Opinions on Russian Mosin-Nagants?
- Thread starter Drjones
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Mosin Pros:
Cheap
Reliable
Rugged
Fun
Mosin Cons:
Ammo twitchy
Clunky action, at least compared to other turn bolts
Bad, spongy triggers
Limited sights
For what they were designed for, they are wonderful guns. I don't expect more than minute of pie-plate, and am seldom disappointed but don't expect a hyper accurate, slick gun. They weren't ever supposed to be that, and few are.
Cheap
Reliable
Rugged
Fun
Mosin Cons:
Ammo twitchy
Clunky action, at least compared to other turn bolts
Bad, spongy triggers
Limited sights
For what they were designed for, they are wonderful guns. I don't expect more than minute of pie-plate, and am seldom disappointed but don't expect a hyper accurate, slick gun. They weren't ever supposed to be that, and few are.
Okiecruffler
Member
Believe it or not, the long barrels are surprisingly well balanced. But with the carbine you get the roar and the fireball that the Mosin is famous for.
DMK
Member
Well, the 1938 I have is a well worn soldier, so that wouldn't be a fair comparison, but mine are all more accurate than my pristine Russian M-44 (but they have the advantage of no bayonette hanging off the end of the barrel).
As you know, the 91/59 carbiness were made by cutting down surplus 91/30 rifles somewhere around 1959. They were repaired/reconditioned and then put away in storage. Some say that rifles built in peacetime are made much better than those made during the war. Not such a rush schedule and no falling bombs or artillery to distract the machinists.
The three examples I have are in beautiful shape with mirror bores. (The one in the pics above was my first one and actually the least pretty of the bunch since it has some splices in the stock. The other two have no such blemishes.) I think that on average, the condition of these is much better than the 1938s and many of the M-44s that I've seen. I think that just gives them a great advantage to be better shooters.
MuzzleBlast
Member
Downsides
Spongy, squishy trigger
Groups a foot high at 100 yards.
VERY stiff bolt - really have to slap it open and shut.
BUTT UGLY.
That's about it for downsides.
Upsides:
Fairly tight groups, even if they are a foot higher than aiming point.
DIRT cheap ammo.
Cheap.
History.
Spongy, squishy trigger
Groups a foot high at 100 yards.
VERY stiff bolt - really have to slap it open and shut.
BUTT UGLY.
That's about it for downsides.
Upsides:
Fairly tight groups, even if they are a foot higher than aiming point.
DIRT cheap ammo.
Cheap.
History.
OEF_VET
Member
The 7.62x54R is a 'three-line' caliber round, or .3 inches. Therefore, if an an arshin were 28 inches, it would seem to me that there would be about 280 'lines' in an arshin.
Frank
Cosmoline
Member
Actually, the bolt should NOT be stiff. They often are on mixed-number Mosins but not on all. A Mosin in good condition, esp. a Finn, should not be sticky. None of mine are.
The claims that they are ugly has always surprised me. I think the lines of the classic 91/30 are beautiful. It's true they are radically different from Mausers and modern day bolt actions, but that makes them different, not ugly. I guess it's in the eye of the beholder.
The grouping problems come up mostly with M-38's and M-44's. Most 91/30's I've had have grouped on target. Mojo sights are a good cure for this problem. You can also substitute a nail for the front post sight as a fix.
The trigger IS spongy. Even on the Finns. I suspect it was kept this way since the rifles need to be usable in cold months, when the shooter may have heavy gloves on. You don't want a hair trigger then.
The claims that they are ugly has always surprised me. I think the lines of the classic 91/30 are beautiful. It's true they are radically different from Mausers and modern day bolt actions, but that makes them different, not ugly. I guess it's in the eye of the beholder.
The grouping problems come up mostly with M-38's and M-44's. Most 91/30's I've had have grouped on target. Mojo sights are a good cure for this problem. You can also substitute a nail for the front post sight as a fix.
The trigger IS spongy. Even on the Finns. I suspect it was kept this way since the rifles need to be usable in cold months, when the shooter may have heavy gloves on. You don't want a hair trigger then.
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Daniel T
Member
Cosmoline, what's an M41? Do you mean the M44? Earlier, you refered to the M41 as "the carbines with the built-in bayonets." Isn't it the M44 that has the built in bayonet?
Cosmoline
Member
Typing too fast. My bad.
I forgot one other major benefit of Mosins, esp. vs. Mausers. The Mosins have very cheap carbine versions. Mauser short carbines are rare birds, and often fetch a high price. The only one I've seen was an Iranian M-48 I owned for a little while before selling. It was too rare to do anything with.
I forgot one other major benefit of Mosins, esp. vs. Mausers. The Mosins have very cheap carbine versions. Mauser short carbines are rare birds, and often fetch a high price. The only one I've seen was an Iranian M-48 I owned for a little while before selling. It was too rare to do anything with.
Dave Markowitz
Member
Doc, you NEED a Mosin-Nagant. At least one. They are the most bang for your buck currently available.
The M1891/30s are nicely balanced, although long. I think it would be really neat to take one deer hunting.
The carbines -- M1938, M1944, and M91/59 -- are light and handy, and belch out a HUGE fireball in broad daylight. (They also kick like a mule.
)
The various Finns are the nicest of the lot, IMO. The Finn m/1939 is the most comfortable M-N to shoot (for me anyway), due to its weight and the stock design. The Finnish rifles are also quite accurate.
I have a Finn m/1892, m/1939, and a Soviet M1891/30. I need to get a carbine, either a M1938 or a 91/59 to round out my collection. Inspect any you get, though, as even the 91/59s have the occasional lemon. E.g., a friend has one and the bolt release is so worn that you don't need to activate it to just pull the bolt out of the rifle.
The M1891/30s are nicely balanced, although long. I think it would be really neat to take one deer hunting.
The carbines -- M1938, M1944, and M91/59 -- are light and handy, and belch out a HUGE fireball in broad daylight. (They also kick like a mule.
)The various Finns are the nicest of the lot, IMO. The Finn m/1939 is the most comfortable M-N to shoot (for me anyway), due to its weight and the stock design. The Finnish rifles are also quite accurate.
I have a Finn m/1892, m/1939, and a Soviet M1891/30. I need to get a carbine, either a M1938 or a 91/59 to round out my collection. Inspect any you get, though, as even the 91/59s have the occasional lemon. E.g., a friend has one and the bolt release is so worn that you don't need to activate it to just pull the bolt out of the rifle.
Daniel T
Member
Heh, you had me thinking there was yet one more MN that I had to buy.
Cosmoline
Member
I also favor my 91/30's to the carbines. I've hiked with both, and to my surprise the 91/30 was easier on me. I typically just held the barrel and let it balance over my shoulder, and it didn't give me any trouble. It's a good design.
Rupestris
Member
These M-N threads have peaked my interest. The price and the ammo prices can't be beat. I have a couple questions:
1, Does anyone have any experience with the Polish T-44 (1944) model?
2, does it differ in performance and/or quality compared to the Russian or Fin.?
3, Are the Polish models worth the difference in price?
Its probably silly but, being polish, I'd like to have one.
Thanks,
Rupe
1, Does anyone have any experience with the Polish T-44 (1944) model?
2, does it differ in performance and/or quality compared to the Russian or Fin.?
3, Are the Polish models worth the difference in price?
Its probably silly but, being polish, I'd like to have one.
Thanks,
Rupe
Cosmoline
Member
The Polish M-44's are primarily of interest because of their near-mint condition, with gorgeous stocks and very deep blue. Reports on accuracy are mixed. A lot of them shoot very high and group wide, but some are quite good shooters for such a short carbine. Most seem to shoot better with the bayonet extended. By all means get one, though. Actually get four or five and that way you'll be able to pick the best shooter.
Here's Tuco's take on them:
http://www.mosin-nagant.net/Polish-M44.html
Here's Tuco's take on them:
http://www.mosin-nagant.net/Polish-M44.html
If you see any mosins with my name on it, get it. Those are the Finns as said before, and they are a lot prettier than the Russians, in my opinion. They cost about the same. My first mosin was a Finn, but I didn't even know it at the time. I had just seen those rifles online and said: Hey, what the heck. Go for em' they are great buys!
Kingson
Member
Hey Cosmoline
I picked up a M38 Finnish capture at my local gun store about a month ago for $25. It was made in 1941. The stock is a little beat up (some one carved AL in the stock) but over all it's pretty good.
I picked up a M38 Finnish capture at my local gun store about a month ago for $25. It was made in 1941. The stock is a little beat up (some one carved AL in the stock) but over all it's pretty good.
Rupestris
Member
Thanks for the quick reply Cosmoline. The Polish M-N's I've seen on gunbroker and the like have been gorgeous. Minuite of beer can is all I'd be looking for. If I find one that shoots better than that, its a bonus.
Theres a huge gun and knife show at the Silverdome (former home of the Detroit Kittens) comming up in January. I'll be looking for one there.
Theres a huge gun and knife show at the Silverdome (former home of the Detroit Kittens) comming up in January. I'll be looking for one there.
LynnMassGuy
Member
I love my 91/30. Get one! It will be $79 very well spent.
goalie
Member
AIM just sent me a Tula hex reciever 91/30 in excellent condition that is dated 1934. All the parts match without any lining out, even the bayonet has a serial number on it. Not bad for under 70 bucks, I was impressed and happy with my first C&R purchase.
Cosmoline
Member
Great deal! A matching Tula hex is about the best 91/30 you can buy. I'd be curious to know what kind of groups you get with it. My bet is if the bore is still good you'll be able to get 2MOA.
M2HMGHB
Member
Hey cosmoline my 91/30 shoots horribly. I would guess the bore diameter is at least .323 inch, not sure if it was counterbored or not. It is a 1934 matching hex reciever with Finn capture marks, however the trigger spring has to be replaced. How do you tell if it's counterbored?
Tropical Z
Member
A 91/30 wearing its bayonet is as beautiful as any rifle out there IMHO!~
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