Opinion Change - Safety Course Should Be Required
- Thread starter Hanzo581
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Good Ol' Boy
Member
The "good old days".
Basic firearms education should ABSOLUTELY be taught in grade school at some point.
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Hanzo581
Member
That is strange logic, we don't want the government requiring us to learn basic firearm safety, but we do want the government teaching us firearm safety as long as it's to kids in school?
Orcon
Member
No Hanzo, you seem to really not understand how rights work. You are endowed by fact of being with certain rights and your only demand on others is to afford you acknowledgement of those rights. If I ever caught myself saying the things that you are saying here, to quote Justice Scalia, I would hide my head in a bag.
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Hanzo581
Member
Orcon said:
Oh I understand perfectly how rights work. And just like with every single other right there are limitations and regulations.
Orcon
Member
Oh so unalienable rights are subject to the limitatons and regulation of the hand-wringing, safespace crowd. I must have missed those parts of the Bill of Rights, Federalist and Anti-federalist papers. I certainly don't remember John Locke touching on the subject.
Good Ol' Boy
Member
There's a difference between being taught something in grade school and being forced to do something as an adult.
As others have mentioned, basic handling of firearms, what to do if you find a firearm are great starters. Just general understanding of most firearms would be a step in the right direction, and was apparently done at one time in the past.
For me it seems like, getting kids familiar with the basics early on should negate a lot of the idiocracy we see right now.
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Hanzo581
Member
Orcon said:
So no limitations on any rights sound reasonable to you? I mean right to bear arms means I should be able to buy an RPG at my local gun show right? Maybe some frag grenades? I have always wanted a Javelin.
And how about felons? Why shouldn't their right to bear arms be automatically restored the moment they are released? How about people carrying while drunk or high? Certainly not allowing them to is an infringement.
See this is the problem with you guys, it's all or nothing.
Red Wind
Member
Hanzo581 said:
Seven states,Alaska,Arizona,Kansas,Maine,Mississippi,Vermont, and West Virginia ,not only don't require any firearms training, they don't even require a permit. And these 7 states run the gamut of culture and terrain over almost all the United States.
All you need to carry a gun, open or concealed, besides having a pulse, is being of age, and not having any mental or criminal "issues" .
I don't believe these states are reporting any noticeable upticks in crime or accidental firearm deaths or injuries. Probably the reverse is true.
Mandatory training just adds another infringement to the 22,000 worthless gun control laws now on the books. We need this mandatory training requirement about as much as my Weimaraner needs more fleas while out in the field.
Carl N. Brown
Member
Think of the Chicago gun law requiring people to have training, but using zoning laws to hamstring any ranges in Chicago where training could be held because the political machine doesn't want to allow legal guns. Period.
My training to be certified as eligible to apply for a Tennessee permit to carry cost $75 and could be held over three working days or as a marathon Saturday morning and afternoon. 4 fours Gun law, written test; donuts and coffee; 4 hours gun safety, written test; firing a qualifying target at the firing line.
That is not enough for true gun haters. I think Illinois started with 16 hours, $800, requirement that you get absence from work (classes on weekdays 9am to 5pm only), barriers and obstacles designed to discourage. That's the history of gun control in America.
I think general gun safety courses should be available, encouraged but not required.
My training to be certified as eligible to apply for a Tennessee permit to carry cost $75 and could be held over three working days or as a marathon Saturday morning and afternoon. 4 fours Gun law, written test; donuts and coffee; 4 hours gun safety, written test; firing a qualifying target at the firing line.
That is not enough for true gun haters. I think Illinois started with 16 hours, $800, requirement that you get absence from work (classes on weekdays 9am to 5pm only), barriers and obstacles designed to discourage. That's the history of gun control in America.
I think general gun safety courses should be available, encouraged but not required.
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Hanzo581
Member
Carl N. Brown said:
Fair enough. In that point I can see where they are using a requirement to dissuade people from owning guns.
So I'll just keep slipping my gun safety leaflets in customers gun boxes and keep trying to help new shooters when I can. I figured this thread would be a little controversial here, but a little excitement never hurt anyone.
David Blane
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Individuals are smart. Large groups of individuals, not so much.
Everyone should have at least the basic training to be safe with the firearm of their choice.
Everyone should have at least the basic training to be safe with the firearm of their choice.
here is an interesting read
http://www.gunlaws.com/HighSchoolMarksmanship.htm
http://www.gunlaws.com/HighSchoolMarksmanship.htm
Orcon
Member
Absolutely, the more the merrier. If they're safe enough for the doofuses in the federal government then they're safe enough for the rest of us.
A felony is, typically, a life sentence as prescribed by the state legislature in the jurisdiction the crime was committed. Rather absurd of you to compare felons with people who have not been accused in a court of law, let alone convicted of any crime. It really underscores your ignorance. We are a republic, these things are to be handled by the states and the citizens therein not some hamfisted federal bureaucracy.
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Hanzo581
Member
Orcon said:
......and we're done here. I can look past the childish insult but I don't have time for lunacy.
MICHAEL T
Member
Good we will have a safety course and you pay for every one to take out of your pocket.
Fat chance right. Then drop the silly idea. Doesn't say something like shall not be infringed some where.
Fat chance right. Then drop the silly idea. Doesn't say something like shall not be infringed some where.
Orcon
Member
Don't be afeared of liberty Hanzo. Our second amendment isn't about hunting, looking cool at the range or paper punching.
entropy
Member
I think there should be govenrment mandated firearms training- for all citizens attaining the age of 18; just like in Israel and Switzerland.
Red Wind
Member
.308 Norma
Member
Seven states,Alaska,Arizona,Kansas,Maine,Mississippi,Vermont, and West Virginia ,not only don't require any firearms training, they don't even require a permit.
Idaho joined that list on July 1st this year, Red Cloud. Our local left-leaning news medias cried great big, crocodile tears over it. They've kind of shut up about it now, but I suspect they're just biding their time, waiting for a gun-related accident, or a road-rage incident where someone pulls a gun. Then they'll pounce. They'll either hint, or outright claim the incident wouldn't have happened if the person with the gun would have had "proper" training.:banghead:
ColoradoMinuteMan
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Each of these imbeciles likely transport themselves to and from the store in a tool much more dangerous than a firearm. If safety training was truly effective we'd have far fewer car accidents than we do today. People don't get killed using firearms because they have no idea that it is dangerous to point a gun at another human being, they get killed because of human error due to not paying attention to detail, lack of common sense, or neglecting to follow the rules. These issues cannot be solved by training. Look how many people still smoke, drink and drive and use drugs despite hammering this into people's head from he earliest age in school. Firearms safety training is not complex training. It is basically common sense as applied to firearms as well as some confidence building in operation. If everyone was trained in life to have common sense and personal responsibility it would eliminate the need for most basic safety training for almost anything with the exception of use of complex equipment and chemicals that require specific knowledge that isn't covered by common sense. If someone has to tell an adult that pointing a gun at a living thing you don't intend to kill is a bad idea, then training will not help. If you have to tell someone to keep, keep loaded firers out of the reach of individuals who are not informed enough to have common sense or self control ( i.e. young children) then training will not solve this. You don't need special training to buy gasoline, you don't need it to purchase sharp knives, you don't need it to buy a nail gun, you don't need it to purchase a car, you don't need it to buy a pit bull, you don't need it to buy a chainsaw, you don't need it to buy an axe, you don't need it to by razor blades, you don't need it to by cigarettes, you don't need it to buy hydrochloric acid, you don't need it to buy a jack to to jack up your car and get under it, you don't need it to have a child, you don't need it to weld, you don't need it to buy a bow, you don't need it to deep fry a turkey, you don't need it for any number of potentially dangerous and deadly activities. The only reason anyone thinks you need it to buy a gun is because guns have been stigmatized by anti-gunners as somehow being this evil tool that nobody in their right mind should have the right to use without permission of those who know better than you.
People should have training and should have safety courses. I would support any idea like a gun store that offers free range time and a basic safety course for buying a new firearm on a voluntary basis. Firearm safety and training needs to be taught in schools again like it was years ago. It should be taught at an early grade level and again at Jr. and regular High School.
But never, should there be required as a barrier to purchasing a gun. Never should there ANY barrier like a waiting period or some laborious process or long procedure before one can acquire a firearm.
Firearm safety and training can also be organized by neighborhood watch groups. By neighbors and friends. And even offered as a course through the county extension curriculum.
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But never, should there be required as a barrier to purchasing a gun. Never should there ANY barrier like a waiting period or some laborious process or long procedure before one can acquire a firearm.
Firearm safety and training can also be organized by neighborhood watch groups. By neighbors and friends. And even offered as a course through the county extension curriculum.
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Red Wind
Member
A very fine summation, Midwest.
And an excellent post by ColoradoMinuteMan..
And an excellent post by ColoradoMinuteMan..
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