Ordering from Atlantic Firearms

[giggitygiggity]

I am looking to order a rifle from Atlantic Firearms. However, I am slightly confused by this passage:

"Payment Options: certified check, or money orders. No personal, company checks or COD's. Website pricing relects a 3% cash discount for certified fund transactions. VISA & MASTERCARD would not reflect the 3 % discount There is no tax on orders outside of Maryland."

Does this mean that if you use VISA or MASTERCARD credit cards, you will be charge 3% more than the price shown on the Internet? What are certified fund transfers? It seems asinine that you would be charged 3% more just because you use a VISA or MASTERCARD. If that's the case, I'll buy elsewhere. Can anybody clear this up for me? Thanks.

 

[kev74]

That 3% covers a portion of what it costs them to process a credit card transaction. It seems like discount and low volume retailers are doing this more and more as margins tighten and credit card companies do their best to squeeze them dry.

If the convenience of using a credit card is worth 3% of the purchase price, then so be it. Otherwise, its money order or shop elsewhere.

 

[ozarkhillbilly]

Yes, it means if you use your credit card they will charge you more money because they do not want to pay the fee that the credit card company charges them for the use of the card. Many small gun dealers claim that their profit margin is too small for them to eat the 3% so they want you too.

I am not saying it is wrong or right. Just the way it is.

 

[giggitygiggity]

Does KVar have a fee for credit card usage? Also, what are certified fun transactions? Thanks.

 

[iiibdsiil]

Having had my own (non-gun) store, I've always considered the 3% the cost of making the sale. I'd much rather have $20 in my pocket, move inventory, make my supplier happy, and make the customer happy.

If someone does that to me, I look at the final price and decide if it's still a price I'm willing to pay. If it gets close to what someone else is charging, I go with the someone else.

I think most people are willing to pay with a credit card if you just shut your mouth and add the 3% in to the price that is advertised to them. When you let them know they are being punished then it is turning people away possibly. I understand the internet is cut throat and everyone is trying to have the lowest advertised price. They can always add the $5 or $10 onto the shipping and recover some of the costs.

The other thing is I do not buy anything online that I can't buy with a credit card or e-check. Someone else has the thing for the same price somewhere else and does make my life easier. I want it paid for now, shipped within 48 hours, and over with. Mailing a money order, waiting 5 days for that to get there, then they slap another day on to ship it, mix that with an added 4 days (2 weekends) and I don't even want the thing anymore. I don't have envelopes or stamps.

 

[clarence222]

You might want to call or email them. Some of dealers I do business with charge for credit cards but don't charge for using a debit card

 

[kingpin008]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Certified_Funds

Google is your friend.

 

[hammerklavier]

You should be happy that they are willing to give the 3% break to cash purchasers rather than charging them the 3% credit card fee also (and pocketing that) as MOST retailers do.

 

[Atlantic Firearms]

Rather than build the cost into the sale we try to offer options to our customers , we have some business cards that charge us up to 4% on a sale , the profit margin is already slim and if you loose almost half to credit card fees it is hard to pay the employees etc.

 

[The Lone Haranguer]

Does this mean that if you use VISA or MASTERCARD credit cards, you will be charge 3% more than the price shown on the Internet?

This is not unusual in the business, and the company is being up front about it beforehand instead of surprising you later. That 3 or 4% is what Visa and Mastercard charge them for every transaction. American Express is even higher.

 

[Quoheleth]

Many small gun dealers claim that their profit margin is too small for them to eat the 3% so they want you too.

In case you've missed it, Buds - a THR favorite, and hardly a "small gun dealer" - does this, too. Their website lists their "cash price" to your door. At least they say that it's a cash price. I believe it was Centerfire - or maybe it was Sarco - that pulled that 3% on me last year and their website didn't say anything about a cc surcharge.

Q

 

[Beelzy]

Some fools who charge that fee don't know that the CC Co. does NOT allow that.

They tend to get pissy when they find out too.

 

[Kindrox]

The 3% is big in low margin sales. Say the gun shop pays $90 for a gun and sells it for $100. The credit card fees eat 30% of the profit!

If credit card fees don't hurt the retailer, they are in a high profit margin business. If a retailer will risk pissing off customers for that 3%, they are likely giving you a good deal. Why don't you be nice in return?

 

[Atlantic Firearms]

FYI guys we also try to support the members of this board with discounts , usually we will offer free ship or discounts depending on the item , anytime you contact us please let us know you are a HR member and request a discounted price quote.

 

[HKUSP45C]

Some fools who charge that fee don't know that the CC Co. does NOT allow that.

They tend to get pissy when they find out too.

You're very wrong and a little right at the same time.

Credit card companies do not allow you to charge a premium above the normal price of an item for accepting their cards. This is to ensure that consumers will not be disuaded from using their product by paying a higher price.

The CC companies CAN NOT however keep a company from offering a discount for using another payment method, like cash.

Which is what the vast majority of merchants do. The have a price for an item, they also offer a discount on that price if you pay cash. They advertise the discounted price with the disclaimer that the advertised price REFLECTs the discount.

They aren't charging a fee for using a CC they are offering a discount for using cash, because cash customers don't cost them 2.5-4.5% of the sale.

It is a bit of semantics but it's also an important distinction.

 

[Darkness]

I know it's semantics, and it takes a little more effort on the retailer's side to work the numbers, but, I would prefer to see something like:

Such and such firearm; Price: $412
Pay by cash or certified funds: $400

Rather than:
Such and such firearm; Price: $400
Pay by credit, add 3%: $412

That way, it looks like you get a discount for using cash instead of a penalty for using Credit. I know it all comes to the same thing, but my gut instinct is to favor the discount rather than the addition.

It's all perception, and that's just mine.

 

[mgkdrgn]

The 3% is big in low margin sales. Say the gun shop pays $90 for a gun and sells it for $100. The credit card fees eat 30% of the profit!

Or more. The "margin" on new guns is pretty much non-existent for the small dealer. Every day I see "New In Box" guns for sale on gunbroker for -less- than I can buy them for wholesale from distributors.

The only thing with any "margin" on it are the new models (Ruger LCP, 3" chamber Taurus Judge for examples), which the small dealer can't get because they are on "allocation" (ie, only being shipped to large volume dealers).

That 3% might be -all- the margin I get.

 

[freakshow10mm]

Half offer cash discounts and the other half build the fees into the price. Every sale of ammunition I lose 14% in credit card fees and FET.

Boils down to: If you agree the final bottom line price is a fair price you are willing to pay, then pay it. If not, buy elsewhere.

 

[danbrew]

The "rule" that you're thinking of is the one in the credit card agreement executed by the merchant. They typically say that you can not charge a premium for accepting their card vs. a competitive card. They don't say you cannot charge more for credit card use - only that if you charge for credit cards, you can't charge more for their card. This provision was pioneered by American Express because they charge 4% while Visa/MC charges 3%. Amex didn't want to be put at a disadvantage and included a provision in their merchant agreement that the merchant can't charge more to accept Amex (because it would, rightly so, drive down usage of their card).

Completely as an aside, none of the card issuers can *make* a merchant do anything. If the merchant doesn't abide by the agreement, they can simply cancel the merchant agreement with that particular merchant - meaning they can no longer accept Amex (or whatever). Would this hurt the merchant? Maybe. I rarely spend cash and instead put as much as I can on my Amex. I pay it off every month and reap the benefits of Membership Miles.

 

[freakshow10mm]

Which the cash back rewards, airline miles, other perks are paid by the merchants (businesses). Different levels or perks on a card dictate the discount on the sale charge (ie the CC fee). If you have a rewards card, fees can be as high as 5.5%. This is also why some merchants build the average 3% fee into their pricing and not give a cash discount is to help pay the additional fees by some using rewards cards or cash back cards. In reality it costs more than the CC processing fee to accept credit cards and the merchant is well within their rights to recover those costs. That is business 101, recover your costs and make a profit on your investment.

 

[Z-Michigan]

As noted, this is fairly common in this business, and is done by Bud's and numerous sellers on Gunbroker. I see nothing wrong with it as long as it's disclosed. Sometimes the extra 3% is worth the convenience and other times I'll send a cashier's check to save myself $10 or $20.