Physics Teacher Under Fire for Physics Experiment

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Guyon

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I LOOKED BUT MISSED THE OTHER THREAD ON THIS TOPIC. MODERATOR CLEAN UP ON AISLE 4 PLEASE.




Source: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2006/05/25/TEACHER.TMP

MILL VALLEY
Physics teacher under fire for gun experiment
Parent's complaint raises issue about legality of stunt
- Peter Fimrite, Chronicle Staff Writer
Thursday, May 25, 2006

Every year, physics teacher David Lapp brings his Korean War era M-1 carbine to school, fires a shot into a block of wood and instructs his students to calculate the velocity of the bullet.

It is a popular experiment at Mill Valley's Tamalpais High School, where students are exposed to several unique stunts that Lapp performs in his five classes every year to illustrate inertia, velocity and other complex formulae.

Turns out, it also may be illegal.

It is a felony to bring any rifle, loaded or unloaded, onto a school campus without the written permission of the school district superintendent or his designee, according to Marin County District Attorney Ed Berberian.

Actually firing a gun inside a classroom would, in all probability, be considered a "reckless discharge" and could bring about harsher punishment under Penal Code section 626.9, better known as the Gun-Free School Zone Act of 1995.

The problem of guns in schools has been a particularly emotional issue, especially since two students went on a rampage and killed 15 people at Columbine High School, in Littleton, Colo., on April 20, 1999.

Through it all, though, the focus has always been on students with guns. Nobody expected teachers to bring firearms to school.

"I'm hoping that this is not happening in Marin County," said Berberian, who groaned when informed that it was. "If he just did this in an open classroom with a block of wood, there could be ricochets. That in itself would be a presumption of recklessness."

The rifle demonstration would not even be an issue if an anonymous parent had not complained.

Lapp, a former military police officer who has been teaching for 20 years, said it is the first complaint ever lodged against the so-called "ballistic pendulum" experiment, which he contends is completely safe.

The .30-caliber bullet, he said, is fired into a foot-long, 8-pound block of wood hanging by cords from a ceiling mount. The students take measurements of the block's movement and mass and use that information to calculate bullet speed.

He said he fires the shot from point-blank range with all the students standing behind him, so there is no danger of an accident or ricochet. There has never been an injury or close call, he added.

"I've been doing this for years," said Lapp, who skipped two or three years after Columbine. "The students love it. They ask about it very early on in the year. It's one of the more exciting demonstrations."

Exciting is not the word, said Ted Feinberg, the assistant executive director for the National Association of School Psychologists.

"It's just absolute madness, from my point of view," said Feinberg, one of the founding members of the National Emergency Assistance Team, which has responded to most of the school shootings in the country. "It is not only crazy in concept, in light of the world we live in it is absolutely irresponsible."

Feinberg said he is shocked that a teacher would bring a gun to school in the wake of tragedies like Columbine, regardless of the educational purpose.

"Were there not other ways of illustrating whatever physical principles he was trying to demonstrate?" Feinberg asked. "What's the message we are giving bringing a loaded gun into a public setting and firing it off. It's a terrible model to project on students."

Lapp, who served in the Army from 1977 to 1980, became a teacher in 1986. He said he and the former Tamalpais High principal checked the legality of the experiment when he first started doing it around 1992 and determined that there were no laws against it. It has recently been done with the full written consent of Principal Chris Holleran.

Although Bob Ferguson, the current superintendent of the Tamalpais Union High School District, was unaware of the experiment, both Lapp and Holleran said they believed the ballistic pendulum experiment was legal.

"It is certainly something that one pauses about, but we felt that it was something that was OK because of the educational value," Holleran said. "Most students get a lot out of it. It's an interesting and dramatic example of physics in action."

Holleran said school administrators and the district will review the legality of the experiment and immediately make changes if, in fact, what Lapp is doing is illegal.

Unusual experiments are a hallmark of Lapp's five physics classes, two of which are honors courses. In addition to the ballistics test, Lapp also lies on a bed of nails and invites students to break a cinder block on his chest with a sledge hammer.

"It's a demonstration of Newton's law of inertia," he said.

In another experiment, Lapp cooks a steak in 15 seconds between two sheets of metal that are hooked up to a wall outlet.

"If you were a senior in high school and you were wondering what the relevance of high school was, it would be much more authentic if you measured actual things, like the speed of a bullet," Lapp said. "It lends authenticity to a classroom."

It is not clear what will happen now, but, Holleran said, if the school's approval of Lapp's experiment was a mistake, it was in an attempt to reach out in an innovative way to teenagers.

"He's a terrific teacher who does a lot of wonderful things to bring physics to life," Holleran said. "The students really get a lot out of his class, so we provide him with a lot of latitude. We've never had complaints about (the ballistic pendulum experiment), and it has probably been done in front of 900 to 1,000 students over the years."
 
When I was in High Schoolin '75, the Navy ROTC used to drill with 1903A3 Springfield rifles. These were the same rifles that they used in their high power rifle matches! They had an arms room with an ammo locker, there in the school. Never had a problem back then.:fire:

This fobia that too many "do gooder" teacher types have about "guns" makes me crazy!
 
Idiot said:
"It's just absolute madness, from my point of view," said Feinberg, one of the founding members of the National Emergency Assistance Team, which has responded to most of the school shootings in the country. "It is not only crazy in concept, in light of the world we live in it is absolutely irresponsible."

Feinberg said he is shocked that a teacher would bring a gun to school in the wake of tragedies like Columbine, regardless of the educational purpose. "Were there not other ways of illustrating whatever physical principles he was trying to demonstrate?" Feinberg asked. "What's the message we are giving bringing a loaded gun into a public setting and firing it off. It's a terrible model to project on students."
We have a new contender for the coveted #1 spot on my Top 10 Dumbest Statements 'Card Has read On The Internet list.
 
Being an Mechanical Engineering student, I see as a very practical way to demonstrate the actual physics involved with the problem.

That exact problem was on an exam I have taken at the college level and many times before. It is a mainstay as a fundamental application of physics.

DCH
 
My physics prof in college did the same thing w/ a .22 caliber rifle. It's a pretty straight forward demonstartion of the conversion of kinetic energy into potential energy.
 
Waaaay back in the mid '70s, my physics teacher used to use a .22 air gun in the classroom for experiments dealing with velocity and energy.

He DID hit a student on the chin with a ricochet one day, though there was no great uproar about it.
Teacher: Are you all right, Andrew?
Andrew: I'm fine sir.
Teacher: Right, I'll reload and try that again.
:rolleyes:
 
"If he just did this in an open classroom with a block of wood, there could be ricochets.
From a block of wood???? I'd send him a letter of praise, if my kids were there. Great demo.

Either that, or he's too cheap to buy a chronograph. ;)
 
I'm sure there are better ways to describe it, but I found it amusing that the first phrase that popped into my head was "Blathering nincumpoop".
 
It's a classic physics experiment. Every mechanics book I have ever seen has a score of problems on ballistic pendulums.

Conservation of energy, conservation of momentum: good stuff.
 
I'm a science teacher.

My first reaction to the pro posts is that the first thing everyone tells someone thinking of building a range anywhere-even in a basement-is BACKSTOP. If this school is constructed like most, I would be mightily concerned about what is beyond to target. I have also taught welding and nothing made me pucker more than thinking how many cinder block walls a full gas cylinder can penetrate before it even slows down.

I do this demonstration, but with a potato cannon and with a piece of 3/4" plywood against the far wall. I also do it with a pnuematic gun so I can consistently control the pressure and there is no "combustion". The pressure aspect is also used in another lesson.

I for one think that more guns (ccw) on campus may be a good thing. With all the background checks a teacher goes through plus the ccw checks I think we are just as entitled to carry a weapon as the school resource officer. Many of us have written the legislature asking for the state trooper training during the summer to allow this.

Overall, I think this was probably a bad call. A warning and request to do something different is all that should be done but I am afraid that this guy will be burned at the stake as an example. I know teachers that have been fired for less.

My school had 9 different people come and try to tell me I could not run my homemade tesla coil in class. When the head electrician for the county showed up and said he didn't know what the h*ll it was but he seems to know what he is doing- they left me alone.

Brandon
 
My former wife was a a career teacher and a member of the teachers' union. What you must all keep FIRMLY in mind is that exceptional teachers, who challenge and excite student minds, are anathema to the "system" and must be eradicated at all costs, lest it be noticed that other, less exciting teachers are not actually "teaching" but simply occupying space in classrooms.
 
Philosophical question:

Which would be more tragic?

The 1 in 10^8 possibility of a ricochet causing an injury (and perhaps 1 in 10^10+ chance of a death) in the course of carrying out this experiment/demonstration...

or the 1 in 1 possibility that schools are currently stocked full of apathy, laziness, and inneffective ritual that passes for education?


There is no question that there is danger involved with the teacher's demonstration, but if you truly care about helping kids regarding education then your time should be so occupied with real concerns that invented ones such as this ought not to merit a response.
 
Sounds like a good experiment to me. It's just that the stupid liberals are fear-mongering again.

It is a sad, sad world that is developing. I pity those who think otherwise.:cuss:
 
I was discussing the ballistic pendulum the other day and a Google found all sorts of advertisements for classroom apparatus to demonstrate the principle at low power and not even look like a nasty old gun. Doesn't catch the attention of the little hellions like a carbine, though.

A generation of namby pambys. Two. No, three. Administration, most teachers, most students.
 
Physics Experiment

"IN LIGHT OF THE WORLD WE LIVE IN".??! How much worse would this world be if teachers like Mr. Lapp hid their abilities to teach with imaganition & to only follow established State guidelines? How boring would that be. Without teachers like Mr. Lapp who helps unlock the mind's of our childern, we probably wouldn't be using our computers to discuss this topic. Illeagle? Probably. Irresponsible, Maby. Totally cool & mind expanding? YOU BET!!!:D :D :D :)
 
OK so next semester, assuming the guy doesn't get thrown in prison, how about just taking a field trip out to the local outdoor shooting range to conduct the experiment with a proper backstop, hearing protection, and whatnot.

This avoids all issue of the gun-safe school zone B.S., and has the added benefit of showing the students where their local shooting range is.

Besides, what student doesn't like a field trip?
 
My suggestion to the teacher:

-contact the local range and make it a field trip. I'm sure they'd love to help out. Better yet, they probably have several members who'd be happy to bring out several different guns so the students could work the problem with several different calibers/bullet wieghts/velocities.

-also, consult the book Backyard Ballistics for ideas on launching all sorts of household items.
 
My physics professor did the same experment with a .22 revolver in college. This was in 1997. Our classroom was technically still part of the local high school.
 
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