P-3AT vs. J-frame ?

Which for pocket carry?

  • Total voters
    280
Status
Not open for further replies.
Mine has had acceptable reliability (3 jams in ~250 rds.).
END QUOTE

Sorry but thats not good reliability. I would not feel good about a gun that had 1 malfunction in 1000 rounds. I would be scared to carry a weapon that displayed that type of un-reliability.
Pat
 
Reliabilty is the number one factor in choosing a handgun for self defense. Everything else comes a distant second place. The snubbies are perhaps the most reliable small handgun you can own. The Kel-Tec is known for having reliabilty problems. I think the choice is pretty clear. The J-frame has been around for well over 50 years and is still one of best choices. The Kel-Tec has been around for a few years and without a shadow of a doubt will NOT be around in 50 years.
 
Had a Beretta Tomcat; in draw drills I ended up giving myself "Slide Tracks". Didn't care for that so I went back to my "Bobbed Snubbie" (RB) Model 37 Airweight w/ factory checkered panels and a Tyler "T" grip.
 
P3AT in my pocket right now. Mine is a 1st gen gun. Once I found the correct ammo, CCI blazer 90gr Gold Dot, it is 100%, 400+ rounds with out stoppage and the only thing I did was polish the chamber and feed ramp. I use the clip and carry in the front right pocket without a holster. even dressed for 100+ degree heat, it didn't print. Heck, I went two weeks at my mothers before she even knew I had it, and that was only because I emptied my pockets in the kitchen before getting ready to rack out. No revo will ever carry as well as a Kel-Tec, as for bringing into service, I carry with one in the tube, so it is draw, point, squeeze. What can be faster?
 
Both my Kel-Tecs have been 100%. BTW I have a P11 and a P3AT and the triggers are not the same. The P3at has a nice short 5.5# pull and the P11 does have a long 8.5# pull but mine is smoothing out very nice.
 
Someone mentioned that you need baggy pants to pocket carry a j-frame. I take the opposite approach. My jeans are kind of tight. I carry in the front pocket but leave the small boot grip out. Once in the pocket I pull it to the side, back toward the hip. This locks in in place. You could lift me off my feet by pulling on the grip and the gun will not come out. To get it out simply tip the grip slightly toward the center of your body and pull lightly. With and sort of an untucked shirt or sweater, your out the door.
Safety issues aside, this will carry equally as well with or without a pocket holster. With a speed strip in my watchpocket I don't even need a belt.
 
I own both. The KT for about a year before I got the j-frame. (M37 bobbed hammer). I haven't carried the KT since I got the snubby. Funny thing though, when I carried the Kel-Tec I ALWAYS had it on me. Now when I carry, it is my snub or a "belt-gun" but there seems to be more times when I don't carry at all. Maybe the best gun IS the one you ALWAYS have with you?!
 
My ideal pocket gun would be a Kel-Tec that maybe cost two or three times as much and maybe weighed a little bit more, but was made with the finest precision parts.

Big Bink - I'll have to try your method - but I'll need to be sure that my shirt was long enough. if you wrap a bit of cloth around the handle it won't look like a gun handle. Also, if the gun prints in your pocket despite the pocket holster, stuff in a bit of cloth or something to break up the outline. For years I've carried a J-frame in my front pocket with the handle removed to make it more compact. I cover the handle frame with a bit of plastic and tape. The tape doesn't look so much like a gun handle either, in case soemone notices.
 
Last edited:
Here's what happened:

Picture%2075.jpg


I found a dealer that was selling them for $340 new, and I figured that was a fair enough price (not great, but not bad). Time to get speedloaders, speed strips, new grip, pocket holster ... :D
 
Mini 642 Range Report

Matt: PM sent.


I took the 642 out to the range today. Put 150 130 gr. WWB and 25 125 gr. +P WWB rounds through it before I called it quits (my hand was killing me ;) ). Perfectly reliable right out of the box ( I did clean it before I shot it), as expected.

This gun is difficult to shoot - gonna need a LOT more practice. I tried hitting a target at 15 yards that I printed out from my printer - and didn't even hit paper. :eek: For comparison's sake, I can usually do 3"-4" at 25 yards slow-fire offhand with my CZ-75. As I got used to it, I started hitting more consistently. The gun seems pretty accurate if you take your time and hold the trigger at the point right before it breaks - I could plink range debris on the berm at 50 yards if I concentrated, so the problem ain't with the gun.

I'm glad I got the hammerless J-frame - it would have been very tempting to cock the hammer at the range, but the grip of the J-frame is such that (for me, anyway) cocking the hammer would be massively impractical in a real-world defense scenario. I tried some one-hand and off-hand stuff, too - my strong-hand shooting wasn't bad, but my off-hand shots were literally all over the place.

The recoil is sharp - like someone hitting your hand with a wooden mallet. This is a very poor choice for beginning shooters. I think the people who dreamed up the .357 magnum 12 oz. J-frames are either playing a very cruel joke or simply don't understand the physics of loading a very light gun in a caliber with more recoil than a .45 Auto.

The 642 carries very well - I need to get a pocket holster, but my 642's trigger is so absurdly heavy (I'm used to SA autoloaders, after all) that I pocket-carried all yesterday and today with no fear. It prints a lot like this, but let's face it - most people are so oblivious to what's in people's pockets that it doesn't matter too much.

All in all, well worth the money!
 
I am retired and spend a lot of time reading and posting on a variety of gun stuff. Although I don't own a Kel-Tec P-3AT it sure seems to me that there are a lot of posts attesting to the owner's trouble with the gun. Some posts, of course, from owners who swear that the gun has been absolutely trouble free for them. Fewer of those however.

I think I would be really disinclined to buy one of these little guns on just the basis of the sheer volume of complaints that I have read. This make any sense?
 
Originally posted by dairycreek
I don't own a Kel-Tec P-3AT it sure seems to me that there are a lot of posts attesting to the owner's trouble with the gun.
Click to expand...

It’s similar to hearing folks complain about Windows as their computer operating system. When you sell more of your product than all your competitors combined, you get more complaints even if you have no greater failure rate. Kel-Tec sells more of its featherweight mouseguns (about 1,000 per week) than all the other mouseguns combined.
 
I would bet there are far more J frames out there than Kel techs yet no complaints on the J frames.
Pat
 
I would bet there are far more J frames out there than Kel techs yet no complaints on the J frames.
Pat
Click to expand...
The J frame is simpler mechanically but my wife did have to send a new one back, as she was getting light strikes ever-other pull of the trigger. It is also thicker than two P-3ATs and weighs almost as much as both of them plus they would have 14 rounds of Cor-Bon :)

Don’t get me wrong, if I had to use an unfamiliar gun in an emergency, I would go for the revolver, unless it was one of those internal locking Taurus with a plastic key and I couldn’t tell if it were locked or not. :D
 
Too me the Airweight at 16 ounces is light enough. And if you want you can go as light as 11 ounces with the new Titanium scandium guns.
Pat
 
Exactly! A pair of P-3ATs would be under 15oz and cost about $450. I own a few revolvers but I prefer to carry a pistol. I doubt I could change your mind and you can’t change mine, so we shall agree to disagree :)
 
Part of the reason I went for the J-frame was because I've never owned a revolver, and it seemed like a good way to pick up some classical revolver skills (ejecting empties, using speedloaders, rapid-fire DA). I figure that you never know when you might need to use a revolver if the SHTF. Another thing to note is that a bunch of my friends have Kel-Tecs, so it would've gotten a bit boring. Finally, I prefer aluminum/steel over polymer (but polymer's okay!).

I'll probably try the P-3AT at one point or another - doesn't look like Kel-Tec is going anywhere with the popularity of its guns.
 
To each his own. I generally prefer autos too except for the pocket gun class. I have tried a bunch from the Tomcat to the NAA Guardial and Colt Pony and I have not found the reliability and power I want. So your right to each his own.
Pat
 
A couple of hints on the 642's trigger. Order the Wolff spring kit for the j-frame. It comes with several different springs to choose your pull weight. I put a lighter spring in and while I had it apart dabbed the internals with a little lithium grease. It makes a huge difference in the trigger pull. And makes it much easier to shoot both trigger and accuracy wise.
Next at your range sessions don't fire so many rounds per session. As your hand starts to fatigue and hurt your just wasting ammo. I go 50 rounds at a time. If you don't like the +p rounds a 148gr. HBSWC isn't a bad defense load in a j-frame. Most of the .38's are made for 4" barreled guns and don't expand reliably out of a 2" barrel anyways.
Taking that into account the wadcutters cut a full sized channel which is going to be bigger than a jhp that doesn't expand. Next they are very easy to shoot and accurate. You know the old saying only hits count. Plus you get good penetration and the sharp edge on the wadcutter lacerates instead of just pushes flesh out of the way. A perfect load? Far from it. But a short barreled weapon is a compromise. The wadcutters have been used for a long time by very knowledeable people.
 
Yeah, I wouldn't normally fire that many rounds in a single session, but I needed to make sure nothing was wrong with the gun.

I'm kind of afraid of taking off the sideplate. I don't want to mess up the screws. I'll probably just shoot it until I get used to it.
 
Kahr PM9

I hav the J-frame airweight, the Kel-Tec P-32, and the P-3AT. I agree that the Kel-Tecs are the only true pocket pistols. They are an easy carry and I carry my P-3AT in the back pocket of my jeans in a pocket holster. Many time I forget I have it with me. In some cases that could be a problem. I sold the P-32 because I want to carry the highest caliber possible. I have not had any major reliability problems with the P-3AT. The P-3AT is not a fun gun to shoot but it is an easy carry. However I also have a Kahr PM9 (9mm) that I am able to carry in my back pocket. It is not as small or light as the P-3AT but it is extremely reliable and handles very well. I carry the Kahr when ever possible in place of the P-3AT. However, the price tag of $600 may steer you away from to Kahr but I love this weapon. I haven't carried the J-frame in years.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

C
  • Locked
  • Poll
I Need Your Help
Replies
19
Views
819
45crittergitter
4
K
  • Locked
P-3AT Questions...
Replies
16
Views
1K
Carbon_15
C
N
  • Locked
Vintage OMC 380 vs Modern Keltec P 3AT, shooting tips?
Replies
10
Views
989
outerlimit
O
R
  • Locked
Kel Tec P-3AT 380
2
Replies
36
Views
8K
alamo
A
B
  • Locked
  • Poll
Need Input on Pocket Carry Guns
Replies
24
Views
2K
FrogClan
F
Back
Top