If you go over to Bladeforums or Knifeforums you will see many excellent evals of all sorts of combat blades.
 
Wasn't the one shot stop determinig the % of times the agressor ceased all hostilities and not deaths?

Of course there would be swords/daggers carried by legions of Romans that did quite well.

If we limit it to knife lengths the American Bowie certainly has a reputation for getting men to cease hostilities aganst another when one knows how to ue it.

Brownie
 
about "one shot stops" - back about 20 years ago a Chicago cop hit a perp with a 12 gauge slug which took off all of the connections on the top of the perps heart - IOW from the moment of the hit he was dead, he just wasn't aware of that fact yet - the perp (who was running on Angel Dust) then wrestled the shotgun away from the police officer, BEAT HIM TO DEATH WITH IT, ran around the corner into an alley, and dropped dead.

I would submit that except for a decapitation, there is no sure one shot stop with a blade weapon.
 
How about "one whack" stops?

1796 Light Cavalry Saber
Indian Talwar
Katana
Falcata
Claymore
Halberd

None of these is very concealable. Especially the halberd. Well, I suppose you could try to pass the halberd off as a pruning tool. It is, so to speak. Just for pruning different life forms. :D
 
A Khukuri as short as 15" overall can do a "one whack stop" straight overhead through the skull.

I took a try at designing such an "overhead wallop" blade that was even shorter by a bit (9" blade) but could still stab well:

outsider.jpg

Came out pretty good :cool:.
 
Check out www.bladeforums.com and surf it for reviews and comments on blades.

Many people do endurance, hard use tests on knives and you can pick up info on reliability issues.

No such thing as OSS ratings for knives (there shouldn't be any for guns/calibers either), it all comes down to the operator and not the tool.
 
How about a two-handed downwards thrust into the top of the skull? I've read somewhere that the Fairbairn-Sykes knife was very good at accomplishing this.
 
Fairbairn-Sykes knife was actually a dagger. Illegal in most states here in the USA.

The sentry removal targets for this weapon were usually into the top of the shoulder at the neck and kidney areas.

Hadn't heard about the top of the head and though possible probably not performed in real life often if at all. Too many chances for the knife to glance off the skull if not performed right.

Brownie
 
From what I recall of the class I took with Brownie -- correct me if I'm wrong, Brownie -- many street knife fights are not "'duels to he death" but are settled when the first person to get slashed feels pain, sees blood, and decides that a visit to the emergency room or bathroom sink is preferable to continuing with the present course of action.

We were taught countering slashes and thrusts. Block a slash, slash their forearm or wrist, perp looks down in surprise, clamps knife hand over free hand or vice-versa, you stick them once more, and run.

For a knife that's legal to carry and likely to be used in any reasonable SD scenario I believe "one stab" stops are an interesting concept but hardly applicable.

I like the saying about knives -- someone surely knows it better than me -- they never run out of ammo, never misfire, can't be limp-wristed, etc. etc.
 
You remember well grasshopper.;)

You have seen and learned how to defang the snake.

If you can defang them by quick defensive slashes to their hands or wrists as they reach in there isn't much they can do to hurt you after that.

Like the secret service is trained, the threats come from hands. Take the use of the hand away or prevent them from holding onto their weapon and they aren't much of a threat.

As you have been trained in these techniques and practiced them, you also know not to reach out for them but to allow them to extend to you. As they extend they lose strength in the arm. As you are waiting and covering you have all the power available when you connect with them.

ACP: you know the theories and moves which work and would be considered strictly defensive in nature. There are few duals to the death but many can succumb to their wounds hours later.

While others feel you need to reach into the opponents "inner circle" and stab someone once or multiples to get them to stop their aggression you know by doing so that you are extending yourself, and vulnerable to attack and injury, as you are attempting to put the "bite" on them.

Glad to see you remember the theories and techniques which keep you from opening up to their attack or panicing under attack from another.

BTW--Thye may have the will to continue but don't have the ability to hold onto a weapon if you can defang them at their hand or wrist. They don't have to give up but without the use of their hand they aren't much of a threat either.

"Draw straight, keep your steel sharp and watch your back"

Brownie
 
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